MassiveDev, Rodinal, HP5+ Confusion

[raduray]

Film rangefinder on the way and I'm studying up on how to develop film. Shooting HP5+ and decided to start with Rodinal. But I'm confused by the Massive Dev chart. It shows the same development time of six minutes for ISO 100 as for ISO 400 at the 1+25 dilution. I had assumed that pulling (ISO 400) would require less time. Pushing to 800 does increase the time to eight minutes.

 

[Slumgullion]

Film rangefinder on the way and I'm studying up on how to develop film. Shooting HP5+ and decided to start with Rodinal. But I'm confused by the Massive Dev chart. It shows the same development time of six minutes for ISO 100 as for ISO 400 at the 1+25 dilution. I had assumed that pulling (ISO 400) would require less time. Pushing to 800 does increase the time to eight minutes.

That is the issue with the Massive Dev Chart...it's user created, so you have to assume that if something doesn't make sense, it's probably "wrong." I'd use the 1:50 time for an EI of 100. 9 minutes makes sense.

 

[titrisol]

HP5 in Rodinal will give you a grainy but nice look
I shot many rolls at 200 and developed at 1+25

 

[Freakscene]

The Massive Development Chart has so many problems who would know where to start fixing it.

Use Ilford’s times:

 

[raduray]

HP5 in Rodinal will give you a grainy but nice look
I shot many rolls at 200 and developed at 1+25

Did you use the 4:45 time for rolls shot at 200?

 

[titrisol]

This was almost 20yrs ago, my notes say 6 min @20C (agitating only once per minute)

 

[Godfrey]

I do HP5 rated at EI 400 in HC-110 diluted 1:49 for 10 min @ 68-72°F. I drop that to 8-8.5 min for EI 200; haven't pushed it at all.

I haven't used Rodinal in 40 years so can't help with that developer...

G

 

[JohnWolf]

Especially when starting out with developing, I suggest sticking with the film maker’s datasheet. They know what they’re doing.
Speaking of Ilford, in your studies have you encountered their film rinsing method? If not, it’s worth a look.

 

[raduray]

Especially when starting out with developing, I suggest sticking with the film maker’s datasheet. They know what they’re doing.
Speaking of Ilford, in your studies have you encountered their film rinsing method? If not, it’s worth a look.

Yes, thank you. This is the rinsing method I'm planning on.

 

[Valkir1987]

The weblog of Alex Luyckx has become my main reference when it comes to films, developers, dilutions and developing times. Even manyfacturer datasheets can have their errors, like RPX-100 and Kentmere-100 on Microphen for example.

But don't worry too much, it's your first film. Developing film is a learning curve 🙂

 

[Alpsman]

My rule of thumb for pushing or pulling is:
For each push stop, multiply the development time by 1.4.
For each pull stop, divide the development time by 1.4.
This gives me acceptable results. At least for me ;-)

Example: for two stops, multiply the development time by 1.4, then multiply the result by 1.4 again, and so on.

 

[Beemermark]

My lord, am I the only one that my go to is the massive development info?

 

[Bill McMannis]

My lord, am I the only one that my go to is the massive development info?

Nope. I rely on MassDev. I pretty much stick with HC-110 and their dilutions and development times haven’t failed me yet. With the exception of FP4+, I stick to the ISO on the box. Maybe if I did more pushing or pulling I would feel differently.

 

[Coldkennels]

It's mostly the unusual film and developer combos that are wildly incorrect on there - or films which have been reformulated (or had the source material changed, in the case of rebranded stuff) since the original film/dev combo was put up on the Massive Dev Chart.

Case in point, here's what the Massive Dev Chart gives for Rollei Retro 400 times in LC29:



But here's the datasheet:



My first roll with this combo was wildly overdeveloped because of the MassiveDev times. And to be honest, even Rollei's recommendation of 6:30 at 1:19 seemed too "hot"; bringing it down to 6:00 gave much better highlight retention.

Weirdly though, if you look at the Rodinal times, they match the datasheet perfectly:




So what happened with the LC29 numbers? Who knows. But if you solely relied on the Massive Dev Chart, you'd think that combination was unusable.

 

[Alpsman]

My lord, am I the only one that my go to is the massive development info?

No.

When I need a new film-developer combination, I first look at the manufacturers' data sheets.
If I don't find what I need there, or even if I do, I check the massive development chart.
Then I search the internet up and down for anything else I can find.

For the first development, I then take an average value and see what happens.
It usually works out.

It also depends on whether you want to develop the film with high or low contrast.

 

[Freakscene]

So what happened with the LC29 numbers? Who knows. But if you solely relied on the Massive Dev Chart, you'd think that combination was unusable.

This is the heart of the problem, and why I won’t use the MDC. So much of it is totally without quality control and you have no idea what you’re going to get.

 

[Beemermark]

In my defense I only use it for the few films and developers I routinely use. And for those films/developers the data is the same as the manufacturer's data sheets. Just easier to use the massive data info on my phone.