NY_Dan
Well-known
Self-deleted 🙂 I know I'm better off not posting sometimes.
Big Mistake
- Thread starter Bill Pierce
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siracusa
Well-known
When Bill started this thread the point of it was, as Sanmich rightly pointed out, to explore some of the issues concerning photographers and journalists reporting from war zones, and more specifically, some of the issues about the support or lack of from their editors and desk people. Just a small plea: before this thread becomes divisive, can we please just get back on thread and back to photography?
lukitas
second hand noob
I think the question of journalistic access is intimately related to the political realities 'on the ground'.
Involved parties will try to control access, and the more powerful party will have more control.
In Vietnam, even though some intrepid reporters 'crossed the line', most reporting was done from areas under American control.
In Iraq, reporters were 'embedded'.
A BBC journalist who announces the intention to report in Israël, are lavishly received by bright and polite young people with perfect english, given access to blue-screen facilities and all mod-cons. When they want to speak to a palestinian, they often find themselves reduced to a crackling landline, trying to understand a very upset man with a terrible accent.
Of course the politics weigh heavily on how journalists get to see the situation.
What is more, the entirely spurious accusation of anti-semitism makes me very, very angry. Making a critique of Israeli policy is not the same as denouncing jewry. One doesn't have to be anti-american to critique american policy, or anti-russian to question Putin's decisions. Used in this way, it's not an argument, it's an insult.
It is not for nothing we call ourselves a judeo-christian culture. Jews made an enormous portion of our culture, music, literature, science, psycho-analysys, Jews were the most enthusiastic adopters, and thus creators, of our mittel-europäisch, middle-class, bourgeois culture, the culture where one was supposed to acquire a discerning eye and ear. Through the horror of the holocaust they taught us the barbarity of racism, and impressed the need for universal values, values that encompass all of humanity, that tell us every life is sacred.
In this context, it is harrowing to see a death-toll of twelve hundred and rising, a quarter of which are children, and the to have to note the following line gliding under a talking head : 'Israeli soldier twists ankle in Gaza'
If it weren't tragic, you'd have to laugh.
Involved parties will try to control access, and the more powerful party will have more control.
In Vietnam, even though some intrepid reporters 'crossed the line', most reporting was done from areas under American control.
In Iraq, reporters were 'embedded'.
A BBC journalist who announces the intention to report in Israël, are lavishly received by bright and polite young people with perfect english, given access to blue-screen facilities and all mod-cons. When they want to speak to a palestinian, they often find themselves reduced to a crackling landline, trying to understand a very upset man with a terrible accent.
Of course the politics weigh heavily on how journalists get to see the situation.
What is more, the entirely spurious accusation of anti-semitism makes me very, very angry. Making a critique of Israeli policy is not the same as denouncing jewry. One doesn't have to be anti-american to critique american policy, or anti-russian to question Putin's decisions. Used in this way, it's not an argument, it's an insult.
It is not for nothing we call ourselves a judeo-christian culture. Jews made an enormous portion of our culture, music, literature, science, psycho-analysys, Jews were the most enthusiastic adopters, and thus creators, of our mittel-europäisch, middle-class, bourgeois culture, the culture where one was supposed to acquire a discerning eye and ear. Through the horror of the holocaust they taught us the barbarity of racism, and impressed the need for universal values, values that encompass all of humanity, that tell us every life is sacred.
In this context, it is harrowing to see a death-toll of twelve hundred and rising, a quarter of which are children, and the to have to note the following line gliding under a talking head : 'Israeli soldier twists ankle in Gaza'
If it weren't tragic, you'd have to laugh.
This forum is about photography, not politics. As explained in the TOS and FAQ, Politics are out of bounds here.
This is not to say the political issues discussed are not important.
The problem is that tearing apart the forum about things we are not in a position to change is useless.
Accordingly, a lot of off photography posts will be deleted from this thread.
Stephen
This is not to say the political issues discussed are not important.
The problem is that tearing apart the forum about things we are not in a position to change is useless.
Accordingly, a lot of off photography posts will be deleted from this thread.
