AFter using my M8 for two weeks . . .

[DWeston]

The point I was trying to make was that someone was complaining about if the M8 had MF menu like the Nikons do, that would be a deal breaker for using the camera and those prefer the dot coding that Leica has implemented. I was just saying that I like the Nikon system as it allows simple use of MF lenses if you want to use them. I use MF lenses even with the D300 when I feel they are appropriate to use, specifically if I do not intend to change focal lengths often, i.e. macro etc. I do not find it particularly an issue. On the M8 if it had or did implement such a menu system, as an adjunct to the coding, then users could use non Leica lenses without paying for after market mounts etc. As a user of Zeiss and CV glass in addition to Leica I would find this a boon. I can understand for those who have gone with after market adapters or lens coding that they are happy with that. Guess different strokes for different folks. Also, If you are going to be changing focal lengths frequently, like after every couple of frames, then maybe a RF is not the best tool for the job that is all. Nothing against RFs just some members I have both,seem to have issues with their equipment when it seems obvioust that maybe it isn't the right kind of tool to use, either for them in general for that task at hand. "bringing a knife to a gun fight was an old American phrase from "The Untouchables" and seemed appropriate for the topic....🙂

 

[Ben Z]

Well, I've been using my M8 for almost 6 months, but...

(1) 6 bit coding is restrictive:
Let's face it, there are plenty of lenses from other brands we use.
There should be a menu option for us to input the focal length, just like the D200.
Perhaps a memory setting of 4-5 lens, so we can choose and set the lens name into the exif. I suppose most RF users have 4-5 lenses at least, a lens name input would be great!

I self-coded all my wide-angle lenses (permanently, milled wells for the black codes and painted them in) including a few screw-mount adaptors. Anything longer than 35mm doesn't need cyan correcting so I didn't and wouldn't bother with coding them. Once-and-for-all coding those lenses is a lot easier than changing a menu each time. Still, it couldn't hurt to have such a menu for those people who want it.

(2) My Ricoh GR Digital has an interval timer, I would love to have one on my M8.
This is really useful. I hang the GRD on my neck, set the interval timer to take one shot every 15 seconds, then I walk into the subway, taking photos by itself. Ultra stealth function!

Interesting idea, but I admit I would never use it.

(3) An external ISO button?
I have never used the 'protect' button. But I change the ISO very often.
Do you use the 'protect' button?
Perhaps Leica could let us customise a button to our choice?

I've never used the protect button. I also never change the ISO from 160. I found that "push processing" in ACR produces less noise. But since digital allows for ISO to be an adjustable exposure parameter, I agree it should be readily accessible--as long as it isn't also readily accidentally disturbable!

(4) The "film counter" is not backlit.
Couldn't Leica make a backlit LCD counter?
Beside, I wish M8 has a dial like the R-D1. Could you not admit the analog dial on the R-D1 is the most lovely display I have seen on a camera.

I've never found myself in complete darkness and needing to know how many shots I have left. I agree the analog dial display on the RD1 looks pleasing, but honestly I think digital guages are less prone to shock damage. Also the shot counter on the RD1 is very approximate due to not having enough markings.

(5) When is Leica fixing the white-balance?
This is not a critical issue, I can shoot DNG all the time, but Leica should still fix the white-balance.

I'm beginning to doubt they will ever fix it. Even with DNG it should work better than it does. No AWB is perfect, but the M8's is psychedelic 😱 Sure I can (and do) use manual, in fact I have a Minolta Color Meter and can set Kelvin temp if I want. But it's a head-hanging shame on such an expensive camera that AWB is basically unrealiable in the extreme.

(6) I am waiting for SDHC support.

Being of the don't-put-all-your-eggs-in-one-basket philosophy, and given the M8's slow motor drive, plain old 2GB SD cards work fine for me.

(7) Leica Digital Capture does not work in Vista.

Never used or thought about using Digital Capture. And I don't have Vista. If I move from XP it'll be to a Mac.

(8) I don't care about the IR issue.
I don't what the big fuss was about with the IR issues. I slapped a filter and use the camera. Everything worked out fine. Just go and buy a filter. This IR issue had me scared from buying the M8 from almost a year. In hindsight, this was really a minor thing.

Well, I had to buy about a dozen filters (including some as spares because they're essential, not like a UV I could do without if it got scratched or broken). Then I had to code all my wide-angle lenses. Aside from that, now it's not much of an issue, I agree. It's still irritating in that excellent digital cameras from other makers don't have that problem...but they don't offer me the ergonomics of the M8, so I accept the issue and live with it.

(9) Last, I really enjoyed using the M8.
Do put out an M9 yet. Leica must take its time. The M8 is excellent already.
The simply DNG workflow into Capture One is already leathal enough.

