I try for a good compromise between the two. One that looks good, works right, and has a good price. I don't mind scratches, but do mind dents and cracks and stuff like that.
healyzh
Well-known
I have a little issue with that statement .... all cameras IMO are works of art ... not just Leicas!
I'm a Nikon user, and have been since the mid-80's when I bought my first camera (prior to that I would use one of my Mom's). My first camera was a used FM2, I still have it, and it is a tool, not a work of art. I bought a beater F3HP last year, it's the one that looks like it has been through a war. It is a work of art, so is my Hasselblad 500CM and my Horseman 4x5. My Nikon N75 doesn't even count as a tool, I bought it brand new, it's still pristine (less than a half dozen rolls through it), and it is a piece of junk. Yes, it does what it was designed to, and it is a great camera, but it's still a piece of junk, not a work of art.
I'm really nervous about banging my Hasselblad up, it's not mint, but it's very nice. While I'm cautious about the near pristine Horseman, I toss it in the bin under the babystroller with only a cardboard box for protection.
Realistically I try to be extremely careful with any piece of camera equipment. The only camera that I've personally banged up was my FM2, I jammed the lens when it slammed into a part of a Frigate I was on. As we were in the middle of a 6 month cruise, with no hope of getting it repaired, I fixed it myself.
My opinion is don't go for pristine ... if you get an absolute bargain and it happens to be pristine so be it but don't turn it into a shelf queen. I have a mint M2 that happened to cost me what I would have expected to pay for a beater and although there is no big investment in the camera I tend to treat it with kid gloves ... it's ridiculous and I'm ashamed!
Personally I think it is understandable, and I'm pretty sure I'd be a lot more cautious with a mint M2 than a mint M6. As for turning it into a shelf queen, I can't afford that, any Leica I buy will be used.
healyzh
Well-known
Excellent advice on the sprockets, though I'm not sure what you mean by the sound of the slow speed escarpment winding down.
SolaresLarrave
My M5s need red dots!
I buy what I can afford... and it's been mostly user cameras (except for my first two Leicas, which were LNIB). Hence, my M3 needed some repairs but not scratches. Same for my M4-2. Now, both meterless bodies look mighty good to me.
FS Vontz
Aspirer
When buying a Leica(I probably will eventually) I will look for ones which are cosmetically bereft. Not because I like beater Leicas, but because it'll be cheaper.
Sparrow
Veteran
when it's set to a speed of 1/2 or 1 sec, fire the shutter and hold the camera against your ear ... it goes
click shutter open -- wrrrrrr clockwork timer -- click shutter close --- then Wrrrr rr r r r r r r as the escarpment is winding down
As they get older the Wrrrr rr r r r r r r bit starts becoming restricted and more erratic ... no idea why, lubricant perhaps
P. S. when it stops doing that bit the slow speeds go off
Pindy
Member
Whenever I buy a new guitar (which isn't often these days) I try to let it fall over in the first week, so I can stop being precious about it. Nothing says "it's mine" like a little ding. Not so with my camera gear though.
My first Leica lens was a 35mm Lux ASPH (the current one). I got it for $2300 because the previous owner is a professional and it was (and indeed looks) well used. No way I coud've spent the $4200 for a new one.
My first Leica lens was a 35mm Lux ASPH (the current one). I got it for $2300 because the previous owner is a professional and it was (and indeed looks) well used. No way I coud've spent the $4200 for a new one.
Phil_F_NM
Camera hacker
I'd say piss off collectors! Cameras are meant to be used and used hard.
I got a mint M4 in 2004 then beat the crap out of it over the years. That wear I put on the camera is a story of my life while I was using it.
The camera deserves to be used as the durable tool it was created to be.
So if you can afford the new or mint one, buy it & use it.
If I had a few extra thousand to throw around I'd find a mint M3, M2, MP or M4 in black paint and give it a personality myself through use. And in so doing, I might make a few collectors angered, which I love to do.
