Developers for B&W film

[Bingley]

The films I have enjoyed the most, and the ones I am currently committed to using now are: Acros II 100; Legacy Pro 100 (in the freezer); and TMax100. So far, the developers I paired them with are DD-X and Rodinal. I am still unsure of the best development protocols for both DD-X and Rodinal with these films. I think it would take me forever to settle those questions by trial and error.

Hi Dave!

Thanks for your kind words and glad you're enjoying this thread!! In partial response to your question above, I recently (as in last October) started using DDX as one of my go-to developers when I'm too lazy to mix up a batch of Perceptol stock solution. As it turns out, DDX is pretty nice and I'm getting good results with it in both 120 and 35mm. For development times and agitation recommendations, a great starting point is the info/data sheet that Ilford publishes for this developer (the official name is Ilfotec-DDX). The data sheet includes dev times for a number popular bw films, including TMax 100; Alas, Acros II 100 is not among them so you'll need to do some further digging. For agitation, Ilford recommends four inversions initial, and then four inversions every minute counting down. This is the same agitation regimen recommended for Perceptol, and is what I follow when developing in DDX.

• https://www.ilfordphoto.com/wp/wp-content/uploads/2019/08/ILFOTEC-DDX-AUG19.pdf

As for Rodinal, I'm in the dark... haven't used it in years, so I'll be interested to hear what others say.

Here's a photo from a workshop in the Yosemite Valley last October, shot on a Hasselblad 500c/m and Zeiss Distagon 60mm f3.5 with a yellow filter, on TMax 400, and developed in DDX for 8 mins. at 20C:

Black Oak and Cathedral Rocks by Steve Macfarlane, on Flickr

 

[Darthfeeble]

Actually - I think there's a general recommendation against mixing up small amounts from a larger powder source (i.e. using a portion of a pouch of D-76 to mix enough for 1-2 rolls). You would have no way of knowing what proportions of the overall chemistry in the pouch you have in the small amount that you mixed up - your results could vary quite wildly. HC-110 and similar would probably be better - long shelf life and liquid chemistry. Use an oral syringe to measure out the volume you need for your tank.

~S

Thanks for the warning. The more I look into it, the more I think I will just keep sending the film out. Digital has made me too lazy and the chemistry might be a bother to my asthmatic wife.

 

[Steinberg2010]

Thanks for the warning. The more I look into it, the more I think I will just keep sending the film out. Digital has made me too lazy and the chemistry might be a bother to my asthmatic wife.

I would encourage you to look into a community darkroom - I used one in NC and did printmaking there. I found it to be a ton of fun and a nice way to get out of the house...

~S

 

[cjm]

Good stuff as always, @cjm! When you say going on 15 years, is that the same batch of Diafine? I have some in powdered form that I haven't mixed yet. Currently I keep all my developing chemistry in a plastic storage tub, but trying to figure out where I can store two more gallon jugs for Part A and Part B.

Thanks @dourbalistar - I mix a new batch about every three years.

 

[wjlapier]

Thanks for the warning. The more I look into it, the more I think I will just keep sending the film out. Digital has made me too lazy and the chemistry might be a bother to my asthmatic wife.

You could try a small bottle of Cinestill DF96 at 500ml. Good for about 8 rolls they say—maybe more. I just finished my third roll yesterday. Basically, prewash, develop, wash again, then photoflo. Pretty quick and easy. There is a little more to it but you can read about it on their website.

I’ve been using Rodinal at 1+25 for a while. I’ll have to check my notes on time and temp. I’ve been using Rodinal on many different films and don’t really see a huge difference to not use it for a specific film.

 

[telenous]

Does anyone know if the Rodinal recipe has changed the last few years? I've had a small (250g) bottle go bad after a few months. That is not what I remember from >10-15 yrs ago, it was supposed to be indestructible. Come to think of it, a bottle of HC110 I am using now looks less syrupy than in the past. I asked the local shop and they said 'perhaps there's a change due to environmental restrictions'.

 

[Bingley]

Does anyone know if the Rodinal recipe has changed the last few years? I've had a small (250g) bottle go bad after a few months. That is not what I remember from >10-15 yrs ago, it was supposed to be indestructible. Come to think of it, a bottle of HC110 I am using now looks less syrupy than in the past. I asked the local shop and they said 'perhaps there's a change due to environmental restrictions'.

