50mm and Fast... Need Help...

[DRabbit]

I already own the Zeiss 50mm Planar f/2. Love it. But I'd like something faster. I have $1000-$1300 to spend on a special 40th birthday gift for me.

I bought the Voigtlander 50mm f/1.1 which arrived yesterday. Testing it last night. Then again today. A lot. It's back-focusing. I thought maybe my M8 needs calibrating (at the suggestion of another photographer), but it's back-focusing even worse at f/2 and I don't have that problem at all with my Planar wide open.

So doing more research, it seems I wasn't the only person with this experience.

The lens itself was also bigger and heavier than I anticipated.

So I thought I'll return it and maybe buy the Zeiss Sonnar f/1.5 since I've been so happy with Zeiss glass. But I read there is a focus shift with that one too.

Can anyone tell me more about their experience with the Sonnar?

Also, is there a lens I should consider that I haven't thought about in my price range? I'm not adverse to buying used. My limitation is purely price range at this point. The bokeh on the Voigtlander 40mm f/1.4 bugs me (otherwise I'd scoop it up).

Thanks for listening...

 

[Uwe_Nds]

Get a Nokton 50/1.5 - if it's a good copy, you will be more than satisfied.

Cheers,
Uwe

 

[mfogiel]

I think you should try the Summilux 50 pre ASPH. It is a great all round lens with a rendering that is a mixture of a Sonnar and Summicron, and it has no focus shift. It is also much more indicated for portraiture than the Planar, which is simply mercilessly sharp. I would recommend the last version with the built in hood and close range down to 0.7m. The C Sonnar wide open is a wonderful low contrast portrait lens, but as you stop it down, it has a strong focus shift, so it is not indicated as a universal fast lens.

 

[Debusti Paolo]

nokton 50 /1,5 i think you'd buy!!!!!!!!!!

 

[peter_n]

I think you should try the Summilux 50 pre ASPH. It is a great all round lens with a rendering that is a mixture of a Sonnar and Summicron, and it has no focus shift... I would recommend the last version with the built in hood and close range down to 0.7m...

A strong +1. It's a great lens. The other simple distinguishing feature of the last pre-ASPH version is that it takes 46mm filters, the earlier versions take 43mm filters.

 

[ferider]

I recommend the pre-asph Summilux as well ... I do prefer the E43 version though since it's smaller, has longer throw (good for a fast 50, IMO), and more robust.

 

[tritiated]

I like the canon 50 1.4, but it's old with long throw and cheap..
perhaps not birthday type thing..
Although focussing has never been a problem at 1.4 for me.

Your website and work are really good by the way

 

[Sonnar Brian]

There are SO many 50s for LTM, you have an 80 year selection available.

What qualities in a lens do you want? If it is a desire for cutting-sharp, high-contrast, highly-corrected optics then the Modern Sonnar is not for you.

Can you list the qualities that you desire?

 

[Thardy]

Would be interesting to see the photos in question.

 

[Biggles]

Chalk up another enthusiastic vote for a used early Summilux. Mine's a 1964 Version 2, and I adore its character.

This was probably shot at f/4 or f/5.6-ish:

I especially like this optic's bokeh; it just quietly whooshes out. Look at the mullions: No doubling, no echo... just relative loss of contrast and gentle diffusion.

 

[DRabbit]

Here's two that show the back-focusing Thardy (100% crops). Believe me, I'm not a "pixel-peeper" in general... and though I haven't worked with a lens this fast before (f/1.4 is the fastest I've owned), I just don't think it should be this frustrating.

Shot at f/2. Focus was on the back edge of the basket. The ground behind it is nice and sharp, but the basket is not. I shoot at f/2 a lot with the Planar, so I have to assume it's not me.

Shot wide open. I took a whole slew of photos in this situation, always focusing on his left hand (the one holding the chords). I took at least 30 shots, and not a single one showed good focus where I was aiming. You can see here that the focus is on his sleeve behind the guitar neck though I was focusing on the ring on his finger.

--
Thanks so much for the replies everyone.
I thought about the Summilux, but isn't it out of my price range? I looked on ebay last night and I did not see any going for less than $2000. Was I looking at the wrong lens? I'd love to have my first official Leica lens for my birthday if I can get one for the right price! 🙂

I thought the Sonnar and I might be a good match only because I love a "vintage" kind of look. I read some reviews of the lens and it seemed in my price range and I've always been exceedingly happy with Zeiss glass.

