Forest_rain
Well-known
I've heard a lot of people using lighter fluid to degrease shutter parts. However I've also heard that this stuff is pretty toxic and will also dissolve/damage plastic and rubber parts, so I'd like to avoid it.
"Odorless" Mineral spirits also come recommended, and seem, maybe, safer from a quick google search, but I also noticed that WD-40 sells some "specialist degreaser" (It's not WD-40 lubricant). There's also "electrical contact cleaner". I'm wondering which product would be best for degreasing shutter parts.
The WD-40 degreaser has undisclosed ingredients but claims to be "fast-evaporating, safe on skin, and 50 state VOC compliant". That's a lot to claim. Mineral spirits seem banned in California for some reason.
I'm attempting to disassamble and clean the shutter mechanism on my Prontor shutter, and failing that, will remove and soak the shutter in the degreaser (I know). But it's better than having a scrap heap camera.
The shutter "sticks" on my Prontor shutter camera. It used to work, but recently the shutter opens and seems to attempt to close but becomes stuck. I removed a coating of grease on the outside of shutter blades but it still sticks so I need to do a deeper cleaning.
"Odorless" Mineral spirits also come recommended, and seem, maybe, safer from a quick google search, but I also noticed that WD-40 sells some "specialist degreaser" (It's not WD-40 lubricant). There's also "electrical contact cleaner". I'm wondering which product would be best for degreasing shutter parts.
The WD-40 degreaser has undisclosed ingredients but claims to be "fast-evaporating, safe on skin, and 50 state VOC compliant". That's a lot to claim. Mineral spirits seem banned in California for some reason.
I'm attempting to disassamble and clean the shutter mechanism on my Prontor shutter, and failing that, will remove and soak the shutter in the degreaser (I know). But it's better than having a scrap heap camera.
The shutter "sticks" on my Prontor shutter camera. It used to work, but recently the shutter opens and seems to attempt to close but becomes stuck. I removed a coating of grease on the outside of shutter blades but it still sticks so I need to do a deeper cleaning.
Beemermark
Veteran
lighter fluid (as used to refill cigarette lighters) is not toxic (or at least a way lot less then petro), will not dissolve or damage plastic or rubber parts. Where do you find this kind of information???
RichC
Well-known
You need a petroleum-type solvent for grease (they're essentially the same thing, just one's a tad thicker!). Two of the most useful and convenient: Lighter fuel is clean, evaporates easily and easy to get. But petrol (gasoline if you're American) is fine too.
Beware of certain products sold as degreasers as they can contain detergents and other additives. Some may need the cleaned parts to be rinsed in water, while others may leave a residue: neither is ideal for a shutter!
Electrical contact cleaner contains acetone. That's the stuff that dissolves plastic! A quick spray is won't harm most plastics - it evaporates too fast, though if you had a smooth, glossy plastic surface, it can mark it. If you put a plastic object in a jar of acetone, you'll have sludge and no object after a few hours!
Lighter fuel and petrol won't dissolve plastic and rubber. But don't leave items soaking for hours in them, as rubber especially can absorb solvent and swell.
That said, contact cleaner is handy, and is a more aggressive solvent than lighter fuel or petrol. I tend to clean metal parts with lighter fuel, then spray them with acetone contact cleaner once the lighter fuel's evaporated, as a final clean to get rid of anything the first clean failed to get rid of.
None of the above will harm provided you're sensible. Acetone produces more vapour, so you need good ventilation (though the worst that will happen from one cleaning session and using a lot of acetone is getting stoned and a headache!). Acetone and its vapour are very flammable - way more then lighter fuel - so no naked flames nearby!
Anyway, a few quick sprays with contact cleaner may be enough to sort out your shutter.
Finally, you will need to relubricate your shutter using watch oil (it's very light). This goes in the escapement part of the mechanism only: put tiny spots on the spindles in the gear train.
Beware of certain products sold as degreasers as they can contain detergents and other additives. Some may need the cleaned parts to be rinsed in water, while others may leave a residue: neither is ideal for a shutter!
Electrical contact cleaner contains acetone. That's the stuff that dissolves plastic! A quick spray is won't harm most plastics - it evaporates too fast, though if you had a smooth, glossy plastic surface, it can mark it. If you put a plastic object in a jar of acetone, you'll have sludge and no object after a few hours!