Kodak came out with a ”new” version of HC 110 several years ago; my understanding is that modification was due to difficulties in obtaining some of the chemicals in original HC 110. I have not tried the new version yet. But if it’s at all like Legacy Pro 110, it will be less viscous or syrupy than the original formula. I don’t know about Rodinal. I thought I read somewhere that the formula was modified at some point, but a quick search online suggests instead that, once Agfa’s patent expired, other manufacturers (e.g. Adox) started manufacturing it using the original formula and selling it under a variety of names, e.g. Adonol, Adox Rodinal, etc. I have a bottle of Rodinal that I‘ve not opened in at least 10 years, so I’ll give that a try one of these days and see if it’s still any good.

 

[John Bragg]

My favorite combination of Ilford HP5+ @ ei200 developed in Ilfosol 3, 1:9 dilution @ 20°c for 6 minutes, with 30 second agitation by invertion, to start off, then 2 gentle invertions at 2 minutes and 2 more at 4 minutes.
This shot on a Nikon F100 with af Zoom Nikkor 35-70 f3.3-4.5


Graveyard Geometry by E.J. Bragg, on Flickr

 

[Freakscene]

Does anyone know if the Rodinal recipe has changed the last few years? I've had a small (250g) bottle go bad after a few months. That is not what I remember from >10-15 yrs ago, it was supposed to be indestructible. Come to think of it, a bottle of HC110 I am using now looks less syrupy than in the past. I asked the local shop and they said 'perhaps there's a change due to environmental restrictions'.

Which Rodinal are you using? A lot of its legendary longevity was due to the excellent AGFA packaging (glass and later very airtight high density plastic). The Adox Adonal lasts well in my experience. But it can go off; all developers can.

As @Bingley points out, HC-110 has been reformulated. This was not environmental; Tetenal, who manufactured HC-110, went into bankruptcy, and Kodak needed a new manufacturer. The old formula required a complicated manufacturing process, so it was reformulated. I haven’t tried the new version but from the ingredients (they use sodium sulfite and water instead of ) list the new version is unlikely to last as long as the older version.

Marty

 

[telenous]

Which Rodinal are you using? A lot of its legendary longevity was due to the excellent AGFA packaging (glass and later very airtight high density plastic). The Adox Adonal lasts well in my experience. But it can go off; all developers can.

As @Bingley points out, HC-110 has been reformulated. This was not environmental; Tetenal, who manufactured HC-110, went into bankruptcy, and Kodak needed a new manufacturer. The old formula required a complicated manufacturing process, so it was reformulated. I haven’t tried the new version but from the ingredients (they use sodium sulfite and water instead of ) list the new version is unlikely to last as long as the older version.

Marty

It is now a couple of years I had this happen (i.e. Rodinal go bad). I grabbed a photo from the store I buy chemicals, the label says Rodinal R09, the plastic bottle is non-transparent plastic. Wasn't the bottle semi-transparent when Agfa was around? I could be wrong. The Rodinal I used last had some crystallized sediment near the time it went off. The bottle was not opened for long, certainly less than six months. It was used for medium speed film, which I don't do a lot of.

I've used D76 and Xtol almost exclusively the last ten years and I missed the news about the reformulation of HC110. In the past, the attraction of HC110 was longevity and fast dev. times. But, with longevity gone, I find it quite steeply priced. Are there any signs that it has gone off? Or is it 'sudden death' all over again, like Xtol?

 

[wjlapier]

Kodak came out with a ”new” version of HC 110 several years ago; my understanding is that modification was due to difficulties in obtaining some of the chemicals in original HC 110. I have not tried the new version yet. But if it’s at all like Legacy Pro 110, it will be less viscous or syrupy than the original formula. I don’t know about Rodinal. I thought I read somewhere that the formula was modified at some point, but a quick search online suggests instead that, once Agfa’s patent expired, other manufacturers (e.g. Adox) started manufacturing it using the original formula and selling it under a variety of names, e.g. Adonol, Adox Rodinal, etc. I have a bottle of Rodinal that I‘ve not opened in at least 10 years, so I’ll give that a try one of these days and see if it’s still any good.

I just opened and used successfully a 10+ year old bottle of Rodinal. It’s going fast now. One bottle left from my original purchase of three.

 

[Freakscene]

It is now a couple of years I had this happen (i.e. Rodinal go bad). I grabbed a photo from the store I buy chemicals, the label says Rodinal R09, the plastic bottle is non-transparent plastic. Wasn't the bottle semi-transparent when Agfa was around? I could be wrong. The Rodinal I used last had some crystallized sediment near the time it went off. The bottle was not opened for long, certainly less than six months. It was used for medium speed film, which I don't do a lot of.

