Bought My 1St folder, felt I have been cheated.

[scottyb70]

Oh by the way the distance guage on top isn't accurate.

 

[NickTrop]

My one and only dealing with Jurgen was more than fair, for what it's worth. He made a repair on my Iskra in exchange for another "somewhat" rare folder (Agfa with Solinar) that needed bellows. I paid the freight both ways. After a couple months with no camera I got antsy and shot him some polite "where's my stinkin' camera?" emails. He responded promptly and professionally to cool it, it will be on its way soon. The camera came, eventually, and the necessary repair was made.

I understand you point on this one, you paid top dollar for this camera and expected the camera in the ad. However, sometimes cameras that are in better cosmetic condition and not the ones that are in better functional condition.

Certo's a business man. He might have had some reservations about the listed camera - didn't want to disappoint a customer, didn't want to do rework or have the camera returned, or realized you paid a little above the "going rate" and sent out a better camera - legitimately. Sometimes the road to hell is paved with good intentions.

I didn't read all the posts here, but it seems folks have better luck purchasing offerings he puts up for sale directly as opposed to repair. I would seem to me that if someone is sent a camera to repair they will try their best to fix them, as they're obligated to do so, but with cameras this old, it can be dicey. ... As opposed to cameras that are sold directly - if there's any reservation, it becomes a "parts" camera. The last thing someone like Certo6 would want is to do rework on these things.

And, as always, dissatisfied customers (nothing against them, human nature, and I'm the same way) are more vocal than the delighted ones, so the overall "composite" gets to be lopsided.

Hopefully it's a case of "alls well that ends well" and you gotchyerself a fine sample of a wonderful folder, the Certo6.

 

[FallisPhoto]

I had to read what you wrote a couple times here! I wasn’t sure if you were suggesting I was dishonest (stupid me!).

I didn't mean to imply that! Mainly I was just saying that I don't think that Jurgen is, and I think his status as a "god" is entirely self-conferred. I know of half a dozen tinkerers, some of whom are doing this as a sideline business, they are all better than he is at it and they don't charge as much. Of course most of them are using "new old stock" Kodak bellows or Kodak 66 bellows at $5 or $15 each instead of those natty neon-cranberry and neon-blue bellows he uses that cost way more. I used to have a source in Germany for new old stock 6x6 Zeiss bellows myself ($3 each), but unfortunately, he died recently and I just used the last of them.

I do my best to live my life with honesty, integrity and good character. I think when all else is removed that is what we have left.

It is the only thing you can take with you.

I must admit though I was somewhat surprised, shocked and disappointed on the first discovery of pinholes and not impressed with the response.

I should say so! I figure he must be a Northerner, and I figured NYC. Where I live, if a guy called you a liar he could pretty much expect you to walk out of his store and tell everyone you ever heard of not to go there. It surprises me he is able to stay in business with his reputation. Apparently a lot of the people who he has ripped off, insulted, and so on are keeping relatively quiet about it. I think he's doing a quick cosmetic facelift to most of the folders he sells and not really doing much to them internally.

But as I said he eventually accepted the mistake as his own, and I accepted he was human. But true, upon receiving the second with a huge hole that was guaranteed checked first with 300 watts!!!! I was beside myself with “what in the !@#$%^&*&* is going on here. This can not be happening! …With the response I got saying that is was impossible and more+ I have t admit I was less than happy (frankly I was beside myself more than I can describe here; I don’t lie and it was very offensive to me personally. However I felt that if it was a genuine mistake on his behalf then of course he would state such things, after all if I expect to be taken at my word then why can I not do the same for others). To rub salt into the wound I had not mentioned to him where the hole was, and he, in one of his responses mentioned exactly were it in fact was! Whilst it sounds incriminating I thought that perhaps someone with his experience would likely guess the location.

With what I have read here and on many other sites, I'd have to say that I believe it's his honesty that is very much open to question. Oh, there are a few people who are pretty well-known who have ordered cameras from him and he does a very careful job on them, but for ordinary working stiffs I think he just gives the things a lick and a promise and sends them off.

