Breaking News: Kodak To Raise Prices of Film

[RJBender]

Head way up in the ... sand.

But ok, let's play the 'ignore it until it goes away' game. Sorry I mentioned it, thought people would like to know.

That's some pretty thick denial, bub.

Best Regards,

Bill Mattocks

I'm going to quote a well-known authority, Wiggy Jones:

"Two things - Kodak is DONE with film. Get that through your thick skulls, you morons."

source:http://www.cameramentor.com/blog/

R.J.

 

[bmattock]

Anyway I was hoping digital fury will lower/subside film. What a shame !

Now that, I can agree with. It would be wonderful if a portion of the profits that digital cameras are making was set aside to keep film going even if it does become financially unviable. But I doubt that such things will happen in the dog-eat-dog world of capitalism. Fuji's CEO made some strong statements about supporting their film users, perhaps the mentality in Japan is different - I'd like that very much.

Best Regards,

Bill Mattocks

 

[bmattock]

I'm going to quote a well-known authority, Wiggy Jones:
"Two things - Kodak is DONE with film. Get that through your thick skulls, you morons."

source:http://www.cameramentor.com/blog/

R.J.

Their CEO said so, didn't he?

That Wigwam Jones, he's pretty smart.

But this was not about FID. It was simply an FYI that Kodak has announced a rise in the price of film. That doesn't change Kodak's plans regarding film (ie, it hasn't any).

Let me know where either I or my buddy Wigwam have said anything contradictory.

Best Regards,

Bill Mattocks

 

[Gman]

We should be glad that we still have a few film producers left that we can complain about! Prices for everyone will go up and certain films will eventually be dropped.

We buy 'specialty' 'niche' cameras and film will be in the same category, but I love it still!

Jeff

 

[RJBender]

Ruben, no one is disupting whether film is better than digital. That's not in contention, and not the point here. Silver *is* at a 23 year high in price. Kodak didn't do that, that's the way it is. Silver is required to make film. Higher costs eventually have to be passed on, or the company that uses it will go out of business.

I could get way into the finances of Kodak to prove that you're wrong about where the money is coming from to fund digital research too, but let's leave that be - too many people here have heard too much about it from me, especially.

Best Regards,

Bill Mattocks

TOKYO, April 17 (Reuters) - Gold surged to a new 25-year high on Monday, buoyed by concerns over Iran's nuclear ambitions and surges in oil prices, while silver powered to its highest since May 1983 on hopes for the first silver exchange-traded fund.

Hedge funds and operators investing in the short term were anxious about shifting their funds into gold and silver for the purpose to diversify and to raise higher returns.

Spot gold <XAU=> rose as high as $606.10 an ounce -- the highest since December 1980, while silver <XAG=> rose to $13.33 per ounce, its loftiest since May 1983.

source: http://today.reuters.com/business/n...ingapore on April 11, 2006. REUTERS/Nicky Loh

Ok, Kodak has warehouses of Chinese made film that's not moving so they're going to use this as a reason to jack up their prices. Is this proof that Kodak sucks or what?

R.J.

 

[bmattock]

Ok, Kodak has warehouses of Chinese made film that's not moving so they're going to use this as a reason to jack up their prices. Is this proof that Kodak sucks or what?

R.J.

No, it's not 'proof' of any such thing. Silver didn't go up today - it has been very high for weeks now. Neither you nor I know how much film is sitting unsold in Kodak warehouses in China (but if have access to that information, please share it). What we do not know is how much film, silver, and silver contracts at lower prices that Kodak has to take them out to a point in time when they have to raise prices.

They did not blame the price increase entirely on silver, but they did say that is part of it. Could they be lying? Sure. I don't see any proof in your quote or your statement.

I suppose it will come down to whether or not Ilford, Fuji, etc, raise their prices in the near future to match and also claim increased costs of materials. Of course, they could ALL be lying if that happens, just a case of gouging while the gouging is good.

But no, I don't buy your quote as proof of anything.

If you want to believe Kodak sucks, that's your opinion, and you're welcome to it.

Best Regards,

Bill Mattocks

 

[RJBender]

I had been expecting this - the price of silver has been at or near an 18 year high for weeks now. Spot silver is sky-high, and added to other pressures, Kodak is simply the first to cave. Get ready to hear the same from Fuji and Ilford.

http://www.mediainfo.com/eandp/departments/technology/article_display.jsp?vnu_content_id=1002345150



http://www.localnewsleader.com/elytimes/stories/index.php?action=fullnews&id=176877

This first article refers to Kodak's Graphic Communications Group and the film is the type used for offset printing. They also mention plates, proofing media and chemistry.

Bookmark this page and print it today and once a week thereafter:
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/controller/home?O=NavBar&A=search&Q=&ci=7668

R.J.

 

[ch1]

RJ,

I am surprised at the strongly negative position you are taking toward this.

The price of anything remotely connected to oil is going to keep rising.

Yesterday I paid $3.07/US gallon for premium gasoline.

Today, oil hit (broke?) US$70/barrel.

