ywenz said:
According the serial number list on CameraQuest, yes.
Black M3 Holy S***!
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According the serial number list on CameraQuest, yes.
bob338
Well-known
What would Jesus do?
jesus would probably tell you to leave him out of this.
then he would tell you that he is actually a figment of your imagination.
as far as how i feel about the price i paid for it, i have no qualms about it. i felt that twinge of weirdness when i was leaving the guys house, but as someone else pointed out, he set the price and he put it up for sale. i didn't haggle over the price and i didn't do anything dishonest. this wasn't some crackhead selling off his parents stuff for drugs or an old lady without a clue. he sold the camera for his price to buy a DSLR, not to get an operation for his kid.
anyone here would have bought it given the opportunity.
jesus would probably tell you to leave him out of this.
then he would tell you that he is actually a figment of your imagination.
as far as how i feel about the price i paid for it, i have no qualms about it. i felt that twinge of weirdness when i was leaving the guys house, but as someone else pointed out, he set the price and he put it up for sale. i didn't haggle over the price and i didn't do anything dishonest. this wasn't some crackhead selling off his parents stuff for drugs or an old lady without a clue. he sold the camera for his price to buy a DSLR, not to get an operation for his kid.
anyone here would have bought it given the opportunity.
FrankS
Registered User
Since we are talking about a collector piece, look at the lens flange screw at the 12 o'clock position (with lens removed) to determine if the camera has ever been serviced. I've read that if the wax seal has an L impressed in it, it is factory original, and I guess to collectors, that would be a good thing. (For a user camera, I'd rather it was cla'ed during it's lifetime!)
bob338
Well-known
the was seal is gone, the camera must have been serviced at some point.FrankS said:
i took a couple of rolls yesterday and just got them back. the shutter speeds seem to be right on, all of my pictures were exposed correctly.
i took a series of pictures with each of the three lenses it came with. i was surpirsed to see that the 35mm summaron is a lot sharper than i had read. the 50 summicron is much sharper than my collapsible but doesn't hold a candle to my current 50 summilux. and the 90 summciron is again a surprisingly good lens. excellent color, plent sharp but it weighs a ton. there was a bride being photographed with the bridge behind her and i took a few candids of her with the 90 that came out beautifully.
i'll post some if anyone's interested...
There is no moral issue here; the seller was pleased with the price and so was the buyer. That's all that matters.
That being said, yes, I'd like to see some of those photos. 🙂
That being said, yes, I'd like to see some of those photos. 🙂
BillBingham2
Registered User
Keep in mind, while we all believe that this should bring in some Big MONKEY Buck wnen/if you go to sell her, I think you did the right thing. You did not try to chew him down, if he did not want to do the research to find out anything about it, such is life. In my mind you can not save the world, you need to focus on your family, yourself and then expand outward. It should be said, I spent a week working near New Orleans the first week of January rebuilding a house. I've given lots of cameras to a crazy photo teacher in Davis CA to help bring kids out of the wrong side. After giving over 10 years of volunteer work the American Red Cross I now am giving time to scouts (I have two sons). If this was the poor wife of the photographer, I would tell her and offer to split the money if I helped her sell (she would get most of it). If the kid looked like he needed money for food, I would tell. This kid wanted a DSLR and with $2K USD can get a fine one. I think Bob can rest easy tonight, he did the right thing.
B2 (;->
B2 (;->
bob338
Well-known
BillBingham2 said:
thanks for the support. i actually edited out of my original post that his house was a VERY nice restored edwardian over in alameda and much nicer than my own house which is in sausalito, so he is not hurting for money.
another thing is that the seller was about 40 with kids and a wife and a nice new laptop sitting on the kitchen table. my point being that he is not a helpless or stupid person. he decided what the camera was worth to him and put it out there for someone to buy. i just happened to be the first person to show up with money. he also told me during our conversation that he just didn't enjoy using the camera, he wanted a modern, fancy dslr to take pictures of his kids playing soccer, not a relic.
i found a recently closed ebay auction for the same camera(the serial is within a few digits of mine!) that sold for $15k. just a simple completed auction search would have revealed this to anyone.
and as far as charity is concerned, my store donates money and our services to a cancer hospice facility.
i'll post some pictures from the camera in a few minutes...
bob338
Well-known
here are some pictures from camera and the three lenses that came with it.
the rotten building was taken with the 35mm summaron
the stop sign with the 90mm summicron
the fence with the 50mm summicron
the two below of the bride and maid of honor were taken with the 90mm summicron
film is fuji pro160c
the rotten building was taken with the 35mm summaron
the stop sign with the 90mm summicron
the fence with the 50mm summicron
the two below of the bride and maid of honor were taken with the 90mm summicron
film is fuji pro160c
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bob338
Well-known
amateriat
We're all light!
