Just bought a Zeiss Ikon and I've already broken it.

[Tobias 40:15]

Thanks for your help Leigh (and everyone else).

I'll take it to mainline and see what they have to say. In the meantime, I'd be interested if anyone has a picture of what the shutter should look like.

You've all been very helpful.

 

[Leigh Youdale]

Bessa-ZI shutter

Bessa-ZI shutter

Three photos of the Bessa shutter.
1. Shutter released, frame not wound on.
2. Frame half wound on and shutter about half-cocked.
3. Shutter fully cocked and ready to fire on new frame.

 

[Tobias 40:15]

Thanks Leigh,

You're right, my shutter is in none of those positions. Will you all know of the outcome when I take the camera to Mainline next week.

T

 

[Leigh Youdale]

Thanks Leigh,

You're right, my shutter is in none of those positions. Will you all know of the outcome when I take the camera to Mainline next week.

T

Ring Scott to see what day Hans picks up repair jobs. I've been in there this morning and just missed him. (The flash synchro on my R4A needs attention and I've just put up my IIIf RD for sale).

 

[Tobias 40:15]

Will do that. Would be good to speak with the technician in person.

While I'm waiting (I was considering starting a fresh thread, but will start here...)

Where do members of this board in Australia and specifically Sydney buy their film and do their processing? I'm finding it increasingly difficult to buy 100, and while I could order it online it'd be good to support local film businesses.

I've been getting my films developed/scanned at Charing Cross Photo, and once had some enlargements done at The Lab in Waterloo.

Who do you guys recommend?

 

[Leigh Youdale]

Where do members of this board in Australia and specifically Sydney buy their film and do their processing? I'm finding it increasingly difficult to buy 100, and while I could order it online it'd be good to support local film businesses.

I've been getting my films developed/scanned at Charing Cross Photo, and once had some enlargements done at The Lab in Waterloo.

Who do you guys recommend?

Well, several people buy their supplies in periodic large orders from Freestyle of B&H in USA. Another source that seems to be economic is in the UK <http://www.ag-photographic.co.uk/> but it seems you need to order at least 30-50 rolls to justify the postage charges with these. But the cost per roll can work out at about half most other sources.
I only buy about 10 rolls at a time and get very good overnight service from Les Porter <http://www.lesporter.com.au/> but I guess I pay a premium for the service and for supporting the "local guy". Costs $10-12 AUD per roll.

If you like the idea of using Foma emulsions then Chris Reid at Blanco Negro in Sydney is selling it at around $5 AUD which is very competitive with overseas suppliers. Blanco Negro is a full service professional B&W lab. <http://www.blanconegro.com.au/BlancoNegro/HOME.html>
(I develop and print my own B&W).
For colour processing and printing I often use the local Fuji Camera Shop, but if it's critical then I send it interstate to Horsham Colour in Victoria. They're a professional lab. There are probably labs in Sydney that do it as well, but I haven't had any experience with them.

 

[TWoK]

I saw someone mention setting the Ikon to whatever it's mechanical shutter speed is, that is impossible as it has a fully electronic shutter. Without batteries there is nothing.

 

[uhligfd]

Well, I have always heard that these leaf shutters are extremely sensitive to being touched. Fingers OFF!

And you got the end of the film to push through the closed shutter blades, wow ...... so maybe you just trashed the shutter. Worst case scenario, I hope.

 

[morback]

Hi,

I'm sorry for your issue. I can be of no help for that but I cannot help but be appalled at your film loading technique 😉 !

Quick tip: sometimes it's easier to insert the leader first and then pull the canister over and lock it in place with the rewind crank (put your thumb on the inserted film leader in the right spool to keep it in place). This avoids the pulling of the film across the shutter area (which is what it seems you did to be able to jam the film in the shutter...) .It also keeps your fingers off the shutter...

I hope this helps avoid a repeat. Good luck with this great camera!.
m.

p.s: this is no leaf shutter camera btw...I wish it was! (with a fixed 50mm Sonnar on it...)

 

[monopix]

The most likely thing that has happened is that, because the shutter didn't initially complete it's travel, the wind lock hasn't been reset so you can't wind on the film. The shutter is uncocked so pressing the shutter release does nothing. You need to manually release the wind lock.

Here's how you do it.

Remove the base plate of the camera by first removing the three screws that can be found around the film rewind knob (lift the lever and you'll see the screws underneath, you need to rotate the knob to get at each screw in turn).

Now remove the other two screws that hold on the base plate.

You'll now see this.

The lever marked red needs to be pulled slightly to the left (as looking at it here). Just enough so that the switch (marked green) is pushed in. If you pull the lever too far, the lever will go past the switch and will stay in that position and the shutter won't fire.

With the lever pulled out a bit, the wind lock will be released and you can then re-cock the shutter. Once you've done that and then fired the shutter, everything should then get back into sync and will start to work again.

PM me if you need more info.

 

[Tobias 40:15]

@ uhligfd - It didn't push through a closed shutter. The leader was resting gently against the closed shutter, I fired a shot and the shutter then couldn't close because the leader 'fell' into the opening shutter and propped it open preventing it from closing.

@ morback - You're right to be appalled by my technique. I am too. I wanted to see which way the spool turned to see how to thread the leader in. That was why I fired the camera, and with 20:20 hindsight, having a film sitting there was pretty dumb. As with most things in life, your mistakes teach you more than when you get it right.