Stephen
semordnilap
Well-known
I think it's largely wordsmithing on Ms. Murphy's part. She knows to whom she is speaking, and she seems to be trying to maintain the paper's appearance of impartiality and thus their appeal to a broad readership. It doesn't seem to me that the Times is throwing anyone under the bus, more that some other outlets are trying to make it seem that they are. I would hope that the reporters in Gaza are getting good service and support from back home, and I would assume that their access in a war zone is definitely limited, but also that the Times doesn't want to go into more specifics so as not to seem hapless or compromised, and thus undermine its reporting.
I agree with Raid,
Yet they do always try desperately to declaim their truthfulness.
Bill Clark
Veteran
Who knows? Are they real thoughts or comments or evaluation of the photographer/photographs or a response from outside pressure regarding the photographs? Sometimes things are said to pacify some.
Bill Pierce
Well-known
Here are Tyler Hicks' own words on covering Gaza for the NYT.
http://lens.blogs.nytimes.com/2014/...ing-photo-in-gaza/?_php=true&_type=blogs&_r=0
http://lens.blogs.nytimes.com/2014/...ing-photo-in-gaza/?_php=true&_type=blogs&_r=0
ashfaque
Learning
"My biggest struggle is to rehumanize the Palestinians." (Gideon Levy). To me that statement says it all.
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/w...n-israel-or-just-the-most-heroic-2087909.html
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/w...n-israel-or-just-the-most-heroic-2087909.html
sanmich
Veteran
About the difficulties (at least part of them) to report from Gaza:
http://www.algemeiner.com/2014/07/3...ion-misfired-rocket-killed-children-in-shati/
http://www.algemeiner.com/2014/07/3...ion-misfired-rocket-killed-children-in-shati/
Bill Clark
Veteran
Much better and more interesting link than the first.
Thanks!
Thanks!
Ranchu
Veteran
It's a flat-out sensational lie.
"I feel compelled to call out Tablet for a cowardly, false and unconscionable article published August 1st.1 Titled “New York Times Slams Its Own Pulitzer-Prize Winning Photographer In Gaza, Says Legendary Photojournalist Tyler Hicks is Bad at His Job,” the piece was published unsigned, using only the tag “Staff Notes” to mark any form of authorship. The headline is a sensational lie that doesn’t even match the article’s own broken logic."
http://candlerblog.com/2014/08/05/a-sensational-lie/
"I feel compelled to call out Tablet for a cowardly, false and unconscionable article published August 1st.1 Titled “New York Times Slams Its Own Pulitzer-Prize Winning Photographer In Gaza, Says Legendary Photojournalist Tyler Hicks is Bad at His Job,” the piece was published unsigned, using only the tag “Staff Notes” to mark any form of authorship. The headline is a sensational lie that doesn’t even match the article’s own broken logic."
http://candlerblog.com/2014/08/05/a-sensational-lie/
Roger Hicks
Veteran
Dear Raid,
Exactly. Anyone who believes in even the possibility of "objectivity" deserves all they get.
Cheers,
R.
Timmyjoe
Veteran
As a photojournalist who used to cover politics here in the States, I know how access can be restricted if you aren't "toeing the company line". I'm sure it's exponentially more difficult in the Middle East.
Each side wants only their version of the truth to be out there. And in this conflict, I see three sides. There is the Israeli side that only wants the message out there of, "We are the victims, Hamas and the Palestinians are the evil ones." There is the Hamas side that only wants the message out there of, "We are the victims, Israel is the evil one." And then there is the side of the Palestinians who are living in Gaza, who are the real victims of both the Israelis and Hamas. I am so glad that Tyler Hicks is telling their story.
Best,
-Tim
Each side wants only their version of the truth to be out there. And in this conflict, I see three sides. There is the Israeli side that only wants the message out there of, "We are the victims, Hamas and the Palestinians are the evil ones." There is the Hamas side that only wants the message out there of, "We are the victims, Israel is the evil one." And then there is the side of the Palestinians who are living in Gaza, who are the real victims of both the Israelis and Hamas. I am so glad that Tyler Hicks is telling their story.
Best,
-Tim
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