The worst thing from my side of the fence with this particular camera and transaction is I have a patched up bellows camera ( I wanted fine light tight bellows which I thought I paid for) when at least at the beginning were said to be perfect, and then later were going to be replaced (which was acceptable) but later said would only be patched!(not really acceptable) I did not require him or anyone else to patch them! Of course I can do that myself.

The thing is, as I mentioned to him I was concerned he would make a loss out this camera transaction and felt that was possibly a cause for his suggestion at patching instead of replacing the bellows,( however he said that he does this as hobby not a business, so not to be concerned that it would be made right, unfortunately in this instance it was not). I may not have made it clear to him (but I tried) but I would of paid a reasonable negotiated price for any work the camera required, my assumption being that he honestly did not know of the problems and how could he sleep at night if he was loosing money instead of making a few bob.

Sorry, but it sounds to me like you just flat-out got ripped off. A patched bellows is NEVER a permanent fix, it is always temporary. The camera obviously needed new bellows and that is what you should have gotten.

So now because I am determined to put new bellows on this camera it is costing me hundreds upon hundreds of dollars+.

I have bought 2 poor condition welturs (sold for way more than they were worth) with the intention of pulling them apart to see how to place new bellows in them. Then I will send away to Uk bellows or someone to get what I need. This camera cost me something like $400 and will end up costing probably well more than a $1000 with postage and all (probably lots more). Just to put this right!

A bit long winded there I apologise but just trying to give an informed account.

WHOA!!!! Hold it right there! There are "new old stock" Kodak bellows that will fit just about any 6x9 folding camera and they are still commonly available and cheap. I have six of them right now that I paid $10 for last month. Each of them is in like-new condition. Measure your camera's bellows, match them to this guy's sizes, and he'll sell you two or three Kodak replacement bellows that have never been used for $10. http://stores.ebay.com/frendakfurnari_Kodak-Replacement-Bellows_W0QQcolZ4QQdirZ1QQftidZ2QQsclZ0QQtZkm If you measure right, they will work fine in pretty much any 6x9 you've got. Mine (purchased from him) have no wear on them at all and are just as good as new bellows.

For a 6x6 camera in need of new bellows, buy a Kodak 66. They were sold in Europe in the 60s. They are dirt cheap junk, but the 66 has a very nice and very well made bellows and it is easily harvestable, being only held in by four screws. It is pretty much the only part of the camera that is any good. The bellows from those work very nicely in Isolettes and Speedexes.

I can say that I do not believe Jurgen ‘makes’ his own bellows. Whether he has done in the past I can not say but from what he told me he buys them in. I purchased several off him in my initial transaction ( for other cameras such as isolettes) and he conveyed as much and indicated he gave them to me at his cost from his supplier.

I'm just going by what I read on the Classic Camera Repair Forum, where they all say he makes his own. They also say he overcharges and about half of the people who write about him are not happy with his work.

(can you imagine the time involved to, cla shutters and test tham, overhaul cameras in large amounts, culminate lens, and restore every part of them. I guess I may be mistaken but I cant imagine that one person can do all this and have time to run a web site and ebay and sweep the floor and go to the post office every other day. I don’t think I could if was doing nothing else!

I also know he gets others to CLA shutters for whatever reason (I have a receipt from one). Which I can not state for a fact but was my inner feeling why some of the problems may have occurred. He simply didn’t see them! Far fetched maybe! But I have always had trouble believing that the obvious problems went unnoticed by an experienced person, that sort of problem to me as a long term employer and trainer suggests he is covering for people doing the work. Again I must say its only an intuition and quite possibly wrong but I would not be surprised in the slightest

I am more than glad to hear also that rick and also your self are competent. At this point I don’t know either of you personally and don’t know if rick takes work on or just does his own cameras. But no matter in what capacity you guys help I think is first rate.