@ monopix - Thanks for the detailed instructions. I'm going let a professional look at it now before I break anything else, but 'next time' I may give it a try myself.

 

[italy74]

Monopix,
just in case you would ever write an operating manual on how to service the Zeiss Ikon, I'd get it ! I remember you have already posted other nice repair actions here...

 

[monopix]

Monopix,
just in case you would ever write an operating manual on how to service the Zeiss Ikon, I'd get it ! I remember you have already posted other nice repair actions here...

Thanks for the vote of confidence, 🙂 but I don't see it happening any time soon. 🙁

 

[Tobias 40:15]

Well the camera is back and working again. The guys at Mainline were very helpful and it only cost me $40, so I'm very happy. As several people suggested, the mechanism was jammed and it was resolved using what sounds like the technique described by monopix.

Apparently it's not uncommon for first time users of Ikons and Bessas to do this. Something to do with operating the shutter while the rewind release button is pushed in, and apparently unlikely to have been caused by the film being caught in the shutter.

Now to take some pictures...

 

[skelk]

Just read through this thread. My ZI does the same thing every so often whilst loading a film - i.e. it gets stuck in this sort of "half-way house" between released and cocked, so the winder arm won't move but the shutter won't release. Also the rewind release button on the base is slack (since the previous film has just been rewound and removed). This sounds much like your problem.

What I have found works every time is to manually shift the toothed base of the film spindle a bit (I think clockwise) - probably only a quarter turn or so. Then I'm able to wind on normally using the lever, the rewind-release button pops back out, the shutter cocks and away you go.

I mention this now (although it may seem too late) because mine does this most times I change films, so you may find it happens again! I know the first time this happened to me I thought it had broken, but I guess it's just a "feature". I don't think twice about it now.

All the best,
Simon

 

[TWoK]

Just read through this thread. My ZI does the same thing every so often whilst loading a film - i.e. it gets stuck in this sort of "half-way house" between released and cocked, so the winder arm won't move but the shutter won't release. Also the rewind release button on the base is slack (since the previous film has just been rewound and removed). This sounds much like your problem.

What I have found works every time is to manually shift the toothed base of the film spindle a bit (I think clockwise) - probably only a quarter turn or so. Then I'm able to wind on normally using the lever, the rewind-release button pops back out, the shutter cocks and away you go.

I mention this now (although it may seem too late) because mine does this most times I change films, so you may find it happens again! I know the first time this happened to me I thought it had broken, but I guess it's just a "feature". I don't think twice about it now.

All the best,
Simon

Mine does the exact same thing, is this something I should send it into service for?

 

[skelk]

TWoK - I wouldn't have thought so. If something else fails properly on mine and so repair is required I might mention it so they can take a look at it at the same time, but in the mean time I can live with it.

 

[SurfTorpedo]

The most likely thing that has happened is that, because the shutter didn't initially complete it's travel, the wind lock hasn't been reset so you can't wind on the film. The shutter is uncocked so pressing the shutter release does nothing. You need to manually release the wind lock.

Here's how you do it.

Remove the base plate of the camera by first removing the three screws that can be found around the film rewind knob (lift the lever and you'll see the screws underneath, you need to rotate the knob to get at each screw in turn).

Now remove the other two screws that hold on the base plate.

You'll now see this.

The lever marked red needs to be pulled slightly to the left (as looking at it here). Just enough so that the switch (marked green) is pushed in. If you pull the lever too far, the lever will go past the switch and will stay in that position and the shutter won't fire.

With the lever pulled out a bit, the wind lock will be released and you can then re-cock the shutter. Once you've done that and then fired the shutter, everything should then get back into sync and will start to work again.

PM me if you need more info.

@monopix, I know it's been 15 years since you've posted this, but I'm hoping you can still help. I'm running into this same issue and I'm actually stuck at being able to get the baseplate off. I've taken the three screw from under the rewind knob out, and the two flat head screws (one in the middle and one by the tripod mount). The baseplate seems to still be secured though so I wanted to confirm. I can't seem to find any information online about disassembling the baseplate from this camera either. Any ideas?

 

[SurfTorpedo]

good lord. I figured it out. the base plate was just stuck with some gunk. eventually got it off. i got it! did it kind of blind but the instructions you gave were pretty simple so i knew it was something right in front of me. in case anyone wants a 2025 version, i snapped a pic and drew arrows to match monopix's instructions.

my own description of it is to use small tweezers and pull on the lever to make it press the black switch in to the white socket. while depressed, advance the lever to recock the shutter. this button seems to unlock the advance lock.

 

[monopix]

@monopix, I know it's been 15 years since you've posted this, but I'm hoping you can still help. I'm running into this same issue and I'm actually stuck at being able to get the baseplate off. I've taken the three screw from under the rewind knob out, and the two flat head screws (one in the middle and one by the tripod mount). The baseplate seems to still be secured though so I wanted to confirm. I can't seem to find any information online about disassembling the baseplate from this camera either. Any ideas?

The plate is probably just stuck. Try gripping it with a latex glove or something similar.

Edit: Ahh! See you got it off. Thanks for the picture. Mine seems to have disappeared.