Lighter fuel and petrol won't dissolve plastic and rubber. But don't leave items soaking for hours in them, as rubber especially can absorb solvent and swell.
That said, contact cleaner is handy, and is a more aggressive solvent than lighter fuel or petrol. I tend to clean metal parts with lighter fuel, then spray them with acetone contact cleaner once the lighter fuel's evaporated, as a final clean to get rid of anything the first clean failed to get rid of.
None of the above will harm provided you're sensible. Acetone produces more vapour, so you need good ventilation (though the worst that will happen from one cleaning session and using a lot of acetone is getting stoned and a headache!). Acetone and its vapour are very flammable - way more then lighter fuel - so no naked flames nearby!
Anyway, a few quick sprays with contact cleaner may be enough to sort out your shutter.
Finally, you will need to relubricate your shutter using watch oil (it's very light). This goes in the escapement part of the mechanism only: put tiny spots on the spindles in the gear train.
Phil_F_NM
Camera hacker
Lighter fluid, like the kind in Zippos, not charcoal grill fluid, is what you want. Get a squeeze bottle of ronsonol or a liter of Coleman camp stove fuel. They won't hurt plastic but they can soften some of the older organic laquers. You could also soak it in type F automatic transmission fluid, that stuff is loaded with detergents and it's a lubricant itself. It sticks though and will need another agent like naptha to remove it. A few typewriter repairmen I know of swear by it. Anyway...
The next question is: do you have proper lubricant for your shutter once you remove the 50 years of old crud in there?
Phil Forrest
The next question is: do you have proper lubricant for your shutter once you remove the 50 years of old crud in there?
Phil Forrest
jim_jm
Well-known
Lighter fluid is the best for cleaning shutter parts. No residue, dries quickly. Just put out your cigarette before using.
WD-40 is NOT a de-greaser and will leave residue (WD stands for Water-Displacement). It was developed to help protect metals from corrosion. Works pretty good to remove sticky adhesives and labels.
Electrical contact cleaner is more toxic, so use with care.
WD-40 is NOT a de-greaser and will leave residue (WD stands for Water-Displacement). It was developed to help protect metals from corrosion. Works pretty good to remove sticky adhesives and labels.
Electrical contact cleaner is more toxic, so use with care.
Beemermark
Veteran
Electrical contact cleaner works very well. Almost all Electrical contact cleaners today will NOT harm plastic. Just be sure to read the label first. Available at any auto parts store.
View Range
Well-known
"Lighter fluid" is naphtha. It is commonly used for your purposes.
Benjamin Marks
Veteran
Wear rubber gloves and work in an area with plenty of ventilation. Naptha is pretty volatile, so it flashes off quickly. But you don't want to breathe a lot of it. Read the MSDS data sheet for whatever product you wind up using. They are available on-line.
If you Google "Rononal MSDS", for instance, this sheet is one of the results you will get:
http://doryventures.scene7.com/is/content/DoryVentures/Ronson/Website/Servicing/2018MSDSRonsonol.pdf
Go into this with your eyes open and take reasonable precautions to protect yourself. That goes for handling any organic compounds.
If you Google "Rononal MSDS", for instance, this sheet is one of the results you will get:
http://doryventures.scene7.com/is/content/DoryVentures/Ronson/Website/Servicing/2018MSDSRonsonol.pdf
Go into this with your eyes open and take reasonable precautions to protect yourself. That goes for handling any organic compounds.
Puggie
Established
Propanol/iso-propyl-alcohol is also a nice clean solvent for cleaning and degreasing, not as harsh as acetone on plastics.
Trichlorethane is an amazingly good cleaning solvent (better than any of the above) used in the film industry for years, but now frowned on somewhat despite being one of the least toxic chlorinated hydrocarbons (they are chloroform type compounds, so all capable of knocking you for six) and they also dissolve the ozone layer rather effectively. Its blooming good stuff though, if you have any 30yr old spray cans of industrial cleaner, you could be onto a winner. Dichloro methane is pretty good too.