I can’t remember who made the R09, but all Rodinal-like products can go off if the storage containers aren’t airtight. That bottle is definitely different from the AGFA ones. You can process a test strip before using it, or switch to something else. The Adonal from Adox seems to last a long time in my experience, but as always, check for yourself.

I've used D76 and Xtol almost exclusively the last ten years and I missed the news about the reformulation of HC110. In the past, the attraction of HC110 was longevity and fast dev. times. But, with longevity gone, I find it quite steeply priced. Are there any signs that it has gone off? Or is it 'sudden death' all over again, like Xtol?

Kodak also reformulated Xtol, and there were problems with the new batches.

I have no idea if the new HC-110 does have a shorter storage life, but the formulation suggests it might. The bottles should have a use-by date, which I always recommend observing unless you have good information or check if any developer still works. The new formulation is a clear thin liquid, much thinner than the old HC-110 syrup, so it is possible that it might go off without showing and colour change.

I still have 5L of the old formulation HC-110, which should see me out since I use 6mL per roll and only use it with old film. The old HC-110 works long after it’s gone a series of strange colours. I got my first 1L bottle in 1994 (expiry date 1987!), three quarters full, from a darkroom that was closing, and used it until 20011. It started yellowish, then went pink then red then deep maroon and finally brown.

Marty

 

[titrisol]

Rodinal was indestructible, especially if it had some sediment/crystals in the bottom which kept the p-aminophenol solution saturated. I rememeber using a 20+yr old bottle at some point.
I bought Adonal in 2015 and it is still going strong
HC110 was reformulated when Alaris took over, and it has been reported that is not the same as the old one and doesnt last as long.

All other developers, it is good practice to make the whole bag and break it into smaller airtight containers. Same works for large liquid bottles (I learnt this with Edwal FG7) that you are not going to use quickly.
Brown bottles work fine filled to the brim, I have several 500ml, 250ml and lately 125ml for Microphen.

 

[The_Film_Fellow]

I really love the look of Ilford FP4 Plus in 35mm rated at 200 developed in DDX for 7 minutes at 68 at a 1+4 dilution. Of love the moodiness it gives me but also the flexibility of the negative I get.

 

[titrisol]

Similar to DDX there is Microphen 1+3
Not bad for Fomapan400

 

[agentlossing]

Rodinal is only bad if it doesn't successfully develop film 🙂

I recommend a test strip if you're worried about it, before giving up on a suspect bottle.

 

[Bingley]

View attachment 4816483

I really love the look of Ilford FP4 Plus in 35mm rated at 200 developed in DDX for 7 minutes at 68 at a 1+4 dilution. Of love the moodiness it gives me but also the flexibility of the negative I get.

Very nice work!! I will have to give this combination a try, since I’ve the film and the developer at home. Beautiful tonality, particularly in the white dress.

 

[markjwyatt]

I can’t remember who made the R09, but all Rodinal-like products can go off if the storage containers aren’t airtight. That bottle is definitely different from the AGFA ones. You can process a test strip before using it, or switch to something else. The Adonal from Adox seems to last a long time in my experience, but as always, check for yourself.
...

Rollei sell R09. I have a bottle. It is over a year old and looks kind of dirty. I heard that unlike ADOX Rodinal, they use a a less pure form of a key chemical. While it was new I used it and it worked fine.

 

[Freakscene]

Rollei sell R09. I have a bottle. It is over a year old and looks kind of dirty. I heard that unlike ADOX Rodinal, they use a a less pure form of a key chemical. While it was new I used it and it worked fine.

Possible but I doubt it. If someone could say which chemical, and what contaminant, I might start to be interested, but the original Agfa product can oxidise too. It reminds me that there was a guy who was all over the internet for a while trying to raise funds to make ‘original’ Rodinal which allegedly was made magical by the use of lithium salts which wre ‘onobtainable’ (except they were readily obtainable from the usual lab suppliers, just expensive). I made a litre of this lithium Rodinal and all that I could see that was different was that I felt happy . . .



Marty

 

[HuubL]

For TMax 400 in 120, I’ve been shooting at box speed and recently developing in Ilfotec DDX, 8 mins. @ 20C:

Purisima Creek Trail by Steve Macfarlane, on Flickr

Incoming tide by Steve Macfarlane, on Flickr

Absolutely wonderful shots! Each and every one of them!!