My only experience with LTM lenses is with the non-coupled 15mm Voigtlander. Does the 50mm f/1.5 use the same adaptor? This would be the most painless solution since I wouldn't have to do a refund, just and exchange and partial refund.

I love the idea of the Summilux though.

And Tritiated - Thanks for the nice compliment!

 

[Biggles]

Last time I looked, three years ago, the very early 50mm Summiluxes with 43mm filter threads, in pedestrian chrome, were trading in the $750 to $1000 US range.

 

[peter_n]

I thought about the Summilux, but isn't it out of my price range? I looked on ebay last night and I did not see any going for less than $2000. Was I looking at the wrong lens?

Maybe. Try:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=150402797134

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=120514850821

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=130357146787

 

[jmkelly]

Amy: You should be able to get a 1st version E43 Summilux for less than $2000. It will be chrome. I have one, as well as a bunch of 50/1.5 Sonnars and clones, including the modern ZM Sonnar C. I use them for different things. I can honestly say I have missed more shots from trying to focus in the dark than from any inherent focus shift on any of my fast lenses.

I also have the Nokton 1.1 and my example on my bodies does not shift anywhere near what you showed in the examples above. I mostly shoot mine on the R-D1. Here is a photo of my daughter that gives an idea of the results I get with the Nokton:

f1.1 @ iso400; focus was on her right eye. There is the possibility that CV has had some QC issues with this lens, but I have heard too many stories of Leica digital M's back focusing with certain lenses but not others for me to think the lens is at fault. Still if you like the Nokton 1.1 you could have your lens adjusted to focus properly on your M8, rather than messing with your M8.

For comparison, here is a shot with teh ZM Sonnar C on the R-D1:

f1.5 @ iso800; focus on right eye/line of nose. I bought this lens new and did not specify that it have any special adjustments, therefore it should be optimized for f2.8.

Finally, here's a couple of shots with an early (1958) 50mm Summilux. THe first is on the R-D1, f1.4 @ iso400, focus on right eye. The shot does not do justice to the OOF rendring of this lens, hence the second image, which was shot with an M3 on Kodak HD4 @ f1.4 or f2; focus was on the stem of the nearest flower:

Your mileage may vary.

 

[ampguy]

If the 1m close focusing distance is OK, I'd go for a v2 E43 Summilux. I sure wish I still had mine 😉 If it hasn't been cleaned up in many years, you might need to budget for that. You can easily get filters, hoods, and step-up rings in 43mm from Heavystar, B+W, and CV. The Leica parts might fit the 'lux, but not anything else, weird.

 

[ferider]

Sorry, cann't help you Ted, not with this one 😉

I shot this yesterday with my late 60s Summilux v2

Really great mixture of sharpness and OOF performance that lens. Mandler at his best.

Roland.

 

[DRabbit]

Thanks again everyone.

As much as I want some real Leica glass in my arsenal, I think for this time around I'm going to get the Nokton 50/1.5. It's just easier to do the exchange than to return and then try to search and find the Summilux. For the money, I'm also going to try the 40/1.4. I know the bokeh can be harshish, but I think I may like the look of the single-coated version, especially on my film camera. I also like the focal length because sometimes 35 feels too wide and 50 seems to close... so 40 might be just right for me.

We'll see!

Thanks so much for the feedback and input... I'll report back when I have the two new lenses in my hands.

 

[Krosya]

I'd just get a CV 50/1.5 - sharp, only $400 or so and draws very nice.

 

[Krosya]

PS. Just wanted to add that if you like a Sonnar look - Nikkor 5cm 1.4 is a great lens and can be made to focus to .7m. here is a pic from mine:

 

[Tom A]

Before you consider changing the lens - check the camera's focus. Borrow some fast lenses (1.4's and 1.5's) and do another test. At f1-f1.1 stresses the focussing on any camera - particularly at closest distance.
Make a trip into the Big City and go to Photovillage and ask them for assistance with testing various lenses.I have used several 50f1.1's and had no problem with the back focus - and local M8 owners have tried mine on their cameras with no problems.
The M8 occasionally requires a "tweak" for use with f1-f1,1 lenses.
The Nokton 50f1.5 is a better lens than the Summilux pre-asph - but it is a modern lens design and shows it (sharp, contrasty etc). The ZM Sonnar 50f1.5 has more of a classic look it. It has become my favorite "medium speed" 50 over the last couple of years.