Anyone prefer their LTM to their M?

[NeeZee]

I only have a IIIf which I love. Lately I'm using it as a scale focus camera mainly with the Snapshot Skopar. The only thing that drives me nuts is rewinding the film - takes ages (longer than loading the film once you did it 50+ times 🙂 ). I'd also like a Leicavit but I definitely won't buy one for the price of two LTM bodies.

 

[mretina]

I like them almost equally and probably M2/M3 are the best cameras of all, but I must say that beyond merely taking pictures and its result (a field where SLRs cannot be discounted), there is a unique pleasure in shooting and accessing the wide array of barnacks, leica copies, canon and other japanese LTM cameras and lenses that I do not get from the M system.

 

[Robert Lai]

The Leicavit certainly makes these cameras fast handling. It adds about 2cm to their height, making them comparable to the M series cameras in height. Instead of the somewhat slow knob winding, you can really zip along frames with the Leicavit. They are very expensive though, about 3-4 x what a good used Leica Motor M would cost. I had mine relubricated by DAG prior to use, and it is like greased lightning!

Knob rewinding - sure, it is tedious. I read that old timers used to use both hands in rewinding. One hand with the knob itself, and the other hand moves the camera body in the opposite direction. I think collectively you can get over 180 degrees of wind before you have to reset your fingers and wrist.

Among the endless accessories that Leitz made for their cameras are the close-up adapters that were made for specific lenses. I was using my ADVOO this morning with the 50mm collapsible Summicron and my IIIG. Very nice for flowers and such. For the IIIF there was the SOOKY.

 

[Rico]

You could put an eye out with that Leicavit. 🙂 I use the alternative rapid-winder SCNOO: lower profile, cheaper, 2 fps easily, no pointy bits.

Shooting my M4 and IIIb are different experiences, and equally enjoyable.

 

[Luddite Frank]

The knob rewind doesn't bother me that much. If you're in that much of a hurry, you probably shouldn't be trying to use a Barnack in the first place. 😉

For me, the worst part of rewinding the film in a Barnack is taking-up the slack... once that's done, winding the film back is a fairly quick process.

 

[Joe Jesus]

Update, having handled a few M's at an FPP event, I definitely prefer the M. I tried an M4 and an M2R, and they stole my heart.

 

[traveler_101]

The "fondle-factor" of an LTM (I have a very nice IIIf RDST) is pretty much unsurpassed - they just look and feel and sound wonderful - if you "get" mechanical things; if you don't, it will probably seem like a quaint anachronism. All those knobs and dials and levers... I've never owned any camera that had such a ratio of "play-time" to shooting time.

But... in the end cameras are for taking pictures... *sigh*... and while I can deal with the squinty VF, separate RF/VF eyepieces, and no meter, I still find loading the IIIf a somehow jarring experience compared to an M (let alone a swing-back camera). For that reason alone I would be reluctant to take it on vacation with me, unless it was maybe as a 3rd camera. I wouldn't have any such reservations with say an M6.

I really appreciate the paeans to the IIIf, even the ones that are slightly underhanded. The IIIf is certainly much more than a quaint relic or a nostalgic piece; it is a very usable little mechanism--handy, rugged and surprisingly quick. Regarding the limitations of the camera, I am somewhat surprised that loading is a big issue; squinty viewfinder, sure, separate vf and rf windows, absolutely, but film loading? I admit that it takes getting used to, but once you get it down it really isn't a big deal. For a trip, I pre-cut the leaders and am good to go.

The one and only reason I feel compelled to try a M is the combined VF-RF. Somehow with the Barnack I feel i am missing something important.

 

[Luddite Frank]

I am an admitted LTM devotee, whether that is rationally justifiable or not, but I have to say that the M-Leica's VF / RF is mighty nice...

 

[ssmc]

I really appreciate the paeans to the IIIf, even the ones that are slightly underhanded. The IIIf is certainly much more than a quaint relic or a nostalgic piece; it is a very usable little mechanism--handy, rugged and surprisingly quick.

Not intended that way at all... I went back and added the qualification at the last minute because I almost expected someone who doesn't "get it" to chime in and say how pointless that was. Obviously that was a mistake...

Regarding the limitations of the camera, I am somewhat surprised that loading is a big issue; squinty viewfinder, sure, separate vf and rf windows, absolutely, but film loading? I admit that it takes getting used to, but once you get it down it really isn't a big deal. For a trip, I pre-cut the leaders and am good to go.

The one and only reason I feel compelled to try a M is the combined VF-RF. Somehow with the Barnack I feel i am missing something important.

