FujiLove
Well-known
So why shoot it at all?
Basic review of JCH Streetpan 400
- Thread starter BLKRCAT
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So why shoot it at all?
BLKRCAT
75% Film
If you're asking me its because I didn't know what to expect, purchased my single roll on discount, and thought it would be an interesting video to make.
If you're asking anyone else, your guess is as good as mine.
If you're asking anyone else, your guess is as good as mine.
Daryl J.
Well-known
I wish someone from Blue Moon would weigh in because whatever they are using to develop is doing beautifully. 9 minutes developing time. My prints coming back look much like FP4.
One roll of mine had some fuzz/threads in it that made advancing the roll difficult and I had some spacing/rewinding issues. But apart from that, we are seeing lovely results in Portland.
Camera: M4.
Lens: 1.5/50mm Zeiss C Sonnar
Exposures: Sunny 16 and a Mark One Eyeball. Box speed.
Renderings: slightly more contrasty thanFP4
If I had the capability, I'd scan an upload with no post for people to examine/critique.
Thanks for the tip on Rollei Superpan 200. I'll try that too.
One roll of mine had some fuzz/threads in it that made advancing the roll difficult and I had some spacing/rewinding issues. But apart from that, we are seeing lovely results in Portland.
Camera: M4.
Lens: 1.5/50mm Zeiss C Sonnar
Exposures: Sunny 16 and a Mark One Eyeball. Box speed.
Renderings: slightly more contrasty thanFP4
If I had the capability, I'd scan an upload with no post for people to examine/critique.
Thanks for the tip on Rollei Superpan 200. I'll try that too.
Pioneer
Veteran
Thanks DarylJ, I will have to pack up a roll or two and ship it off to Blue Moon to see how it works out. This is at least the 2nd time I have read that others in Portland are having great results. I do buy some LF film from them but haven't tried their developing services yet.
BLKRCAT I will have to give some of Rollei's Superpan 200 a try, always interested in experimenting with new things. However, though I really wasn't specifically trying to prove that JCH Streetpan was better rated at EI200 than its box speed, I did try several rolls at EI200. Unfortunately it didn't work out very well. On the flip side I did notice better response when I bumped the exposure index to EI500.
Not sure that really means anything beyond the fact that there seems to be a lot of unknown around this film waiting for us to explore. Some are perfectly happy with TriX or HP5+, and that is fine. But others like to play around with other alternatives and this film still has potential for learning.
Pioneer
Veteran
Why not? Some of us enjoy playing around a bit. Of course if people reject the film and it doesn't sell well then I doubt Bellamy will want to produce more of it. The more that is coated and sold the further the price can drop.
For myself there are lots of positives to somewhat offset the per roll cost. The first is that it does seem to work very well and consistently if you have some time to dial in your exposure indexes and your developing regime. Kind of like what people used to do when a new film came on the market. But, not everyone any longer has time for this, nor the patience I think.
Another positive is how flat it dries which makes it perfect for scanning. No bowing in the middle to throw off the scanner focus so you get a sharp scan without having to do wet scanning or use other scanning techniques to compensate. Of course, if you print enlarge and print then this may not be an issue, though I have much better luck printing flat negs myself.
Obviously this is all a personal decision, as most film choices are. I actually like this film and will be buying 100 more rolls in a couple more months as I am starting to run a little low. Of course, that assumes Bellamy will have more when I am ready to buy.
Skiff
Well-known
Again:
The last coating run of this film was in 2008. Agfa discontinued it long ago. And they will never make this film again. Agfa is step by step reducing their activities in aerial film production.
There is no "production" (= emulsion making and coating) of this film anymore. All what is done is converting old warehouse stock to 35mm cassettes printing the JCH label on it.
Of course nothing is wrong if you like the look of Agfa aerial film. As said above, I am using them as well for many many years for certain projects.
The characteristics you like you will also have with the Agfa Aviphot Pan 200 (= Rollei Superpan 200 = Rollei Retro 400S = Rollei Infrared). At less than half the price.
