Anyone order a Nikon DF?

[css9450]

The way some here keep not understanding that most of people being heavily disappointed with the Df has nothing to do with the camera itself (or even its price) but with how Nikon fooled those people with what they said the Df would be while they knew that it would *not*, makes me wonder if somehow the Df killed their common sense, or something.

You mean the "Pure Photography" concept? Gosh, once we moved away from pinholes in a tin can or wet plate glass negatives, is any of it "pure" anymore?

Can you not take pretty much any DSLR (or M9 or a7 or whatever) and even many P&S cameras and put them on Manual exposure and Manual focus and get "Pure Photography" from them? Maybe skip the meter entirely and shoot using Sunny 16. Oh, wait, I know! Buy a box of film and set the camera based on the settings printed on the inside of the box! Now that's pure!

 

[Frank Petronio]

It's perfectly fine to buy one and enjoy the Nikon DF... but why should the buyers and early adopters be defensive or even care about what the skeptics think? Obviously you've been convinced that a $1500 D600 with a new top plate is now worth twice the price. That's fine, go for it.

But the reason many of us are disappointed with the DF is that Nikon only designs and releases only a few new bodies every year and they had an opportunity to provide us with a better camera. Indeed the teaser advertisements and chatter got many photographers hoping that this would be a more significant, braver departure rather than a mere cosmetic adaptation. So to this photographer at least, it feels like too much marketing and not enough "meat".

I'm not saying I would never buy a new Nikon but after ~25 years of being a customer, Nikon's lost a lot of credibility with me.

 

[P. Lynn Miller]

I had no expectations about the Nikon Df, knew nothing about it until the day after the Df was publicly revealed. I would have never known the Df existed if a friend had not spoken to me about. I would never given the Df more than a second look if another old acquaintance of mine had not been able to use the camera prior to its release and gave me a favorable report regarding focusing with manual focus lenses. The marketing campaign made me cynical and pessimistic about the concept and I had little confidence in the Df being a camera I would buy.

I have used most of the latest Nikon D-series in the past 3 years as an assistant and while the cameras are capable of amazing results, they are not cameras I enjoyed using, so I had no interest in buying any of the D-series for myself.

I have over $10,000 worth of Nikkor manual focus lenses, to replace those lenses with new Nikkors would be well over $50,000 and I do not enjoy or like using any of the AF Nikkors.

The layout of manual dials on the Nikon Df, allows me to drive it just like a film camera, with the exception of white-balance, without even turning on the rear screen or accessing a menu. This method of operation is instinctive for me.

The Nikon Df made sense and just works for me.

So no difference in someone preferring and purchasing a Nikon Df, a digital Leica M-series, Fuji X100-series... all are cameras that are not more capable than the average Canon or Nikon DSLR, but are designed to appeal to different user preferences.

 

[Keith]

So people spend $3000 in order to use $1000 of old lenses thanks to a top mounted shutter speed dial. Nikon instantly made back 20 years of lost profits from those togs who never bought AF lenses....

It's a triumph of marketing, I'll give you that.

It had to be to be successful because in reality it offers nothing new ... which is not a criticism but fact.

 

[Phil_F_NM]

I'd love one by virtue of it having a real shutter speed dial. I've been wanting one of those since the F4!
Now I'm waiting to see who hacks the viewfinder to put in a proper focusing screen and then I'll get one on order...
...after I save up a few grand.
But it looks great. The camera I've wanted for quite some time.

Phil Forrest

 

[rbsinto]

I'd love one by virtue of it having a real shutter speed dial. I've been wanting one of those since the F4!
Now I'm waiting to see who hacks the viewfinder to put in a proper focusing screen and then I'll get one on order...
...after I save up a few grand.
But it looks great. The camera I've wanted for quite some time.

Phil Forrest

Funny you should say that. I'm thrilled that it has a blank screen which is my idea of what a proper focusing screen ought to be.
Got rid of those useless split screens that came standard in all my SLRs and replaced them with gridded blanks years ago.
Thank goodness Nikon finally got it right in the Df.

 

[Phil_F_NM]

Funny you should say that. I'm thrilled that it has a blank screen which is my idea of what a proper focusing screen ought to be.
Got rid of those useless split screens that came standard in all my SLRs and replaced them with gridded blanks years ago.
Thank goodness Nikon finally got it right in the Df.

The problem is the scattering angle of the groundglass grain is not enough so with just a plain groundglass, the focus will not snap like it will with a D screen from an F/F2/F3. The screen in the Df dontinues the current Nikon MO of using lenses with a max aperture of f/2.8 so while you have a very bright screen, due to the scattering angle you can't see the true depth of focus (or lack thereof) when using an ultrafast or telephoto lens nor will the image really snap into focus. This is why I changed the screen in my D3 to a split prism one with a coarser groundglass. I shoot exclusively manual focus lenses on the D3 and with the old stock screen, fine focus wasn't possible just by looking at the viewfinder. Now I have a split prism focusing screen, I can see that within the AF sensor area, the sensitivity spot has too much coverage and while it works quite well, it's not precise enough for me.

Phil Forrest

 

[noimmunity]

It's a triumph of marketing.

Well, marketing does include identifying or targeting different potential consumers and/or niches and diversifying product lines to respond to/cultivate interest from those individuals or groups.

What I hear Lynn saying doesn't contradict at all Frank's assertion, it just removes the snideness. It's more like (in his case): what took Nikon so long to identify us and make a dSLR for us?

I've always been wondering why the digital age seems to see much fewer niche cameras than earlier in the film age? Obviously because the production of crucial components (one thinks of sensor, electronics, and software) requires economies of scale. Yet the last couple of years have seen a kind of sea-change, as manufacturers respond to declining sales by advancing into niches they used to dismiss.