Poorly worded on my part. I was trying (failing) to express that the loading was sort of the last straw, for me, especially while burning through a significant amount of film and trying to keep up with a fast-paced group of hikers.

The combined VF-RF is a revelation if you've never used one. It just makes picture-taking seamless in a way that (IMO) the Barnacks do not.

 

[Scrambler]

SNIP
I was trying (failing) to express that the loading was sort of the last straw, for me, especially while burning through a significant amount of film and trying to keep up with a fast-paced group of hikers.

The combined VF-RF is a revelation if you've never used one. It just makes picture-taking seamless in a way that (IMO) the Barnacks do not.

a) The secret to fast changes on-the-fly (IMHO) is cutting the leader and having multiple takeup spools. Have each film-and-spool set ready to just drop in. Takes time to prep but is like lightning when shooting. Faster, I suspect, than any other loading system in any other camera since threading the takeup spool is already done.
b) I do agree here. The nearest equivalent to the VF-RF separation I find is manual focus on a "mirrorless" where you use enlargement to focus then cancel that and reframe. Compared to that two-step process the combined VF-RF is almost autofocus.

 

[noisycheese]

I have always photographed with M cameras due to the fact that I do not own a Leica thread mount.

Yet. 😉

 

[tunalegs]

I have always photographed with M cameras due to the fact that I do not own a Leica thread mount.

Yet. 😉

Get an Exakta instead. :angel:

 

[ssmc]

a) The secret to fast changes on-the-fly (IMHO) is cutting the leader and having multiple takeup spools. Have each film-and-spool set ready to just drop in. Takes time to prep but is like lightning when shooting. Faster, I suspect, than any other loading system in any other camera since threading the takeup spool is already done.

Geez... I dunno why I never thought of this :bang:

Thanks for the tip!

Scott

 

[johank]

The smallness of my IIIf is one of the reasons it follows with out. My M has very nice handling, good CZ lenses make sharp pictures.

 

[maxmadco]

I recently started out with Leica M's and then bought a IIIf and really like the way it looks and handles, it is just fun for me.
The only things I have done to make it easier for me to use was to make a fixture for cutting the longer leader and making a thin plastic cover to go over the back of the SB001 viewfinder so it cannot scratch my glasses.

 

[traveler_101]

I recently started out with Leica M's and then bought a IIIf and really like the way it looks and handles, it is just fun for me.
The only things I have done to make it easier for me to use was to make a fixture for cutting the longer leader and making a thin plastic cover to go over the back of the SB001 viewfinder so it cannot scratch my glasses.

Always good to hear from a newcomer who has both and comes to appreciate the LTM's qualities.

I have always photographed with M cameras due to the fact that I do not own a Leica thread mount.

Yet. 😉

LOL!

 

[sanmich]

Although I am mainly shooting M's, I have decided to shoot my coming trip to the Netherlands with a IIIf+BL finder and col summicron, loaded with 100 ISO film.
I expect doing mostly landscapes/urban landscapes with this combo, so no high speed shooting, and the tiny size is a plus. I must say that the feeling of these cameras is fantastic. Better IMO than the M's. Still, M's are the better shooters for lots of things, and I think that sometimes in the future, I'll sell the LTM gear which doesn't get enough use.
(The M2 will be with me too in NL with 400 ISO and a 28mm)

 

[traveler_101]

Although I am mainly shooting M's, I have decided to shoot my coming trip to the Netherlands with a IIIf+BL finder and col summicron, loaded with 100 ISO film.
I expect doing mostly landscapes/urban landscapes with this combo, so no high speed shooting, and the tiny size is a plus. I must say that the feeling of these cameras is fantastic. Better IMO than the M's. Still, M's are the better shooters for lots of things, and I think that sometimes in the future, I'll sell the LTM gear which doesn't get enough use.
(The M2 will be with me too in NL with 400 ISO and a 28mm)

That's cool. 😱 The IIIf is tiny isn' it?

If I may ask: what's the fastest focusing lens that you use on the M2?

 

[sanmich]

That's cool. 😱 The IIIf is tiny isn' it?

If I may ask: what's the fastest focusing lens that you use on the M2?

I'm not 100% sure what you mean by "fast focusing".
When shooting a Barnack, focusing is not really what slows you down.
recomposing, rewinding, changing film is.

I am down to two 50mm lenses in LTM: a summicron and a Summar.

I used to have a CV 28mm which is a killer lens for hyperfocal shooting on the streets when coupled with a IIIf.

 

[pete hogan]

As the Summaron 35mm f/3.5 came along, Leica suggested in a '54 ad that it could be set at f/11 and 11 feet and that everything from 5-1/2 feet to infinity would be in sharp focus. Seems they had "fast focusing" in mind.