ebolton
Number 7614
Maybe true at a few of the private ones, but not generally true. The US does have excellent protection of speech.
Olsen
Well-known
Roger,
Your link leads to a guy who points to the only workable solution of the 'financial crisis' in USA: Nationalize the insolvent banks! I agree with this!
Several economists (what an uneducated flock!) refer to this at 'the Swedish Solution'. This is not correct; it was the Norwegian Solution!
First; a few of Sweden's largest banks were about to go bankrupt in the early 90'. Carl Bildt (this guy: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carl_Bildt ) then Swedish prime minister (conservative), saved the shareholders of several of the largest banks when they went insolvent. He did this by just giving the banks money. By this, he saved the fortunes of mighty people like the Wallenbergs (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wallenberg_family ), among the richest in the world. The bill was sent to the Swedish tax payers. Sweden still got a national debt of 1,350 billion SEK that the Swedish taxpayers must entertain.
In Norway, at the time, the crisis was just as bad. Our three largest banks and the largest insurance company were all insolvant. Our Social Democrat prime minster Gro Harlem Bruntland (this woman: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gro_Harlem_Brundtland ) met the shareholder's of these institutions on a Friday and asked if they had more money to put into the banks. They should give her an answer the following Monday. They, hoping for - what we then called 'A swedish Solution' - a bail out of the shareholders (give money to the banks, and send the bill to the tax payers).
She decided to nationalise the three largest banks and our largest insurance company. The shareholders lost all their money and the top brass of all the banks were sacked. 'Everybody' were in shock. Even Washington protested. These institutions have later been partly privatized with a huge profit on the hand of the Norwegian tax payers.
Then Carl Bildt lost the following election, right in the middle of the crisis. The social democrat Göran Persson, this fellow: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/G%C3%B6ran_Persson took over. A few of the Swedish financial institutions were still struggling and Goran Persson adopted the same tactics as his socialist Norwegian prime minister Gro Harlem Bruntland in neighboring Norway: Then the rest of the struggling Swedish banks were then nationalized. Also they have later been privatized.
Here in Scaninavia, debates on TV, in newspapers etc. we have later refered to how the crisis were tackled by calling what USA now seems to do: Give money to the banks, and by this saving the shareholders & and management as 'The Swedish Solution', while nationalizing the banks were called 'the Norwegian Solution'. Some illiterate, one-language-only ecomomist might have picked up on this discussion, but not fathomed what the two really ment.
Your link leads to a guy who points to the only workable solution of the 'financial crisis' in USA: Nationalize the insolvent banks! I agree with this!
Several economists (what an uneducated flock!) refer to this at 'the Swedish Solution'. This is not correct; it was the Norwegian Solution!
First; a few of Sweden's largest banks were about to go bankrupt in the early 90'. Carl Bildt (this guy: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carl_Bildt ) then Swedish prime minister (conservative), saved the shareholders of several of the largest banks when they went insolvent. He did this by just giving the banks money. By this, he saved the fortunes of mighty people like the Wallenbergs (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wallenberg_family ), among the richest in the world. The bill was sent to the Swedish tax payers. Sweden still got a national debt of 1,350 billion SEK that the Swedish taxpayers must entertain.
In Norway, at the time, the crisis was just as bad. Our three largest banks and the largest insurance company were all insolvant. Our Social Democrat prime minster Gro Harlem Bruntland (this woman: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gro_Harlem_Brundtland ) met the shareholder's of these institutions on a Friday and asked if they had more money to put into the banks. They should give her an answer the following Monday. They, hoping for - what we then called 'A swedish Solution' - a bail out of the shareholders (give money to the banks, and send the bill to the tax payers).
She decided to nationalise the three largest banks and our largest insurance company. The shareholders lost all their money and the top brass of all the banks were sacked. 'Everybody' were in shock. Even Washington protested. These institutions have later been partly privatized with a huge profit on the hand of the Norwegian tax payers.
Then Carl Bildt lost the following election, right in the middle of the crisis. The social democrat Göran Persson, this fellow: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/G%C3%B6ran_Persson took over. A few of the Swedish financial institutions were still struggling and Goran Persson adopted the same tactics as his socialist Norwegian prime minister Gro Harlem Bruntland in neighboring Norway: Then the rest of the struggling Swedish banks were then nationalized. Also they have later been privatized.
Here in Scaninavia, debates on TV, in newspapers etc. we have later refered to how the crisis were tackled by calling what USA now seems to do: Give money to the banks, and by this saving the shareholders & and management as 'The Swedish Solution', while nationalizing the banks were called 'the Norwegian Solution'. Some illiterate, one-language-only ecomomist might have picked up on this discussion, but not fathomed what the two really ment.