Bob: I like to think that the camera was sold at the price it was sold to you for the same reason Garry Winogrand's widow sold his remaining M4 camera to a friend of the family (presumably at a non-collector price): with the idea that the camera would continue to be used as intended, and not as a collector trophy.
Since the camera is now officially yours, you're free to do with it as you wish, and I'll try and pass no judgement on your ultimate decision. But, if only for a while, I say you should hang onto it and photograph with it, get to know it (and those lenses!), and not "flip" that equipment just yet. Explore with the camera. Photograph your newborn with the camera. How about passing it on to your child at the appropriate time? (I'm thinking of a recent Patek-Phillipe slogan, to the effect that you don't actually own one, you merely take care of it for the next generation). It's a creative tool and an heirloom. (Stop making faces at me, ywenz!) 😉 The person who sold it to you might not have been of the utmost market savvy, but I doubt the person was a dummy, and I also like to think you got this outfit at such an outrageously good price for a reason. This, of course, is all my idle speculation from miles away, but it might be something to chew on, if for only a few moments.
I'm thinking of when I was listening to Tom Wisker on the radio (long story...just Google him 🙂) reporting about the last operable P-51A fighter plane being crashed in a recent air show, killing the pilot, and his opining that when the plane you possess is the LAST intact example of its kind, you don't fly it, period. The Leica in your hands is, in all likelihood, NOT the last existing example of its kind, and likely not even the cleanest example. Worth something, to say the least, but as ywenz cooly and cogently put it, worthy of what?
This is a long-winded (yeah, I'm good for that) way of advising that, at least for a while, use the camera as it was intended. And, if you decide to let it go, you'll have some tangible memories of it, for what that's worth...and that's up to all of us, right?
- Barrett
Since the camera is now officially yours, you're free to do with it as you wish, and I'll try and pass no judgement on your ultimate decision. But, if only for a while, I say you should hang onto it and photograph with it, get to know it (and those lenses!), and not "flip" that equipment just yet. Explore with the camera. Photograph your newborn with the camera. How about passing it on to your child at the appropriate time? (I'm thinking of a recent Patek-Phillipe slogan, to the effect that you don't actually own one, you merely take care of it for the next generation). It's a creative tool and an heirloom. (Stop making faces at me, ywenz!) 😉 The person who sold it to you might not have been of the utmost market savvy, but I doubt the person was a dummy, and I also like to think you got this outfit at such an outrageously good price for a reason. This, of course, is all my idle speculation from miles away, but it might be something to chew on, if for only a few moments.
I'm thinking of when I was listening to Tom Wisker on the radio (long story...just Google him 🙂) reporting about the last operable P-51A fighter plane being crashed in a recent air show, killing the pilot, and his opining that when the plane you possess is the LAST intact example of its kind, you don't fly it, period. The Leica in your hands is, in all likelihood, NOT the last existing example of its kind, and likely not even the cleanest example. Worth something, to say the least, but as ywenz cooly and cogently put it, worthy of what?
This is a long-winded (yeah, I'm good for that) way of advising that, at least for a while, use the camera as it was intended. And, if you decide to let it go, you'll have some tangible memories of it, for what that's worth...and that's up to all of us, right?
- Barrett
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bob338
Well-known
so i'm sure a lot of people are wondering what the verdict is...
after speaking to a pretty big(and nice) west coast dealer today, i have decided to keep the set. he told me that the market has kind of leveled off and rare leicas are not going up in price right now. they're not going to go down in price, but they've hit a static level and will probably stay there for awhile. he even has a couple black paint m3s and lenses sitting in the back room waiting for the next swing in value.
i know from conversations with other dealers today that i could sell it very easily for around $15k. my feeling on this is that i'm not hurting for the cash right now so on a money level, it makes sense to sell it down the road. from a purely emotional standpoint, i just want to keep it and know that i have one of the rarest cameras in the leica world. pretty cool.
i do have a couple of other m bodies and several m lenses but i plan to use this camera whenever the urge strikes. i go through phases of using my m2 for awhile then switching to the m3 for a few weeks, so i guess i'll just put this one in the rotation.
some day i may sell it, but for now it'll be right at home here with me.
thanks for all the advice and responses, this has been quite an interesting 24 hours.
i'll post some more detailed pictures of the camera when our new digital arrives in the mail this week.
after speaking to a pretty big(and nice) west coast dealer today, i have decided to keep the set. he told me that the market has kind of leveled off and rare leicas are not going up in price right now. they're not going to go down in price, but they've hit a static level and will probably stay there for awhile. he even has a couple black paint m3s and lenses sitting in the back room waiting for the next swing in value.