I personally don't care if or when Leica brings out an M9, as the M8 does what I need from it. And the lesson I learned from the M8 is that I will wait at least a year after any future model's introduction before buying one.

 

[willie_901]

I have some Nikon manual focus lenses which do not have the cpu interface. Trust me you do not want to be going thru menus and adding/changing focal lengths.

Not that it matters, but there is a fast simple way to tell the D200/300 what non-cpu lens is attached using the special function button (lower button next to the lens) and the front/rear thumb wheels. It's covered in the manual (f4 in the Custom Setting Menu).

It takes me about 10 sec. to manually tell my D200 what non-cpu lens is in use. This is ten sec. longer than it takes when you change a coded lens on the M8.

 

[pizzahut88]

Not that it matters, but there is a fast simple way to tell the D200/300 what non-cpu lens is attached using the special function button (lower button next to the lens) and the front/rear thumb wheels. It's covered in the manual (f4 in the Custom Setting Menu).

It takes me about 10 sec. to manually tell my D200 what non-cpu lens is in use. This is ten sec. longer than it takes when you change a coded lens on the M8.

Ah, I see that you have the Zeiss Ikon!
Lovely RF it is.

I had it for about 1/2 year.
The finder was such a relief.
I kind of miss it.

 

[usayit]

(1) 6 bit coding is restrictive:
(3) An external ISO button?
(5) When is Leica fixing the white-balance?

The above also applies to me.. I would change #3 to an external button to a set of 5 or so user settable profiles instead.

* IR is not too bad.. somewhat annoying.
* Improve the tactile feeling of the covering. It is way to slippery.
* Stiffer optional grip. It flexes which is bothersome.
* When set in timer mode, the timer starts when the shutter is depressed 1/2 way. It should be started when fully depressed like most cameras.
* Improved battery design. "Jumps" out when released (dropped mine). Longer life.
* Quiet shutter. By comparison the my Epson is quiet and the M6 is extremely quiet
* Better low-light performance. (no flames please).

Other than that... I too am enjoying the M8 a lot. The images I've created are very pleasing. Shooting with the M8 and R-D1 in my bag is a joy. It is easy to nit pick the issues with the camera (I do all the time) and I'm still in the boat that the R-D1 is by far the better bang for the buck camera. Epson did a wonderful and well though out job... I only wish the R-D2 was in the works. Leica also did a wonderful job considering the factors stacked against them steaming from ~not~ quickly coming up to speed in the digital age.

As for the M9, I've never really been in the race for the latest and greatest. In fact, the M8 is the first camera I have ever bought that would be considered latest and greatest....

Face it... you don't buy Leica for bang/buck factor.

 

[Peter Klein]

The menu for uncoded lenses could be simplicity itself. It could be in the "Set" menu. In addition, they could add a On+UV-IR/Manual option. When enabled, the camera looks for a lens code whenever lenses are changed. If it finds a code, it uses it. If it doesn't, it pops up the lens menu. You use the arrow keys or dial to select your lens (or the nearest equivalent). Press Set, and you're done.

Another possibility would be to use the position of the frame selector lever to narrow down the number of choices.

--Peter

 

[Olsen]

(1) 6 bit coding is restrictive:


(2) My Ricoh GR Digital has an interval timer, I would love to have one on my M8.

(3) An external ISO button?
I have never used the 'protect' button. But I change the ISO very often.
Do you use the 'protect' button?
Perhaps Leica could let us customise a button to our choice?

(4) The "film counter" is not backlit.
Couldn't Leica make a backlit LCD counter?
(5) When is Leica fixing the white-balance?

(6) I am waiting for SDHC support.

(7) Leica Digital Capture does not work in Vista.

(8) I don't care about the IR issue.

(9) Last, I really enjoyed using the M8.
Don't put out an M9 yet. Leica must take its time. The M8 is excellent already.
The simply DNG workflow into Capture One is already leathal enough.

1)
Don't expect Leica to make it even more profitable for their competitors to 'profit' from the introduction of the M8. With this, it is obvious that Cosina and Carl Zeiss are laughing all the way to the bank.

2)
Don't fall asleep on the subway! It is as easy as that.

3)
I have got used to setting the ISO in this 'set' menu. A dedicated 'button' will make the camera even more expensive. Don't do that!

4)
A back lit 'film' counter would pull more power. I would rather prefer a more advanced counter in the menu - in addition to the small - and just excellent, counter already there.

5)
With the latest up dates the WB has been greatly improved. It fails sometimes, but not close to as often as before - and more like what you can expect from other cameras regarding WB reliability. but then I shoot RAW only. The jpg's out of the M8 is awful.

6)
I don't use larger cards than 8 GB, but as far as I know this has been adressed with the latest up dates.

7)
No, neither of the programs that came with the camera can be used with Vista. You have to load down Capture One 4. I haven't got used to it - oh, not a totally new user interface!