 

[rivercityrocker]

I have to admit - I wouldn't have thought that you would need to connect a camera to a TV to take sharp photos of a film cartridge. 😀

I have a D700 and - how surprising - I had noticed the HDMI port for looking at stills or using the Lv on a TV or a HDMI-fitted computer. Yet Nikon didn't market it as a "Pure photography" thing and I bought it fully knowing that it wasn't. 😉

BTW, very nice macrophoto studio. 😉

Well, the photo was taken as an example of what you can do with a small studio, the subject matter wasn't the point. I grabbed whatever was close at hand to use as the subject. Get a 5:1 macro shot of a microchip and see how helpful an HDTV/monitor is at determining critical focus.

In the end, you seem to be irritated by the marketing as "Pure Photography" more than anything. Do you really take all advertising that seriously? Every time you crack open a Bud Light do you expect a bevy of scantily clad women to surround you as if you were the life of the party? C'mon. Everything needs an angle. The D700 had an angle at the time. It was the smallest most inexpensive full-frame on the market. Yeah, it was a strong statement.

Let's face it. Technology has leveled out. Manufacturers have to find ways to distinguish the cameras because they really aren't that different anymore. You seem like a reasonably informed and intelligent person. You should be able to see this.

 

[Addy101]

The Df has one of the best viewfinders I have seen on any new camera in a very long time.

I guess you haven't tried the Sony A900 :bang:

I'm still amazed Nikon could get this buzz for a D610 with the D4 sensor and some extra external controls, that is crippled by getting rid of the video capability. If you want one, by all means go out and buy one. However, I don't think it is a sensible choice for most 😱

 

[rivercityrocker]

In another world, what is sharp is related to what is flat. Nice collection of guitars!

Thanks. I have a knack for collecting two of the very most iconic (and expensive) brands, Leica and Gretsch. My Leica collection is fast catching up to my Grestch guitar collection. My pride and joy is the '59 Chet Atkins Tennessean and then the classic super-flashy White Falcon.

 

[rivercityrocker]

I guess you haven't tried the Sony A900 :bang:

I'm still amazed Nikon could get this buzz for a D610 with the D4 sensor and some extra external controls, that is crippled by getting rid of the video capability. If you want one, by all means go out and buy one. However, I don't think it is a sensible choice for most 😱

The only thing it has in common with the D610 is the focus system. The end. It's a completely different camera other wise. The guts of the D4 at 1/2 the price is buzzworthy in itself. And I don't find the lack of video crippling. Not everybody wants video. I'd have been happier if they killed the LiveView altogether. If video is your thing this ain't your camera.

You want video? The D5300 is the best Nikon has in video right now. Expeed 4, 1080p 60fps, manual exposure, takes AF, AI, and Non-AI lenses, articulated screen. Only $800. I have one in case I need it and it's great.

 

[P. Lynn Miller]

I guess you haven't tried the Sony A900 :bang:

I'm still amazed Nikon could get this buzz for a D610 with the D4 sensor and some extra external controls, that is crippled by getting rid of the video capability. If you want one, by all means go out and buy one. However, I don't think it is a sensible choice for most 😱

I have used the Sony Dslr's and they are fine cameras. A close friend has one and I recommended that he choose it over a Nikon or Canon because he felt the camera was more user friendly for his style of photography than any other DSLR, plus he had no legacy lenses for any brand of DSLR, as he was starting from scratch.

But the Sony does nothing for me, being the owner of around $10,000 worth of old Nikkor lenses, I want/need a Nikon DSLR. And the Df suit me perfectly.

And I have bought a Nikon Df and am very satisfied with my purchase.

 

[P. Lynn Miller]

So people spend $3000 in order to use $1000 of old lenses thanks to a top mounted shutter speed dial. Nikon instantly made back 20 years of lost profits from those togs who never bought AF lenses....

It's a triumph of marketing, I'll give you that.

I agree completely, that someone in the Nikon realised that the was a way to recover lost revenues from all the old Nikkor lens owners, I call that smart business.

It's a triumph of market research.

 

[Fraser]

Not being a current Nikon DSLR user had them in the past (D2h d200 d2x etc), what difference does the DF make when using manual focus lenses compared to D800 or similar or even a Canon DSLR with adapter. Just wondering as I do still have a lot of manual Nikkors and have all but given up shooting film.
Cheers.

 

[noimmunity]

the classic super-flashy White Falcon.

Neilwhitefalcon_retouched copy by Henry Diltz, on Flickr

You wouldn't also happen to have a 1957 Gibson Les Paul?

 

[kdemas]

Mine arrived, charging.

 

[Frank Petronio]

In theory we should be getting more niche cameras since the sensors and subsystems are already mature, proven off-the-shelf technology... so putting a D4 or whatever sensor into a body with physical knobs shouldn't be that hard. Likewise we ought to be able to "build" our cameras like a computer... pick a small to large chassis, cheap vs. hi-end sensor, sophisticated or simple AF system, type of control points, heavy versus light power supply, etc.

That would be awesome! And there is no good reason why we can't yet....

 

[kdemas]

In theory we should be getting more niche cameras since the sensors and subsystems are already mature, proven off-the-shelf technology... so putting a D4 or whatever sensor into a body with physical knobs shouldn't be that hard. Likewise we ought to be able to "build" our cameras like a computer... pick a small to large chassis, cheap vs. hi-end sensor, sophisticated or simple AF system, type of control points, heavy versus light power supply, etc. That would be awesome! And there is no good reason why we can't yet....

A build to order camera would be cool Frank, no question.

 

[dmc]

So we are clear, the Df is NOT a $1,500.00 D600; it is a $3,000.00 D4.

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