Trichlorethane is an amazingly good cleaning solvent (better than any of the above) used in the film industry for years, but now frowned on somewhat despite being one of the least toxic chlorinated hydrocarbons (they are chloroform type compounds, so all capable of knocking you for six) and they also dissolve the ozone layer rather effectively. Its blooming good stuff though, if you have any 30yr old spray cans of industrial cleaner, you could be onto a winner. Dichloro methane is pretty good too.
Forest_rain
Well-known
What about mineral spirits? It seems like it might be the same thing as Naptha. Also the odorless kind may not quite smell as bad or have as much fumes as naptha or may be a little more refined. As long as it doesn't create residue. Probably not completely safe but it's not like I'm going to use it all the time. Also it is supposedly actually designed for degreasing instead of lighter fluid, which is designed for well, lighters.
At this point I think I'll probably pick up some mineral spirits, plus some contact cleaner.
At this point I think I'll probably pick up some mineral spirits, plus some contact cleaner.
Benjamin Marks
Veteran
I wouldn't go with mineral spirits. Not as volatile as Rononol. And the stuff sold as "odorless" mineral spirits isn't really mineral spirits, or odorless. The MSDS for that product reads, "Hydrotreated light distillate (petroleum) 100%" The boiling point of odorless mineral spirits is listed in the MSDS as 318.00 F - 354.00 F. The boiling point of Ronsonol is listed as 194 F to 329. These are different petroleum distillates, and "odorless mineral spirits" will stay liquid longer and possibly drip where you don't want it. But it is your lens/equipment -- do what you want. But do yourself a favor and take advantage of the publicly available MSDS safety information on these products.
Rob-F
Likes Leicas
And according to RFF "common Knowledge," WD40 is said to be naphtha plus a decent light oil. But I don't know if anyone uses it on shutters.
RichC
Well-known
In short, you want a "light" petroleum solvent that's free from additives and evaporates quickly. Get some lighter fuel - it's easy to find and cheap, and has been used to clean shutters for decades.
And don't ignore re-oiling with light machine oil. It's essential. Sewing machine oil will do.
And don't ignore re-oiling with light machine oil. It's essential. Sewing machine oil will do.
Bill Clark
Veteran
Just an idea, why not ask DAG or Youxin?
xayraa33
rangefinder user and fancier
Don't use WD-40 on any camera or lens..the stuff does more damage than it does good, leave it for your rusty bolts on your 1965 MG midget or your 1956 Desoto Firedome that you want to restore.
In the old days the best degreaser was toluene and brands like Whitaker in the USA and Solvable in Canada are still around but the stuff is hard to get now for various reasons..one is it is carcinogenic, real toxic stuff and the fumes are terrible.
In the old days the best degreaser was toluene and brands like Whitaker in the USA and Solvable in Canada are still around but the stuff is hard to get now for various reasons..one is it is carcinogenic, real toxic stuff and the fumes are terrible.
Phil_F_NM
Camera hacker
I forgot to mention the one that is safest for plastics. Alcohol. Not isopropyl or wood alcohol or denatured alcohol (all similar). No, if you're old enough, go to your local liquor store and get a large bottle or a few small bottles of everclear. It won't attack plastic, it will soften and flush away most gummed up hydrocarbons, it's perfectly fine for consumption as well. Quite flammable but not as much as naptha or many of the other volatiles. Much safer for everyone including the camera and the paint.
Phil Forrest
Phil Forrest
Rob-F
Likes Leicas
Blech! No character. I stick with Stolichnaya for consumption!
Phil_F_NM
Camera hacker
I was a sailor, what can I say. You can drink everclear, doesn't mean you should...
It's a great way to wake up on a southern California beach, with the incomong tide for a wake up.
Phil Forrest
Joao
Negativistic forever
Any opinions about using silicone oil ??
I tried it a couple of times and it seems to do the job (so far...)
Regards
Joao
Phil_F_NM
Camera hacker
Thin silicones can migrate, but also, oils like 3 in 1 shouldn't be used because they are just a step away from vegetable oil and will eventually turn sticky. A light synthetic hydrocarbon oil is best, easily available from a jewellery supply or online. "Liquid ball bearings" will return a good selection of high quality oils which are appropriate.
Phil Forrest
Phil Forrest