8)
- Neither do I. I have my three Leica lenses all equipped with IR/UV filters, but use them only when my brother-in-law sprawls around in his - supposedly, black blazer.

9)
I don't want to see a M9 on the market before Leica can deliver considderably lower noice on 1250, somewhat higher pixel count, say, 16 mill. pixels and a faster camera computer that handles both RAW files and jpg's of high quality. That is enough for me. No full frame is neccessary. The 1,33 crop factor is easy to live with.

 

[jaapv]

I would like to have a menu option to save the full 16 bit image instead of the compressed 8 bit image. It should be my choice, recognizing the write will take twice as long.

Not that you would see significant difference in the final image. Comparing my DMR and M8 files proves that.

 

[jaapv]

* Improve the tactile feeling of the covering. It is way to slippery.

Cameraleather!

* Quiet shutter. By comparison the my Epson is quiet and the M6 is extremely quiet

upgrade or M8-2

* Better low-light performance. (no flames please).

exposing for the shadows brings the M8 close to the 5D...

Other than that... I too am enjoying the M8 a lot. The images I've created are very pleasing. Shooting with the M8 and R-D1 in my bag is a joy. It is easy to nit pick the issues with the camera (I do all the time) and I'm still in the boat that the R-D1 is by far the better bang for the buck camera. Epson did a wonderful and well though out job... I only wish the R-D2 was in the works. Leica also did a wonderful job considering the factors stacked against them steaming from ~not~ quickly coming up to speed in the digital age.

As for the M9, I've never really been in the race for the latest and greatest. In fact, the M8 is the first camera I have ever bought that would be considered latest and greatest....

Face it... you don't buy Leica for bang/buck factor.

And AWB is about the best around after the firmware change.

 

[Dingo]

About the AWB issue, I just ignore it by setting it to daylight and correct the colors later by software if necessary, after all you did the same with films, right ?

 

[cuss]

Do you realize you are replying to a message of one year ago?

😀

 

[jaapv]

You are right, which explains the shift in AWB discussion. It is a problem with these pesky polls; each time someone votes on them they get bumped.

 

[Gabriel M.A.]

(1) 6 bit coding is restrictive:
Let's face it, there are plenty of lenses from other brands we use.
There should be a menu option for us to input the focal length

I completely agree; I've been complaining about this since day one. This, and the lack of option for saving the file in 16-bit mode rather than 8-bit mode.

At least they listened to my gripe of the immediate shutter recocking.

(2) My Ricoh GR Digital has an interval timer, I would love to have one on my M8.

Hmm, I don't think most cameras have this.

(3) An external ISO button?
I have never used the 'protect' button. But I change the ISO very often.
Do you use the 'protect' button?
Perhaps Leica could let us customise a button to our choice?

They dropped the ball on this one too; there ought to be a physical ISO selector.

(4) The "film counter" is not backlit.
Couldn't Leica make a backlit LCD counter?
Beside, I wish M8 has a dial like the R-D1. Could you not admit the analog dial on the R-D1 is the most lovely display you have seen on a camera. Turn on the R-D1 and watch all the needles swing into place.

That in itself is now a matter of taste, imo. Having a backlit LCD counter would require a separate button, or at the very least a new option in the menu for this feature.

(5) When is Leica fixing the white-balance?

Already fixed; don't you have firmware version 2.002?

(6) I am waiting for SDHC support.

I guess that answers my previous question: no, you don't have the latest firmware version.

(7) Leica Digital Capture does not work in Vista.

If this is true (I've never used it), they ought to fix it.

(8) I don't care about the IR issue.
I don't know what the big fuss was all about with the IR issues.

Hate of Leica by the typical bashers exacerbated the perceived problem.

(9) The simply DNG workflow into Capture One is already leathal enough.

Lightroom 2.0 is invaluable for mass-processing of my M8 DNG files; if I need to tweak at super strength, I then edit in CS3 (with ACR).

Capture One is quirky and clumsy, imo. I stopped using it with version 3.6; I'll upgrade to version 4 (you can do this with your current license that comes with your M8) and see if they've cleaned up their act.

 

[Gabriel M.A.]

Do you realize you are replying to a message of one year ago?

😀

D'oh. I hate the automatic bumping of poll threads when there is no actual discussion. :bang::bang:

 

[jag157]

SDHA Support ...I believe this was fixed 2 firmware upgrades ago. I am happily using 4Gb SDHC cards.

White Balance ...also suspect that a firmware upgrade may be your answer. This was an issue untils a upgrade 3 back addressed it . Mind you i'm saying that auto WB works pretty well in .DNG; donm't shoot JPEG on M8.

Also enjoy C1 workflow and results. Also DNG Profile Editor for Lightroom works well.

Have fun.