Cannonet QL 17 - GIII with foggy pictures

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toolzinho

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Hello, for some time I've been playing with my cannonet but not getting the results I wanted. At first I thought the fault was my scanner which only makes a max of 1200dpi.
The thing is that I get some kind of blurry image and can't get a good "bokeh" even at the 1.7 aperture... After I looked at the optics they seemed fine, but when the camera was in an angle I could see some strange thing in the lens front elements. I took it apart thinking it was some type of fungus and almost cried when I saw that my optics may be the fault part in my pictures...
It looked like the lens was scratched, but not a live scratch like a cut... it was something more like the glass being foggy... I can't explain it better :bang: Can the problem be from that? But on the other hand could it be a RF problem? I have a FED 5 and a Zorki 4 and never had problems focusing, but the mechanism can be off measurements, right?

Example:
Here I could get a some "bokeh"
http://www.flickr.com/photos/toolzinho/8664515396/in/set-72157633281359073/

Here the image looks foggy... shot taken at f/16
http://www.flickr.com/photos/toolzinho/8664515710/in/set-72157633281359073/


Here I used f/5 ... and looks foggy... the pidgeons are almost unnoticeable and was a relatively close shot
http://www.flickr.com/photos/toolzinho/8663417953/in/set-72157633281359073

The chimne is blurred... at f/16
http://www.flickr.com/photos/toolzinho/8663417781/in/set-72157633281359073/

Can someone please guess what's the problem? Thanks
 
It looks to my mostly untrained eye that the worst affected area is in the center, which makes me think that lens flare could be a part of the problem. Flare will be worse if the lens is scratched, fogged, or dirty. Are you using a lens hood?

It's possible the RF is out of adjustment. It is relatively easy to adjust on this camera; I seem to recall finding decent instructions somewhere on the web.
 
I'm not using a hood... But what you said is consistent with what I said so the center of the lens is more likely the problem :\
Regarding the RF, I think that I need to take the top plate in order to adjust the RF mechanism...
 
It depends sometimes on the angle of the light entering the lens. If you are pointing more into the sun, then you will get more flare from the haze on the elements. That is where a hood comes in handy. But you do need to clean the lens inside and out, and then maybe a little tweaking of the rangefinder, just to be sure. And get some Photo-Flo (or other anti-spotting solution), and a squeegee to get rid of the water spots on the negs.

PF
 
Thanks for the suggestions, I know I should use some photo-flo, but the squeege I never used because I'm afraid to scratch the negs... Usually after the development I give it a good rinse and let them dry in a "safe environment".

I have checked the RF mechanism and in infinity on the lens I see the 2 images overlaping just right, so I guess the mechanism is OK. Right?

The haze on the lens is physical... The front element glass looks a bit worn... That's the best way I can describe it.

I think I'm going to ask someone to scan the negatives on other scanner, that way I can start to isolate problems and really see what is going on... Scanning with a 10 year old scanner with just 1200 dpi for 24x36mm compared to the 4000's and more of the Epson scanners might give me the sharpness I want.
 
Jon Goodman Light seal kit and rangefinder adjust

Jon Goodman Light seal kit and rangefinder adjust

When you buy a Jon Goodman light seal kit, you get the easily installed self-adhesive, proper foam type light seals sized to fit, with explicit instructions.

IN ADDITION he encloses a very well written instruction on adjusting the Canonet QL17 and/or GIII rangefinder. Easy to follow.

JGood21967@aol.com

I mentioned this yesterday on another forum. When I want a Canonet QL17 or GIII, I go to www.shopgoodwill.com. I always find 1 or more.. .always. There is a GIII right now, and I have often found 3-4 listed at the same time. Iffy on info and function, but they have improved their pictures, so while it's a bit risky the prices are usually low. As I recall the front element is not a big job to replace, but the entire lens assembly is a PITA.. serious PITA (for me). Cheaper time wise to go to SGW and grab another.

HEY... Canon only sold somewhat over 1.2 million of these between 1972 and 1982.

You might find a good inexpensive Canonet on SGW, or you at least may find one with a good front element. Use a hood on this camera. Please. It is not very flare resistant and has some relatively big glass on front.
 
What you probably have on your lens is a lot of cleaning marks. It's really hard to guess without seeing the lens in person. If the 2 images are lining up at infinity then I wouldn't mess with the rf adjustment.
 
toolzinho said:
Thanks for the suggestions, I know I should use some photo-flo, but the squeege I never used because I'm afraid to scratch the negs... Usually after the development I give it a good rinse and let them dry in a "safe environment".
Click to expand...

You got to get that excess water off those negs before you hang them up. I have better luck with Dawn dish washing liquid than I do when I use Photo flo. I use my 2 fingers to slide the film through to get the excess water off. Never have a problem with scratching.
 