And if you want to support the industry, supporting real current production, then the Aviphot Pan 200 (and Aviphot Pan 80) is the only way to go. Because they are still in production (= fresh coatings).
Daryl J.
Well-known
Aviphot Pan 80 is available under what brand names please?
Skiff
Well-known
Rollei Retro 80S.
Pioneer
Veteran
Bellamy notes it as a new coating so one of you seems to be getting your information from different sources.
Thanks for the heads up on the film Skiff. I will give the Rollei Superpan 200 a try but I have tried Rollei Retro 400S and my results with that film didn't look anything like JCH Streetpan when developed with the same material and techniques. I still have some on ice and if I can find the right box in the freezer I will try it once more but I don't expect my results to be any different.
As for supporting the "real current" production of film I certainly have done my part, and continue to do so. This includes not only JCH Streetpan but many, many other brands as well.
While I respect your opinions, I really don't think that who I support and what film I decide to purchase is yours to decide. There are many of us who have widely differing tastes and enjoy working with different emulsions. In this case the film is great and the results are consistent, showing excellent quality control through my first 50 rolls. What your own results look like will be a result of your choice of subject matter, exposure, developing and printing results. We all know how many variables there are in those few choices. Some films are easier to use than others, we all know that. I think that BLKRCAT hit it on the head in his review when he said that this film probably is not the best choice for beginners.
I know I enjoy my choices and I am sure you enjoy using your own choices. Let others decide their own choices for themselves. You and others have decided that this film is not your cup of tea. Great! I would never assume to tell you to go against your own choice in this matter.
The results of my own exploration with this film were a little different than BLKRCAT's and can be found in this thread. http://www.rangefinderforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=156859
BLKRCAT
75% Film
Just out of curiosity, where does bellamy say that its a new coating?
The only reason why I find it hard to believe is that the characteristics of the film are identical to the Aviphot Pan 400s as per the data sheets.
How could one guy convince agfa to start up their machines for a single run with machines that previously supplied governments and industry? I've read multiple times and its my understanding that most of these machines are designed for high capacity not specialty short runs. This is at least what ferrania has communicated with their factory and fuji and kodaks excuse to discontinue films because the demand high enough to support their large factories.
Just seems a bit odd that one guy can get a film made start to finish. I don't consider Bellamy to be a rich man so what makes him so special? It just sounds very unbelievable. Don't you think that if it was that easy there would be other investors trying to do the same while film is coming back?
But if he can acquire some sort of master roll or large bulk rolls from storage from previous coatings it's a theroy that totally makes sense. He could have a contact at agfa that could sell him a roll that would otherwise sit in storage and become unusable, even package it up for him and ship to his doorstep.
The only reason why I find it hard to believe is that the characteristics of the film are identical to the Aviphot Pan 400s as per the data sheets.
How could one guy convince agfa to start up their machines for a single run with machines that previously supplied governments and industry? I've read multiple times and its my understanding that most of these machines are designed for high capacity not specialty short runs. This is at least what ferrania has communicated with their factory and fuji and kodaks excuse to discontinue films because the demand high enough to support their large factories.
Just seems a bit odd that one guy can get a film made start to finish. I don't consider Bellamy to be a rich man so what makes him so special? It just sounds very unbelievable. Don't you think that if it was that easy there would be other investors trying to do the same while film is coming back?
But if he can acquire some sort of master roll or large bulk rolls from storage from previous coatings it's a theroy that totally makes sense. He could have a contact at agfa that could sell him a roll that would otherwise sit in storage and become unusable, even package it up for him and ship to his doorstep.
Skiff
Well-known
You are absolutely right!
If someone is telling you JCH Street Pan is a freshly coated film, he is lying. Period.
Everyone can look at the Agfa homepage where the Aviphot Pan 400 is described as discontinued for quite some time.
Agfa's coating machine is one of the biggest in the whole industry, designed for huge mass production. Agfa is mainly producing PCB films on it, about 1 million m² (!!) p.a.