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Many people may think it, but its certainly surprising for someone like Joschka Fischer to actually say it:
"Modern capitalism is based on a global ponzi scheme" - former German foreign minister and vice-chancellor Joschka Fischer.
"Modern capitalism is based on a global ponzi scheme" - former German foreign minister and vice-chancellor Joschka Fischer.
calexg
Established
I will never buy an American-made car. I don't think I'll need a vehicle for another 10 years, if EVER! I've lived without one for years--why waste my money and destroy the environment? I'll walk, bike, or take public transit thank you very much.
gb hill
Veteran
I haven't bothered to read through the whole thread but let the timing belt break on your Nissan and it's toast. Jap cars are crap. I'll put my 73 Ford pickup up against your Toyota and I'll out haul, out pull you any day of the week. I drive an 85 Ford to work 50 miles every day. It has over 200,000
on it and doesn't smoke a bit. My son keeps buying Honda's & they blow up. I keep telling him if he wan't s a hot rod get a Chevy 350 & build the hell out of it. I'll take my Bonneville over any Japan made crap anyday.
on it and doesn't smoke a bit. My son keeps buying Honda's & they blow up. I keep telling him if he wan't s a hot rod get a Chevy 350 & build the hell out of it. I'll take my Bonneville over any Japan made crap anyday.
gb hill
Veteran
Rush Limbaugh is a true patroit. Obama is taking this country into Socialism. Obama is going to send our troops into Afghanistan. Where is the cries! We can't win in Afghanistan. He is even talking about going into Pakistan. He is a loon. America needs to get off the Obama koolaid.
ebolton
Number 7614
Rush Limbaugh is as far from a patriot as it gets. If you are worried the U.S. is going socialist, you are truly paranoid.
And actually, a little socialism might not be such a bad thing. Unfettered capitalism has brought us to the brink of depression now, as it did in the 1920's.
And actually, a little socialism might not be such a bad thing. Unfettered capitalism has brought us to the brink of depression now, as it did in the 1920's.
gb hill
Veteran
I don't mind a bit of Socialism either. Join the Commie Camera group on flickr & burn a roll for the good ol USSR on May 1.
calexg
Established
When Rush farts, Republicans sniff in delight. Palin/Limbaugh 2012 bahahaha!
Olsen
Well-known
Olsen
Well-known
I don't mind a bit of Socialism either. Join the Commie Camera group on flickr & burn a roll for the good ol USSR on May 1.
Tongue in cheek, I read how many Americans badmouths what they call 'socialism'. Except for that they don't know what it is, they don't seem to understand that they have been conned. You don't have to be afraid that Obama will turn USA into a socialist state. But that he will run the country into bankruptcy, that's for sure.
ebolton
Number 7614
When you owe more than you can pay back, how do you "go" into bankruptcy? I'm pretty sure we've already been there for quite some time.
Olsen
Well-known
Technically speaking, a nation cannot go bankrupt. The old debt will stick to you for ever. Which means that a growing heap of tax payers money most be allocated to interest on the debt. This interest amounts now to so huge sums that a 'socialist wellfare' state is something USA never can afford.
The Obama administration has proposed a budget for 2009 with a deficit of staggering 1,75 Trillion dollars. They say little about how they will finance that. We are in the middle of a finance crisis, - due to too much borrowing. To cover that kind of sums by issuing government bonds or borrowing from banks might not be possible. So, what is they going to do? Print more dollars? The Weimar Republic over again, - or like Zimbabwe?
I predict that during his 4 year term, Obama must put a roof on his federal budgets which equals the sum 'that is possible to finance'. This will be a new situation for USA where only 'the sky was the limit' to how large the governments budget can be.
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bmattock
Veteran
Or we might start a war, and take what we want.
N
Nikon Bob
Guest
It would have to a short one, these things cost money. War on a budget is an interesting thought but is it possible? Don't anyone get their knickers in a knot meant to be taken lightly.
Bob
ebolton
Number 7614
Much of the world thought that was our intent with Iraq. That, in his secret oil policy meetings, Dick Cheney offered a future, conquered Iraq to the oil companies, and war with Iraq was inevitable to make good on those promises.
I'm not certain myself, but that sounds more plausible to me than Rush Limbaugh claiming the US is going socialist because President Obama is a closet commie.
Article from July 18, 2003
[FONT=Palatino, Georgia, Times New Roman, Times, serif][SIZE=+2]White House energy task forcepapers reveal Iraqi oil maps[/SIZE][/FONT]
[FONT=Palatino, Georgia, Times New Roman, Times, serif][SIZE=+1]Judicial Watch lawsuit also uncovers [/SIZE][/FONT]
[SIZE=+1][FONT=Palatino, Georgia, Times New Roman, Times, serif]list of 'foreign suitors' for contracts[/FONT][/SIZE]
WASHINGTON – The controversial White House energy task force two years ago reviewed Iraqi oil-field maps and "foreign suitors for Iraqi oil-field contracts," reveal documents turned over under court order to a government watchdog group by a member of the task force.
