kiliii
Member
Let me just vent for a minute and express how difficult it is to either sell or trade my Canon 1dmkII for an Epson Rd-1. You'd think it'd be easy to sell a $4500 camera for less than half the price.
Whew, when I finally do sell/trade it, I look forward to rangefindering with gusto.
GGGrrrrrrr....
Whew, when I finally do sell/trade it, I look forward to rangefindering with gusto.
GGGrrrrrrr....
usayit
Well-known
In a consumer world that has been convinced that megapixels are everything, its difficult to resell an 8mp camera at that price.
With that said... I have a Canon 1dmarkII purchased used for less than half the original cost. LOVE IT. I wouldn't sell it for the r-d1.
With that said... I have a Canon 1dmarkII purchased used for less than half the original cost. LOVE IT. I wouldn't sell it for the r-d1.
B&W Norway
Established
I have them both and would not find it easy if I had to choose one of them.
But I don't so I'm happy
But I don't so I'm happy
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rpsawin
Guest
Unlike quailty analog photo equipment, digital photo equipment looses it's value rapidly and at a certain point is looked at as near valuless junk regardless of it's condition and functionality.
In short, be prepared to take a bath...
Bob
In short, be prepared to take a bath...
Bob
R
RML
Guest
rpsawin said:
Not valueless, and not junk. As long as I keep using my R-D1 it will never be valueless. And it will only be junk when it breaks down and can't be fixed anymore (at least at a reasonable price level).
Marketing tries to make us believe our cameras are disposables. They're not.
Topdog1
Well-known
rpsawin said:
This will be just as true for the M8 as any other digital camera. Welcome to the revolution.
Regards,
Ira
Topdog1
Well-known
In the mean time, in between time, I am busy beefing up my collection of classic M bodies and now have 1 M3 ss, 1 M3 ds, 1 M4 (myfavorite so far), a newly acquired M5, and am considering a M2. I also have a iiif that is fun to just carry around...ain't we got fun!
Regards,
Ira
P.S. O yeah, I also have a R-D1. I'm not a luddite, after all!
P.P.S. BTW, you can have all of those bodies in great working shape for less than the cost of the M8.
Regards,
Ira
P.S. O yeah, I also have a R-D1. I'm not a luddite, after all!
P.P.S. BTW, you can have all of those bodies in great working shape for less than the cost of the M8.
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rpsawin
Guest
RML said:
And my point is that digital equipment, in the marketplace, looses value very rapidly and at some point looses all value due to technological obsolecence. While an individual owner and user may see as much value and functionality in their equipment as the day they bought it is not a sentiment shared in the market place.
The people I know who shoot digital professionaly do indeed factor their cameras as necessary to replace in order to keep pace. As such they are "consumable" over a short life span...usually three years. Most of the consumer level cameras maybe have a year.
I can sell my M6, M2 and most of my Leica glass for what I paid for it or very close to it. Now, my Nikon D100.....I don't wanna talk about it.
Bob
Bob
Topdog1
Well-known
rpsawin said:
Leica will not be the only company in the world whose products are not subject to technological obsolecense. If you are buying a M8 because you think it will hold its value the way classic M bodies have, you are just fooling yourself. But you don't need that kind of rationalization to buy one. Just think how much money people spend on a hobby like car racing or bass fishing or sailing or astronomy. Much more! If you want it, buy it and enjoy it. It's your hobby, your money, your time. What are ya a baby - you need someone to validate your decision for you?
Regards,
Ira
pfogle
Well-known
I went from R-D1 plus 1Dm2 to R-D1 plus 5D and would find it hard to be without both.
I probably use the R-D1 90% of the time, but the other 10% I get paid for.
I probably use the R-D1 90% of the time, but the other 10% I get paid for.
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rpsawin
Guest
Topdog1 said:Leica will not be the only company in the world whose products are not subject to technological obsolecense. If you are buying a M8 because you think it will hold its value the way classic M bodies have, you are just fooling yourself. But you don't need that kind of rationalization to buy one. Just think how much money people spend on a hobby like car racing or bass fishing or sailing or astronomy. Much more! If you want it, buy it and enjoy it. It's your hobby, your money, your time. What are ya a baby - you need someone to validate your decision for you?
Regards,
Ira
Well Ira, no I'm not a baby and I certainally don't need validation from anyone...certainally not anyone here.
BTW...what does your response have to do with my post?
