cheap medium format coupled rangefinder

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zzzxtreme

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hello. good day. I apologise in advance if I posted in wrong section.

I need some recommendation on small, robust, coupled medium format rangefinder. I would like something 50mm or wider (in 135/35mm speak) and also pretty large viewfinder. It should have a hot or coldshoe so I can mount a sekonic L208 or Voigtlander VC Meter. 645,6x6, 6x7 or 6x9 doesn't matter.

Any help would be greatly appreciated.
 
all super ikontas have coupled rangefinders.

i also recommend the manual fuji 6x4.5 cameras. well priced with nice viewfinders and metering.

fuji gs645
fuji gs645s
fuji gs645w
 
Balda Super Baldax. Similar specs to a Super Ikonta but can often be had a lot cheaper. I used one for a bit, they're very nice. Helical focusing which is actually an improvement over the Ikonta.
 
How important is "small"? Because there are some good rigid cameras such as the Graflex XL.

Also, what's "cheap"?

Finally, the vast majority of roll-film folders are now either old or very old, and more will depend on condition than on exactly which model you buy.

Cheers,

R.
 
Roger Hicks said:
How important is "small"? Because there are some good rigid cameras such as the Graflex XL.

Also, what's "cheap"?

Finally, the vast majority of roll-film folders are now either old or very old, and more will depend on condition than on exactly which model you buy.

Cheers,

R.
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thanks roger. I thought I could find decent ones with clean lens for around $150. but it seems impossible. The usual japanese ebay sellers with "EXCELLENT" in the title also mentions tiny fog, tiny haze etc..

size I guess it not a priority as much as price :D
 
zzzxtreme said:
thanks roger. I thought I could find decent ones with clean lens for around $150. but it seems impossible. The usual japanese ebay sellers with "EXCELLENT" in the title also mentions tiny fog, tiny haze etc..

size I guess it not a priority as much as price :D
Click to expand...

You need to step up to the 'near Mint' class! Just be careful since many have fungus.
 
Really cheap and good quality mf rf is a soviet KMZ Iskra. 6x6, bright coupled viewfinder-rangefinder, Tessar-style Industar-58 3,5/75, good shutter with lots of speeds. I could easly shoot 1/8 handheld without motion blur. Very nice camera.
 
zzzxtreme said:
thanks roger. I thought I could find decent ones with clean lens for around $150. but it seems impossible. The usual japanese ebay sellers with "EXCELLENT" in the title also mentions tiny fog, tiny haze etc..

size I guess it not a priority as much as price :D
Click to expand...
"Excellent" is definitely a bit of a movable feast. Personally I'd go for scale focus: it really doesn't take long to learn to estimate distances accurately. See also the piece on my .eu site about a 4€ (£3, $5) Ikonta 523/19. Ikontas are scale-focus; Super Ikontas have coupled rangefinders.

If you're in it for the tonality, go for the largest format you can, ideally 6x9.

Cheers,

R.
 
kotokot21 said:
Really cheap and good quality mf rf is a soviet KMZ Iskra. 6x6, bright coupled viewfinder-rangefinder, Tessar-style Industar-58 3,5/75, good shutter with lots of speeds. I could easly shoot 1/8 handheld without motion blur. Very nice camera.
Click to expand...

A good Iskra is indeed a superb camera, but because they were so cheap for so long, many attracted the attention of amateur "repairers". Which is why I stress "good".

Cheers,

R.
 
Hard to beat the GS645 in terms of design, feature and optical quality. Especially the last one - It sports a lens that would be considered too luxurious for the format back in the days when folders were popular.
 
Yes, steer clear of the Japanese sellers and their misleading condition statements. That's good that you spotted their so called excellent items are anything but.

You've gotten some good suggestions here. A Super Ikonta or the like is your best bet, as their bellows are usually light tight. Beware of any Soviet camera for a million reasons, and the Fuji rangefinders are not repairable if the shutters go out, and they do. KEH refunded my money on one after the second time they attempted to fix it because there are no longer any parts for them.

I believe that Arbitraium meant to say that the Super Baldax cameras have unit focusing, compared to the helical front element focusing on most cameras.
 
I've had a few of the Fujis (GS645, GS645W, GA645), a brace of the Zeiss Ikon Super Ikontas (645, 6x6, 6x9 models, can't remember the designations), a Balda Baldax (scale focus), and a Voigtländer Perkeo II (scale focus) over the past 25 years. All are gone now except the Perkeo II, for which I found a nice clip-on Voigtländer rangefinder (as well as a couple of others!).

The Perkeo II has been my favorite MF compact/folder for some years now. It has an excellent lens and folds up very small and light, with a quality feel that is the equal of the Super Ikontas but much lighter. I had it overhauled (cleaned, a couple of rusty bits replaced, etc) a few years back to solve some minor issues with the film transport, so it now feels like a new camera. The lack of a coupled rangefinder means it's a bit slower working, but it also means it's likely a bit more reliable.

I think I paid $125 for the Perkeo II when I got it, but the overhaul cost about $170. That's not too bad for an EXC+ camera now sixty-five years old with this level of quality.

info: http://camerapedia.wikia.com/wiki/Voigtländer_Perkeo_II

G
 
I think the Mamiya Super 23 is a bargain. It takes a variety of lenses, on the wide end there's a 65mm that's not terribly expensive (the viewfinder costs a bit though), a 90mm and 150mm are commonplace. It takes interchangeable backs 6x4.5 to 6x9, including a sheet film adapter. It's rangefinder coupled, of course. It's a press camera, so it's hand holdable as long as you have the handle (still a bit heavy though).
 
My two cents, no binding on anyone else. I have had good luck with old Welta cameras, both in 35mm and 6x6, surprisingly, Fujica 6x6 folders. But as Mr. Hicks correctly points out, any of the older cameras are getting harder to find in good shape. They are old. If you find one in good shape, you will probably like it. Any Moskva is a crap shoot as to its usable condition. My son-in-law has a Moskva 4, like other Moskvas, a 6x9. It is in good condition and he enjoys it and its 6x9 format.

Mr. Hicks also mentioned non-RF cameras. I think that is an excellent suggestion if you can give up the RF. I learned in high school how to estimate distance. I think most anyone can. I have a Zeiss folding 6x9 with Novar lens. Very light (no RF) and thin. The Novar lens is quite good. Surprisingly so in fact. One drawback from you list is no flash. The Moskvas do seem to have that. I used to disdain 6x9, but in the last three-five years I have really come to appreciate it.

Again, the good old folders were good when they were made, but may at least need a good CLA by now, or in worst case, may be unusable from mistreatment. If you really want one, be prepared to spend money on a CLA, or have to buy and sell a few until you get what you really like.
 
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