Fog will cause this. Best thing you could do is underexpose a stop or make sure that exposures are perfect.

I have the same problems with my summicron with a slightly fogged front element.

This is slightly corrected too believe it or not.


Untitled by nownownownow, on Flickr

But when stopped down the lens performs perfectly. I'l using a hood too btw.


Untitled by nownownownow, on Flickr

Im finding that shots can be hit and miss. It's just the character of the lens. Shame though the QL17 isnt usually a very sharp lens so its not really worth it to me to keep shooting with it. Just sold it this morning actually.
 
I have a nice clean Canon GIII but no hood but I have no issues with flare or foggy, OOF pictures. Sure hope yours is sorted to so you can enjoy it- it's a beauty of a camera.
 
gb hill said:
You got to get that excess water off those negs before you hang them up. I have better luck with Dawn dish washing liquid than I do when I use Photo flo. I use my 2 fingers to slide the film through to get the excess water off. Never have a problem with scratching.

What you probably have on your lens is a lot of cleaning marks. It's really hard to guess without seeing the lens in person. If the 2 images are lining up at infinity then I wouldn't mess with the rf adjustment.
Click to expand...

Yes I do that with my fingers too... Yes, maybe the previous owner worn the glass out cleaning it... I would love to show the "effect" but unfortunately its to difficult to capture on my digital... I'll try tomorrow again... And yes the RF is accurate. What I would like to know is where I can get a tool to get the second element out... I can get the front one but the second element is giving a head ache... And since I love this camera I don't wanna ruin it 😀
 
kuzano said:
When you buy a Jon Goodman light seal kit, you get the easily installed self-adhesive, proper foam type light seals sized to fit, with explicit instructions.

IN ADDITION he encloses a very well written instruction on adjusting the Canonet QL17 and/or GIII rangefinder. Easy to follow.

JGood21967@aol.com

I mentioned this yesterday on another forum. When I want a Canonet QL17 or GIII, I go to www.shopgoodwill.com. I always find 1 or more.. .always. There is a GIII right now, and I have often found 3-4 listed at the same time. Iffy on info and function, but they have improved their pictures, so while it's a bit risky the prices are usually low. As I recall the front element is not a big job to replace, but the entire lens assembly is a PITA.. serious PITA (for me). Cheaper time wise to go to SGW and grab another.

HEY... Canon only sold somewhat over 1.2 million of these between 1972 and 1982.

You might find a good inexpensive Canonet on SGW, or you at least may find one with a good front element. Use a hood on this camera. Please. It is not very flare resistant and has some relatively big glass on front.
Click to expand...

I can't open the site...
I'm from Portugal... It was a problem to get this camera at a reasonable price from USA, because on the bay they are being sold too over priced... Yes I'll try to get a hood, but the second element is really foggy... So it can't be cleaning scratches... I need to disassemble it but I need the right tool and can't find it.
 
This is the place for most needed camera tools. They have a European division, so you don't have to worry about having things shipped overseas. http://www.micro-tools.com/store/home.aspx

I don't think ShopGoddwill.com does international sales, so that may be why you can't get into the site.

Flea markets, or boot sales are the best place to get cameras cheap.

PF
 
farlymac said:
This is the place for most needed camera tools. They have a European division, so you don't have to worry about having things shipped overseas. http://www.micro-tools.com/store/home.aspx

I don't think ShopGoddwill.com does international sales, so that may be why you can't get into the site.

Flea markets, or boot sales are the best place to get cameras cheap.

PF
Click to expand...

Thanks 🙂 looks like the one that I need is out of stock and the other wrench that can replace it is way to pricey... At flea markets you can grab cheap cameras but with worse optics than mine is at the moment :/
And thanks to the guys at lomography and their marketing machine, film cameras are really over priced now... I hear storys of guys grabbing Canonets 17 for $10 at thrift stores in the states... The cheaper that I saw here in Portugal was around 80€ or $90...
 
toolzinho said:
Thanks 🙂 looks like the one that I need is out of stock and the other wrench that can replace it is way to pricey... At flea markets you can grab cheap cameras but with worse optics than mine is at the moment :/
And thanks to the guys at lomography and their marketing machine, film cameras are really over priced now... I hear storys of guys grabbing Canonets 17 for $10 at thrift stores in the states... The cheaper that I saw here in Portugal was around 80€ or $90...
Click to expand...

Well, being a consumerist society, Canon likely sold more here in the States than anywhere else. So they are like acorns in an oak forest.

PF
 
farlymac said:
Well, being a consumerist society, Canon likely sold more here in the States than anywhere else. So they are like acorns in an oak forest.

PF
Click to expand...


Yep I believe so... Mine came from the States... I love this camera because it is small and fits my bag, if anyone finds one in good state and cheap there, I wouldn't mind paying and getting it shipped over here... 🙂
 
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