Bob
Ben Z
Veteran
I'm a)retired, b)comfortably set but not rich enough to squander my money, and c)my DNA is missing the 'must keep up with the Joneses' gene So I've adopted a strategy of buying one generation behind refurbs and skipping any generations that don't offer revolutionary improvement. 20D refurb was $800, RD-1 refurb will be $1400. Will never get a 30D, but perhaps if the 40D is a major step up, I'll get a refurb when the 50D replaces it. Like that. No desire to spend 2x as much for a full-frame, since I've already got an EF-S wide zoom for the 1.6 crop. An M8? Well now that's a toughy. I expect the M9 won't need IR filters, which will sink the cost of an M8 refurb to a very tempting level, but then there's those pesky filters. Though probably will be a ton of used ones going for $10 each once people flock to the M9 All in all, my point is if you've got patience and don't care if the snobs tease you about that "obsolete" camera you're shooting, digital doesn't need to drive you to the brink of financial ruin.
So I've adopted a strategy of buying one generation behind refurbs and skipping any generations that don't offer revolutionary improvement. 20D refurb was $800, RD-1 refurb will be $1400. Will never get a 30D, but perhaps if the 40D is a major step up, I'll get a refurb when the 50D replaces it. Like that. No desire to spend 2x as much for a full-frame, since I've already got an EF-S wide zoom for the 1.6 crop. An M8? Well now that's a toughy. I expect the M9 won't need IR filters, which will sink the cost of an M8 refurb to a very tempting level, but then there's those pesky filters. Though probably will be a ton of used ones going for $10 each once people flock to the M9 All in all, my point is if you've got patience and don't care if the snobs tease you about that "obsolete" camera you're shooting, digital doesn't need to drive you to the brink of financial ruin.
R
rpsawin
Guest
Ben Z said:
Ben,
That's a great point. Find the equipment that suits yours needs and stick with it until your needs change. That's a pretty good approach regardless of what you are buying.
Best Regards,
Bob
Topdog1
Well-known
It supports it. The "you" is a collective you, the reader; not "you", rpsawin. Sorry if that wasn't clear.rpsawin said:Well Ira, no I'm not a baby and I certainally don't need validation from anyone...certainally not anyone here.
BTW...what does your response have to do with my post?
Bob
/Ira
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kiliii
Member
Ben Z said:
Agreed. I also agree on the point too that buying used items that noone else wants is much better for the sustainability of the world around us-- it is still consumerist, but not as much so, and doesn't drive demand etc...
Yeah, the mkII is just too heavy for me to pack in to the wilderness where my bread and butter is, so I picked up a used 20D and a 300/2.8. (I just recently switched from Minolta after a decade of semi-pro shooting)
However, the RD-1 fits my other side very well too-- shooting people and people doing things that make life what it is. For some reason or other, I have been doing better magazine sales with these kinds of images than my traditional wildlife shooting. I always hated dragging along an SLR with several lenses everywhere I go, but it's necessary to catch the opportune moments that make incredible photographs.
Good discussion all.
washy21
Established
I think the problem is that Canon release so many bloody cameras that they do feel obsolete. As a matter of interest how of is the MKII and how many shots has i taken.
kiliii
Member
Oh, it's got under 10K actuations on a new shutter-- it was replaced at 80K, but lived in the studio its whole life.
It basically looks near-mint condition. It's got the usual wear at the flash hotshoe and the strap attachments, but that's bout it.
It basically looks near-mint condition. It's got the usual wear at the flash hotshoe and the strap attachments, but that's bout it.
washy21
Established
Thanks for that Kiliii
My RD1 went lighting fast and for the asking price. I do however know what you mean. I have an old D60 which I paid over £2000 for about 4 years ago. I bet it's worth peanuts now. That said, it is one hell of a camera and it is capable of brilliant pictures whether we are onto the newest budget slrs or not.
To me, you just have to expect that digital camera bodies depriciate like cars. At the moment I'm looking for a Canon 180mm Macro lens but second hand they are nearly as expensive as new. Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaargh
best wishes
My RD1 went lighting fast and for the asking price. I do however know what you mean. I have an old D60 which I paid over £2000 for about 4 years ago. I bet it's worth peanuts now. That said, it is one hell of a camera and it is capable of brilliant pictures whether we are onto the newest budget slrs or not.
To me, you just have to expect that digital camera bodies depriciate like cars. At the moment I'm looking for a Canon 180mm Macro lens but second hand they are nearly as expensive as new. Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaargh
best wishes