The absolute minimum for a coating run is about 10,000 m² at Agfa, that are more than 170,000 135 films!
That is a really huge investment for a customer who wants that.
Even much much bigger companies than this one-man show Mr. Hunt, like Maco / Rollei-Film, don't have enough capital to finance a production run at Agfa.
That is the reason why Maco / Rollei film is only offering Agfa films from the current Agfa film programme. Films, which Agfa has already produced for other, much bigger industrial segments of the market.
The demand from photographers is much too low to keep such a production running.
This film is most probably converted from pancakes or larger bulk rolls (an Agfa Jumbo roll is too big). As explained above, it was used not only in arial photo applications, but also in traffic surveillance and as infrared film. And several house brands like Rollei and Compard had used it too in the past. As the Compard owner unfortunately died recently and Compard then focussed its activities, that could be a possible source of the raw, not converted bulk rolls.
Pioneer
Veteran
This may all be a moot point since the film is sold out and may not be continued.
Anyway, you guys could be right in your assessment since this is what Bellamy says on his website.
"The is not a re-spooled film. This is a discontinued film that has been given a second chance."
I hope more of it makes it to the market as I do enjoy it quite a bit. I still have a couple of months based on current use but may have to try some of these other options if not.
Anyway, you guys could be right in your assessment since this is what Bellamy says on his website.
"The is not a re-spooled film. This is a discontinued film that has been given a second chance."
I hope more of it makes it to the market as I do enjoy it quite a bit. I still have a couple of months based on current use but may have to try some of these other options if not.
Daryl J.
Well-known
I just got a roll back from processing/printing. The lighting was a bit tricky. Then lens tricky too.
I got exactly what I wanted.
Would it have been better to use FP4? (Hesitatingly) Maybe.......
I got exactly what I wanted.
Would it have been better to use FP4? (Hesitatingly) Maybe.......
ProSimex
Member
If someone wants to re-spool discontinued film and sell it- Great
If he has managed to have an old emulsion remade and hes selling it- Even Better
Why knock it, the more available films the better. This bitterness only emboldens the "film is dead" crowd. My (unasked for) two cents
If he has managed to have an old emulsion remade and hes selling it- Even Better
Why knock it, the more available films the better. This bitterness only emboldens the "film is dead" crowd. My (unasked for) two cents
Chriscrawfordphoto
Real Men Shoot Film.
Its not bitterness, its a respect for truth and honesty. For some of us, personal integrity still means something and its clear that this film is not being marketed honestly.
ProSimex
Member
well ok then
well ok then
I guess if someone uses it they must lack moral fiber due to its ambiguous origins. I'll just sit here with my RolleiRetro80s and let the adults talk.
well ok then
I guess if someone uses it they must lack moral fiber due to its ambiguous origins. I'll just sit here with my RolleiRetro80s and let the adults talk.
Chriscrawfordphoto
Real Men Shoot Film.
Go back and read what I said. Read slowly, if need be. I did not say people who use the film are immoral. The guy marketing it is, but not the users.
They are probably dumb to pay him twice what the film costs from other vendors who are honest about its origins, but many of those here who bought it did so before the truth finally came out about what, exactly this film is; so they can't be blamed for not knowing any better.
BLKRCAT
75% Film
I feel you you pioneer. I think it's really disappointing that since the supply is so limited, if you really fall in love with the look of the film you will get that "discontinued film" feeling when the well dries up!
Henry
Well-known
Resurrecting a very old thread, but some in use discussion.
I bought a few rolls of this in Tokyo last year and only got around to shooting it recently. It's marketed as 400, but it definitely does not shoot like 400, more like 200, and sometimes closer to 100. A heads up to anyone that expects things to behave as they are labeled.
I bought a few rolls of this in Tokyo last year and only got around to shooting it recently. It's marketed as 400, but it definitely does not shoot like 400, more like 200, and sometimes closer to 100. A heads up to anyone that expects things to behave as they are labeled.
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