If you go to his website, and look in the gallery, you will see where he describes his shutter cleaning method. He says he does it himself. http://www.certo6.com/gallery/shutter.html

I must say this was bliss to my ears! Not just someone actually sharing something but in depth knowledge and tips. I can’t thank you enough! Truly! I hope one day I can repay the favour...... I did have look the other day but did not find exactly what the rivets you were referring to were, but found dinky toys and such. However I am not completely familiar with imperial measurements on this small scale (we are metric here) so are not sure what size rivets are compatible with cameras of the nature we are discussing

From my point of view I am now one step closer to fixing a few old cameras that I have and in no way can afford to send them out to fixed.

I use 1/8 inch rivets in an appropriate length (length depends on the camera). Aluminum works best, I think, since it won't corrode or cause "zeiss bumps." Brass will work too, but you need to put some nail polish or paint over it to avoid the aforementioned bumps developing over the years.

So here comes the twist…..not unlike mary mentioned, I too had contacted Jurgen some time back with a question. As a few folk here may know by now I collect the welta camera’s,,,some are more favourite than others. And I have almost every rollflim camera they ever made. But still missing the black weltur 6x4.5! I was at a loss where I could get one from and sent jurgen an email a while back asking if he had one (frankly I was not holding my breath, but I love these things so much, not much is out of the question). Didn’t get a reply. And I wasn’t surprised, as people had mentioned emails seem to go unanswered and I have experienced it also. However to my surprise on this particular day (some time after my inquirery) I did get a response. He had the camera I was after and a very fine example ta boot! Now I am not as we say here trying to ‘suck up’ but simply being straight forward and honest. If I am going to ‘bag’ a guy or state what problems I have encountered then I would be remiss not to say what positives have occurred as well. At any rate I have purchased the camera all is said to correct and right , bellows yarda yarda,,,, we shall see. But further to that I asked a question (ironically one I asked falisphoto in my first draft before the power went out to do with if he knew about a problem , with the film chamber being jammed-not important now) after jurgen went to the time, trouble and effort (and you have to keep in mind here they were not related to cameras he sold me (well maybe the first weltur-it had the same problem). He sent me an email with detail pictures and instruction on how to fix the problem! And it worked! I performed the procedure in minutes. Simple if you know what to do yes, but he did go to the trouble and time to send me email with instruction and pictures. That really was bloody marvellous!

So what do I make of it…well I will reserve judgment this one more time , the thing is I really want this camera I have not been able to get so far. Y find irt hard to believe anyine can be as crooked as it sometimes seems, surely not! If I was to guess I just think he has too much work load and not the time to make every camera perfect………sitting at the emd of my bed with palms pressed I say please GOD let me get a good one

Good luck.

 

[Way]

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WHOA!!!! Hold it right there! There are "new old stock" Kodak bellows that will fit just about any 6x9 folding camera and they are still commonly available and cheap. I have six of them right now that I paid $10 for last month. Each of them is in like-new condition. Measure your camera's bellows, match them to this guy's sizes, and he'll sell you two or three Kodak replacement bellows that have never been used for $10. http://stores.ebay.com/frendakfurnari_Kodak-Replacement-Bellows_W0QQcolZ4QQdirZ1QQftidZ2QQsclZ0QQtZkm If you measure right, they will work fine in pretty much any 6x9 you've got. Mine (purchased from him) have no wear on them at all and are just as good as new bellows.

For a 6x6 camera in need of new bellows, buy a Kodak 66. They were sold in Europe in the 60s. They are dirt cheap junk, but the 66 has a very nice and very well made bellows and it is easily harvestable, being only held in by four screws. It is pretty much the only part of the camera that is any good. The bellows from those work very nicely in Isolettes and Speedexes.

Thanks for the bellows info! Gonna measure my Bessa RF and see which one to get. Unless you already know the size!

 

[FallisPhoto]

Thanks for the bellows info! Gonna measure my Bessa RF and see which one to get. Unless you already know the size!

I don't recall offhand. I'd have to measure again. Also, there are several types of Bessa and I'm not sure they are the same (that first model looks like a cukoo ought to pop out of it at any minute).