Canon P loose film door and squeaky film advance

[madeleineostoja]

I recently picked up a Canon P and I love it. It’s in almost perfect condition, there are just a few totally superficial things I’d like to fix up.

One is the film door. It’s a bit rickety and loose, wobbling about when I press it. Is this normal for the Canon P? I thought it might be since it doesn’t have light seals.

The other is a squeaky film advance. I assume something needs to be lubed somewhere, is this a DIYable job, or should I start trying to find someone that would attempt a CLA?

The 1 second shutter speed also sticks, but I can’t think of a time I’ve ever used it so I’m not too fussed.

 

[Phil_F_NM]

Does the film advance squeak without film in the camera or just with film loaded?
As for the back door, this camera should have light seal material in the channels and over by the hinge.

Phil Forrest

 

[madeleineostoja]

It squeaks loaded or unloaded, no change in sound or feel.

And odd! I read that it didn’t need seals, and I haven’t had any light leaks, but I also haven’t scanned my first roll yet (negs currently drying), so I’ll know for sure soon

 

[madeleineostoja]

This thread suggests it doesn’t need seals, just a wee square of velvet on the hinge (which mine has)

https://www.rangefinderforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=68739

 

[twvancamp]

I hope this isn't the case for you, but I had a P with a squeaky advance, it went back and forth to a repair shop twice but it was not solved. I never figured out the issue.

Hopefully, it is solvable on yours. I don't believe the film door should be loose.

 

[Dan Daniel]

When you say that the door is loose, do you mean that after it is closed, you can make it move in and out by pressing? Maybe the latches at the end are out of adjustment. Or do you mean that it wobbles all over, as if the hinge pin is sloppy?

The latches can be tightened but it's hard to explain and the kind of thing that if you need it explained you'd probably make a mess the first time you do it. Involves basically punching metal to reshape it. You can see the latches at the opening end as they hold the two pins on the door in place. Most likely light punches will lead to the latches moving that 1/10th mm needed, but it might not. Maybe opening up the mechanism will reveal better adjustment points on the plate itself.

I'd make certain that the velvet at the hinge end is there first. Maybe it being work out is leaving enough slop to ripple through the whole door and make it feel loose.

The squeaky wind just in need of lube. Getting to the lube spots is not simple. You need to remove the bottom plate and the top plate.

 

[retinax]

The squeaky wind just in need of lube. Getting to the lube spots is not simple. You need to remove the bottom plate and the top plate.

Can you elaborate please? Owner of another squeaky Canon P here.
Funny how now everyone seems to agree on no light seals, I seem to recall having asked the same question and being told by several people that "of course it needs seals" 😀 I did put black yarn in the grooves, it works, but it also worked on my test roll without.

 

[GMOG]

Can you elaborate please?

This might help:

http://www.pentax-manuals.com/manuals/service/canon_p_repair.pdf

 

[retinax]

This might help:

http://www.pentax-manuals.com/manuals/service/canon_p_repair.pdf

Thanks, I know that manual and have tinkered around with the P. I'd like to know specifically where and how to lube for the squeaks.

 

[Dan Daniel]

Thanks, I know that manual and have tinkered around with the P. I'd like to know specifically where and how to lube for the squeaks.

I can't give specific spots. I just watched the motion and started applying light oil, lightly!, to areas of potential squeaks. Starting from largest bearing/rotating surface. Working out to smaller gears and such. Check for ratchets and pawls and light springs and avoid getting oil in them and make them hang up. I think that there are a couple of layers of gearing and pawls going on, one taking care of film motion and one taking care of shutter cocking. Focus on the film motion- this is the grosser movement that will lead to true squeaking.

I am assuming that the shutter curtains are not squeaking when fired. That's another ball game.

I think that the real action is up top. The bottom bearing is more a necessary stabilizer, not playing much if any role in frame spacing, shutter cocking, etc.

Short answer: apply oil until it stops squeaking. Sort of like Dorothy and the Tin Man in the Wizard of Oz.

 

[retinax]

Thanks for the link to the video. It is very useful to someone who wants to use 135 film in their medium format camera for shooting panoramic images.

Thankfully, I have never needed to use my Fuji GSW690 as a panoramic camera with 135 film because my RB67 does a better job.

The GSW690 fixed 65mm f/5.6 lens produces a 6x9cm image with an angle-of-view that is equivalent to a 28mm lens on a 35mm camera. The RB with a 50mm f/4.5 lens produces a 6x7cm image with an angle-of-view that is equivalent to a 24mm lens on a 35mm camera.

The RB has an interchangeable film back feature that the GSW690 lacks. At the end of the 135 roll, if I need to continue shooting, I simply replace the RB back with a spare preloaded back. When I get home, I remove the exposed 35mm film from the 220 back in the darkroom. I either immediately develop the film or I store the exposed film in a light-tight container and develop it later.

The Fuji image counter only goes up to 16 on the 220 setting. The RB67 image counter on the 220 back goes up to 20.

Also, instead of 3D spacers, I simply cut the ends off a plastic 120 film spool and used those ends as spacers for my 135mm film in my RB67 220 back.


35mm film in RB67 by Narsuitus, on Flickr

Of course he wasn't allowed to photograph freely. But the magazine editors could have chosen not to show photographs that seem to, at least superficially, glorify or romanticise the SU, or could have added commentary on how the photographs aren't representative. Instead, the absurdities of the SU are only hinted at, in the pictures as well as in the text, like where it says that only a small upper class can afford certain items of clothing. This cautious approach of course makes sense as they wanted HCB or others to be allowed to report from the SU or brother states again.
Nonetheless I'm somewhat impressed that during those times of stuffy anti-communism, the readers of life magazine were shown these pictures pretty much without ideological "guidance". Something that seems to happen less nowadays. Some people condemn today's media for taking a stance, rather than just "giving us the facts". I don't generally follow this idea, as I don't believe there's very often such a thing as pure facts. But this gives food for thought. Life magazine is just showing the pictures, even though they very clearly aren't the whole picture, and even more so could almost be seen as pro-SU propaganda by the right. It was a different time. I wouldn't have thought the readers would be given so much credit to make of the pictures what the wanted - but I applaud it. Maybe my idea of how intense anti-communism was at the time is just exaggerated.

I can't give specific spots. I just watched the motion and started applying light oil, lightly!, to areas of potential squeaks. Starting from largest bearing/rotating surface. Working out to smaller gears and such. Check for ratchets and pawls and light springs and avoid getting oil in them and make them hang up. I think that there are a couple of layers of gearing and pawls going on, one taking care of film motion and one taking care of shutter cocking. Focus on the film motion- this is the grosser movement that will lead to true squeaking.

I am assuming that the shutter curtains are not squeaking when fired. That's another ball game.

I think that the real action is up top. The bottom bearing is more a necessary stabilizer, not playing much if any role in frame spacing, shutter cocking, etc.

Short answer: apply oil until it stops squeaking. Sort of like Dorothy and the Tin Man in the Wizard of Oz.

Thanks, I've just opened it up and am now certain my noise actually comes from the shutter drum. Applied a little grease on advance gears anyway. Not sure if oil is great for the job, at least use a viscous one. Of course grease won't migrate into the critical areas if applied without any disassembly... Maybe a sort of slightly flowing grease, similar to bike chain grease, could work...