The ramifications of factors far beyond FID/Kodak etc. are only beginning to filter through the economy.

No one likes "pass along pricing" but it is inevitable.

Anyone want to start a war with Iran? :bang:

 

[bmattock]

This first article refers to Kodak's Graphic Communications Group and the film is the type used for offset printing. They also mention plates, proofing media and chemistry.

Bookmark this page and print it today and once a week thereafter:
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/controller/home?O=NavBar&A=search&Q=&ci=7668

R.J.

Film is made with silver. Plastic substrate is made with petroleum. Trucking film or flying film or transporting film on a boat consumes petroleum fuel. None of these distinguish between film used for offset printing and photography.

In any case:

http://www.tgdaily.com/2006/04/17/eastmankodak_increasingprices_film/

Kodak increases prices on consumer and professional film stock

Humphrey Cheung

April 17, 2006 19:17

Digital photography fans have another reason to gloat over their analog cousins. Eastman Kodak is raising the prices on their consumer, professional and motion picture film stock. Prices will rise between 3% to 17% percent. High energy and silver prices are fueling the increase.

Kodak says the increasing cost of raw materials "can no longer be offset" by the company's productivity programs. Silver has skyrocketed in recent months and is currently trading above $13 an ounce on the New York spot market. Oil has hit $70 a barrel on the New York Mercantile Exchange.

I'm still waiting to see where these unsold stockpiles of film in Chinese warehouses are, or anything that would tend to indicate that Kodak is just making it all up.

Best Regards,

Bill Mattocks

 

[Rick Waldroup]

War with Iran is inevitable as long as the current administration is in power. 2008 is not here yet. I remember that it was just a couple of years ago that 50.00 a barrell for oil was being laughed at. Who is laughing now? It was weapons of mass destruction that led to this current debacle and it will be Iran's nuclear policy that will lead to the next one. All without a sufficient military in place to handle either one. Americans will not really care until it comes right up and bites them on the ass. You would have thought 9-11 would have done that, but then again because of the current administration, that too was a lost opportunity to galvanize this country to a common cause to get the bastards that attacked us, not the petty war that Bush has bestowed upon the country. What a disgrace. Bush's legacy- the illegal war with Iraq, out of control fuel prices, the ineptitude of the relief effort for Katrina victims, and the out and out arrogance of his administration for never being accountable for anything. This makes the Nixon years look like a walk in the park. Impeach, impeach, impeach, impeach..... if we can impeach a President for a BJ in the White House we can damn sure impeach one for crimes against humanity.

 

[SDK]

If you want to be angry, don't blame Kodak. NPR's Marketplace reported that there has been a lot of speculation in the precious metals market recently. Gold, silver and copper are all way up from what they were recently due to investor activity. It will pass, and the prices will go down when the market cycles change. I remember this happening in the 70's when I minded the counter at my mom's and aunts' photo & music store. Film prices soared, customers grumbled, but Kodak kept selling.

I have lots of film on hand but I better stock up on Kodak RA4 paper.

 

[RJBender]

RJ,

I am surprised at the strongly negative position you are taking toward this.

The price of anything remotely connected to oil is going to keep rising.

Yesterday I paid $3.07/US gallon for premium gasoline.

Today, oil hit (broke?) US$70/barrel.

The ramifications of factors far beyond FID/Kodak etc. are only beginning to filter through the economy.

No one likes "pass along pricing" but it is inevitable.

Anyone want to start a war with Iran? :bang:

Yes, George, I am very cynical about this.

On a positive note, I heard about the great deals on Walgreen's AGFA film right here on RFF !


R.J.

 

[bmattock]

If you want to be angry, don't blame Kodak. NPR's Marketplace reported that there has been a lot of speculation in the precious metals market recently. Gold, silver and copper are all way up from what they were recently due to investor activity. It will pass, and the prices will go down when the market cycles change. I remember this happening in the 70's when I minded the counter at my mom's and aunts' photo & music store. Film prices soared, customers grumbled, but Kodak kept selling.

I have lots of film on hand but I better stock up on Kodak RA4 paper.

You bring up a good point that some here will remember. Back in the 1970's, the Hunt brothers tried to corner the market on silver by buying up all the futures contracts and letting them expire, taking delivery of the actual silver. It didn't work, and as I recall the Hunt brothers went to prison for awhile, but I recall reading about the fear gripping all shutterbugs - film went quite high for awhile. It did eventually come back down again.

I can see one pressure that changes the outlook that was not present in the 1970s, but I'll leave that alone.

Best Regards,

Bill Mattocks

 

[SDK]

Bill, I'm sure you're right, not everything is the same as in the late 1970's as far as pressures on petroleum and precious metals. There is less silver accessible in unmined materials now. The wars going on are different. Digital alternatives exist that did not before. But the market will probably fluctuate up and down. We'll just see.

I wonder if the cost of silver solder will slow the economization of digital cameras. Apparently the cost of converting from lead to silver solder helped the decision to kill the Hasselblad Xpan series, but it might only retard the deflation of digicams.