Phil Forrest
I got a mint M4 in 2004 then beat the crap out of it over the years. That wear I put on the camera is a story of my life while I was using it.
The camera deserves to be used as the durable tool it was created to be.
So if you can afford the new or mint one, buy it & use it.
If I had a few extra thousand to throw around I'd find a mint M3, M2, MP or M4 in black paint and give it a personality myself through use. And in so doing, I might make a few collectors angered, which I love to do.
Phil Forrest
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healyzh
Well-known
So basically it should click open, have a smooth sounding wrrrrrr, and the then click close. The rougher the wrrrrr, the worse the condition?
This is the best arguement I've heard for buying local, and the local shop has several bodies at the moment. Only one is a M6, which is the model I really want, but there are also a couple M6 TTL's and a M7. Normally I buy local if given the chance, but I can get a body a lot cheaper from someplace like Tamarkin.
cmogi10
Bodhisattva
Nobody really cares about your camera.
show them pictures instead of the tool.
show them pictures instead of the tool.
Melvin
Flim Forever!
Try and get the nicest one you can afford. Whether it's mint or beat up it's still a delicate precision instrument that has to be handled with care.
fixbones
.......sometimes i thinks
I bought both my ZI and MP new less than a year ago.
So far, they have been to Egypt, Cambodia, Malaysia and Singapore with me. Not to mention the countless of hiking and bushwaks here in Tasmania too.
They both have marks and scratches.
They are both mine and i enjoy using them =D
So far, they have been to Egypt, Cambodia, Malaysia and Singapore with me. Not to mention the countless of hiking and bushwaks here in Tasmania too.
They both have marks and scratches.
They are both mine and i enjoy using them =D
peter_n
Veteran
I buy by price and availability and have bought both new and used Leicas, and I don't worry about putting marks on a new body or lens. No point in buying if you're going to be anxious about using it. My two current bodies were bought used within a day of each other. One of them is an MP3 that the previous owner allowed to brush against his belt buckle, thus ruining the collector value... One of my favorite lenses is a Summicron 35/2 v.1 that was described as "battered" in the ad. It does look a bit worn but a trip to Steve Choi and it is perfect and renders beautifully. Another is a 75/2 bought new that amazingly still looks new after all the use I've given it over the last couple of years.
My own first Leica was in good condition when I bought it, and I used it well for a few years then sold it for about the same price I paid. So long as it's not a collector item, my advice is buy at a decent price when a good body becomes available, and don't worry about using it because you'll be able to sell it for more-or-less what you paid for it. Leica equipment holds its value very well.
One of my favorite lenses is a Summicron 35/2 v.1 that was described as "battered" in the ad. It does look a bit worn but a trip to Steve Choi and it is perfect and renders beautifully. Another is a 75/2 bought new that amazingly still looks new after all the use I've given it over the last couple of years.My own first Leica was in good condition when I bought it, and I used it well for a few years then sold it for about the same price I paid. So long as it's not a collector item, my advice is buy at a decent price when a good body becomes available, and don't worry about using it because you'll be able to sell it for more-or-less what you paid for it. Leica equipment holds its value very well.
Lord Fluff
Established
All my lenses (RF or SLR) are bought used, since you save so much.
However I bought my M8 new due to the two year warranty - I want to use it professionally and so can't afford to be waiting around on a faulty older camera. I know the new one could go wrong, but the dealer said that Leica tend to look after pros with loaners - I'm hoping not to be in a position to find out if this is true.....
However I bought my M8 new due to the two year warranty - I want to use it professionally and so can't afford to be waiting around on a faulty older camera. I know the new one could go wrong, but the dealer said that Leica tend to look after pros with loaners - I'm hoping not to be in a position to find out if this is true.....
parsec1
parsec1
As a young (well reasonably so,without being ungentlemanly) Lady said to me awhile ago, "It ain't what you got but the way that you use it".
cmogi10
Bodhisattva
Leica doesn't really look after anyone, except seal
And if you figure out how to finagle a loaner out of them please let me know.