i know from conversations with other dealers today that i could sell it very easily for around $15k. my feeling on this is that i'm not hurting for the cash right now so on a money level, it makes sense to sell it down the road. from a purely emotional standpoint, i just want to keep it and know that i have one of the rarest cameras in the leica world. pretty cool.
i do have a couple of other m bodies and several m lenses but i plan to use this camera whenever the urge strikes. i go through phases of using my m2 for awhile then switching to the m3 for a few weeks, so i guess i'll just put this one in the rotation.
some day i may sell it, but for now it'll be right at home here with me.
thanks for all the advice and responses, this has been quite an interesting 24 hours.
i'll post some more detailed pictures of the camera when our new digital arrives in the mail this week.
excellent news 😉
erikhaugsby
killer of threads
Glad to see that such an expensive camera is actually good for taking pictures. 😉
irq506
just curious
Oh, it happens. I work in a shop and we sell a lot of consigned equipment, in the last year we have passed a lot of extremely nice gear through our hands and for the most part the owners dont really care for it anymore. The best story yet has to be a guy who came in with two pre million M3's which he bought for $25 ea at a yard sale had them overhauled by us and then came in a few weeks later to tell us that he sold one for $1000 and the other as a parts body for $700....
gdi
Veteran
LeicaTom
Watch that step!
Don`t SELL it.....USE it!
All this talk about selling and buying new kit is rubbish, throw some rolls though it, the Black M *market* will ALWAYS be there, keep it another 5 years and then SELL it, then you can add another addition to the house, or put the kids through school 🙂
Congrats on your super find, I say the rarer the camera the better the user!
Tom
All this talk about selling and buying new kit is rubbish, throw some rolls though it, the Black M *market* will ALWAYS be there, keep it another 5 years and then SELL it, then you can add another addition to the house, or put the kids through school 🙂
Congrats on your super find, I say the rarer the camera the better the user!
Tom
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MartinP
Veteran
Presumably you have told your wife about this camera ?! After all, it is just a lump of glass and metal and functionally the same as any other M3 (ducks to avoid the things being thrown at me). I hear that in the US it is necessary to pay for your children to go to a good school and (of course) the new child comes first, so the question is one of what the equivalent value could do in some sort of saving-fund (if there are any which won't go broke), versus what the cash-value will be in sixteen years (minus the insurance-payments between now and then). If you do decide to keep the set, it would definitely be wise to insure it for the correct value and buy a strong-box !
Dralowid
Michael
erikhaugsby said:Was it this one?
If it was, that's one incredible lens. 5040 Euros (granted, including the premium)!
Yes, this is it. I regret selling it because it was a once in a lifetime event but you can understand why when you see the money. Having had Leicas since the mid 60s I have come to understand that there is always big money for things of real rarity. This explains why right now I have nothing with a serial number less than 10k. All gone and in their place are things to use and a developing shelffull of black ltm conversions.
Michael
-vin-
Established
now, bob, for the good of your own karma, you should pack that little nice summicron and send it to someone who need it... like me!
you are a lucky guy! sell that collector's item and buy something you really need. or, better, make a journey wit your wife. she won't ask you anymore "why do you need another camera?". 🙂
you are a lucky guy! sell that collector's item and buy something you really need. or, better, make a journey wit your wife. she won't ask you anymore "why do you need another camera?". 🙂
mike goldberg
The Peaceful Pacific
Is really important for you to have "black?" In use, there will be continued brassing.
If you can get "so much" for it, why not do as Frank and some of the guys above have suggested; sell the black M3, keep whatever glass you need [Summaron 35/2.8 is a winner], and put some money into household expenses or a college fund.
You know, I have my bouts of GAS like anyone else 😉 ... Yet, it's a great feeling to sell
gear I'm not using or don't need. With a PayPal surplus, I bought a IIIf.
ZOWIE! I just had a look at the Leitz Anastigmat 50/3.5. I use the "poor man's version," an excellent Fed 50/3.5.
Good luck & good Leica...
If you can get "so much" for it, why not do as Frank and some of the guys above have suggested; sell the black M3, keep whatever glass you need [Summaron 35/2.8 is a winner], and put some money into household expenses or a college fund.
You know, I have my bouts of GAS like anyone else 😉 ... Yet, it's a great feeling to sell
gear I'm not using or don't need. With a PayPal surplus, I bought a IIIf.
ZOWIE! I just had a look at the Leitz Anastigmat 50/3.5. I use the "poor man's version," an excellent Fed 50/3.5.
Good luck & good Leica...
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