Even if silver goes down, film prices might stay up a while. As I recall, Kodak was slow to lower prices after the Hunt silver market effect ended. It was increasing competition from Fuji that made them lower prices, an effect that may not repeat.

 

[RJBender]

Film is made with silver. Plastic substrate is made with petroleum. Trucking film or flying film or transporting film on a boat consumes petroleum fuel. None of these distinguish between film used for offset printing and photography.

In any case:

http://www.tgdaily.com/2006/04/17/eastmankodak_increasingprices_film/


I'm still waiting to see where these unsold stockpiles of film in Chinese warehouses are, or anything that would tend to indicate that Kodak is just making it all up.

Best Regards,

Bill Mattocks

"Kodak reduces the carrying value of its inventory based on estimates of what is excess, slow-moving and obsolete, as well as inventory whose carrying value is in excess of net realizable value. These write-downs are based on current assessments about future demands, market conditions and related management initiatives. If, in the future, the Company determined that market conditions and actual demands are less favorable than those projected and, therefore, inventory was overvalued, the Company would be required to further reduce the carrying value of the inventory and record a charge to earnings at the time such determination was made. If, in the future, the Company determined that inventory write-downs were overstated and, therefore, inventory was undervalued, the Company would recognize the increase to earnings through higher gross profit at the time the related undervalued inventory was sold. However, actual results have not differed materially from management's estimates.

On January 1, 2006, the Company elected to change its method of costing its U.S. inventories to the FIFO method, whereas in all prior years most of Kodak's inventory in the U.S. was costed using the LIFO method. "

source: http://biz.yahoo.com/e/060302/ek10-k.html

So, if film costs more to produce this year, that's good for Kodak's net income now that they are using the FIFO method. Examples HERE.


R.J.

 

[ch1]

"Kodak reduces the carrying value of its inventory based on estimates of what is excess, slow-moving and obsolete, as well as inventory whose carrying value is in excess of net realizable value. These write-downs are based on current assessments about future demands, market conditions and related management initiatives. If, in the future, the Company determined that market conditions and actual demands are less favorable than those projected and, therefore, inventory was overvalued, the Company would be required to further reduce the carrying value of the inventory and record a charge to earnings at the time such determination was made. If, in the future, the Company determined that inventory write-downs were overstated and, therefore, inventory was undervalued, the Company would recognize the increase to earnings through higher gross profit at the time the related undervalued inventory was sold. However, actual results have not differed materially from management's estimates.

On January 1, 2006, the Company elected to change its method of costing its U.S. inventories to the FIFO method, whereas in all prior years most of Kodak's inventory in the U.S. was costed using the LIFO method. "

source: http://biz.yahoo.com/e/060302/ek10-k.html

So, if film costs more to produce this year, that's good for Kodak's net income now that they are using the FIFO method. Examples HERE.


R.J.

Now RJ this is all well and good.

But could it be that this thread has another purpose?

Someone sitting on a ton and a half load of film would benefit from this announcement perhaps?

Oh. BTW, I see on another thread that Rite Aid is selling ISO 200 or 400's @ 24 exp. for $1 per roll provided you buy 2 packs of 4 each. 😎

 

[RJBender]

😀

RJ,

I am surprised at the strongly negative position you are taking toward this.

The price of anything remotely connected to oil is going to keep rising.

Yesterday I paid $3.07/US gallon for premium gasoline.

Today, oil hit (broke?) US$70/barrel.

The ramifications of factors far beyond FID/Kodak etc. are only beginning to filter through the economy.

No one likes "pass along pricing" but it is inevitable.
Anyone want to start a war with Iran? :bang:

Good point, George. No one likes to, especially the consumer. How many people will be asking their employers for a 20% pay increase because it costs them more to drive to work?

R.J.

 

[BrianShaw]

How many people will be asking their employers for a 20% pay increase because it costs them more to drive to work?
.

Yup... I can hear the answer already!

 

[Trius]

Well, I'm going to stock up now. I don't begrudge any company having to raise prices, for whatever reason. I am certain that Kodak would not be doing this if it were not necessary. I can assure you that life-long Kodakers who have given all their efforts to analog photography are feeling a lot of pain.

It's interesting though. As globalization in the name of lower production costs expands, overall prices keep rising. Some of the cheap goods from low-cost manufacturing come complete with safety hazards and fake listing labels. OK, I know this bit is OT, and I really don't want to hijack the thread. But I'm just not in a really good mood today. Sorry all.

 

[RJBender]

Now RJ this is all well and good.

But could it be that this thread has another purpose?

Someone sitting on a ton and a half load of film would benefit from this announcement perhaps?

Oh. BTW, I see on another thread that Rite Aid is selling ISO 200 or 400's @ 24 exp. for $1 per roll provided you buy 2 packs of 4 each. 😎

Uhhhh.... another FID alert?

I saw some 24 Exp Konica Minolta film at the Dollar Tree the other day. I forgot what the price was.

R.J.