Judicial Watch Inc. first requested the documents under the Freedom of Information Act in the spring of 2001, when Vice President Dick Cheney formed the secret task force. The public-interest law firm has battled the administration in federal court for the information ever since.
Judicial Watch President Tom Fitton noted the mandated release of the papers "couldn't have come at a more inconvenient time for the administration," given growing questions about the credibility of its prewar claims that Iraq possessed weapons of mass destruction and was tied to al-Qaida – thereby posing a direct threat to America.
"Opponents of the war will argue that Iraq oil was on the minds of at least some members of the task force long before the war," he said. "Supporters might argue they couldn't talk about the Mideast oil situation without talking about Iraq."
Phone calls to Cheney's office were not immediately returned.
Fitton says the White House still refuses to produce the list of corporate and other private task force members who met with administration officials, including Cheney, former head of Halliburton Co., a Dallas-based energy-services firm that recently landed a half-billion-dollar federal contract in Iraq.
The unclassified map of Iraq turned over by the Commerce Department, a government member of the task force, shows the location of "supergiant" oil fields, oil pipelines, refineries and tanker terminals. Commerce Secretary Don Evans, a long-time Bush friend from Texas, headed a Denver-based oil company before joining the administration.
Though the papers came from Commerce, Judicial Watch says they were responsive to its request for task-force papers.
"These are task-force documents," Fitton asserted.
Maps of oil-fields in Saudi Arabia and the United Arab Emirates also were produced.
A separate unclassified document, dated March 5, 2001, lists the names of "foreign suitors for Iraqi oil-field contracts," including Dutch Royal Shell, Russia's Lukoil and France's Total Elf Aquitaine. It notes the Russian and French energy giants signed "production-sharing contracts" in 1997.
"This is a road map to the corporations who were in conspiracy with the regime in Baghdad," Fitton contended.
Before the U.S. invasion of Iraq, United Nations sanctions foreclosed the country's lucrative oil fields to U.S. investors. Discussions are under way now to privatize at least a portion of Iraq's state-run oil company, allowing U.S. oil companies to invest there for the first time in more than a decade, administration officials tell WorldNetDaily.
Iraq boasts the world's second-largest proven crude reserves. Its oil fields are highly attractive to U.S. producers, because the crude is not buried as far beneath the surface as in American oil fields, making drilling and other production costs relatively cheap. Also, the crude is considered "sweet," meaning it has a low-sulfur content, which makes it cheaper to refine.
The secret White House task force solicited input from the James A. Baker III Institute for Public Policy at Rice University in Houston.
The Baker report, which was submitted to Cheney in early April 2001, recommended considering a "military" option in dealing with Iraq, which the report charged was using oil exports as a "weapon," by turning its spigot on and off to "manipulate oil markets," WorldNetDaily has learned.
The report advised the Bush administration to, at a minimum, bring UN weapons inspectors back to Iraq, and then, "once an arms-control program is in place, the United States could consider reducing restrictions on oil investment inside Iraq" to gain greater control over the reserves, and "inject" more stability into world oil markets.
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gb hill
Veteran
I've known for a long time Bush & especially Cheny were crooks. Won't get an argument out of me. One reason I left the Republican party. I voted for Ron Paul. Now even moderate Democrats are worried if Obama was the right choice. Obama just gave Hamas 90 billion through Hillary Clinton. Obama is going to spend this country into the ground. I think Bill M. is right. War is on the horizion. Our troops going into Afganastan, Russia on the rise & aiding Iran. Pakastan being pressured by terrorist. The world is a time bomb!
gb hill
Veteran
Palin is a joke & hasn't a chance. I bet you don't even listen to Limbaugh. I don't agree with him on everything but the last few month's heading up to this election he's been dead on. Your in Canada anyhow, why do you care. BTW I wonder how the Prime Minister of England feels now that he was brushed off by Obama? I wonder if he took back the bust of Churchill that Obama threw out?
ebolton
Number 7614
You've been listening to Rush again. Which means you are misinformed.
- It was 900 million to Palestine. You are off by a few orders of magnitude.
-It's not going to Hamas. Given the general corruption in the area, some will get there certainly, but not purposly.
-I am a moderate Democrat. I'm quite happy with President Obama. Many of us are.
Suggestion: Stop listening to drug addicts!
- It was 900 million to Palestine. You are off by a few orders of magnitude.
-It's not going to Hamas. Given the general corruption in the area, some will get there certainly, but not purposly.
-I am a moderate Democrat. I'm quite happy with President Obama. Many of us are.
Suggestion: Stop listening to drug addicts!