Dakar

[Screwy]

Whilst I enjoy the Dakar , when it comes to balls out racing Moto GP and World Superbike are hard to beat (Owning a Ducati does colour my opinion though )

This years Moto GP had everything , from heart stopping crash,s to edge of the seat finish,s and it all came down to the last race of the season . Was it going to be Rossi or was Nicky Hayden finally going to bring the moto GP crown back to America ? Just a shame UK riders are a spent force in moto GP

As for Superbike , just watching Ducati take the crown back was worth watching



Paul

 

[ClaremontPhoto]

Also this just a minor peeve of mine but the rally is no longer the Paris-to-Dakar Rally - it is just the Dakar Rally.

It starts in Lisbon next weekend, as it did last year.

 

[Hiyawaan]

Don't give me that moto GP's better than Dakar cowshizzer. Dakar then Moto GP, OK, I jest, its a tough call on that one....Valentino Rossi would agree! He's the man, my Idol, The Doctor!!! even if he's on a crap bike. What duck do you ride Screwy?

 

[mw_uio]

I found this about the history of the Dakar.

http://www.dakar.com/2007/DAK/presentation/docs/histo__1979_2005_gb.pdf

I always admired Fabrizio Menoi. He was a adventurous Italian rider for KTM who passed away in 2005.

Here are photos of Menoi.
http://www.fabriziomeoni.it/fm/ns.asp?wci=wnst&lng=1040&cur=3057&did=4


Mark
Quito, EC

 

[JonathanA]

For me the Dakar rally is just another example of the worlds priorities...

1) Money
2) Fam
3) Other people's lives

How would you like it if some foreigners came and shredded up your backyard...?

 

[Screwy]

Don't give me that moto GP's better than Dakar cowshizzer. Dakar then Moto GP, OK, I jest, its a tough call on that one....Valentino Rossi would agree! He's the man, my Idol, The Doctor!!! even if he's on a crap bike. What duck do you ride Screwy?

I'm afraid I'm a Cappirossi fan myself though I will give the Doctor his due ,he's a magician on a motorcycle .

My ducks an old 851 superbike with a later 888 engine shoehorned in ,way more performance than I'll ever use , lumpy at small throttle opening's , open clutch sounds like a terminal engine failure and the open cans sound like Armageddon so I have to trickle through built up area's on a trailing throttle . But it's a dream to ride on the open road



Paul

 

[Nando]

How would you like it if some foreigners came and shredded up your backyard...?

The Dakar for many years crossed disputed land in the former Spanish colony of Western Sahara without permission of all parties involved. The government Sahrawi Arab Democratic Republic (SADR) wasn't consulted when ran through the Western Sahara. It is the defacto state government in that land but its largely unrecognized except by other African countries. I believe that the southern provinces of Morocco are in dispute. Imagine somebody organizing a crazy race through your neighbourhood without consulting and obtaining permission from the local government. (Actually this happens more often than you would think even in North America and in Europe) I think it was around 5 years ago or so was when the Dakar organizers finally received formal permission to cross the Western Sahara from the SADR. The arrogance and ignorance shown by the organizers has always been appalling.

One also has to understand that adventure, rebelliousness, danger (or carelessness), and most of all, insanity, are fundamental factors that attract people to motorsport. Both to participate in motorsport and to watch it as a spectator or on TV. Craig Breedlove, for example, had to be insane when he decided to purchase a jet engine from the US Military to build and then drive the fastest car in the world had ever seen but now he's a hero. Many people, drivers and spectators, have been killed in motorsport. Motorsport have also negatively affected many environments. However most people involved in motorsport are oblivious to those things as they are grossly overshadowed by the quest for speed, glory and women. Of course, for the organizers, its the money. Yes, its insane but that's motorsport. It's just about as insane as flying men to the moon so they could drive around in a car, take photos of each other and play a round of golf just to show the communists how good life is in the USA. It may have been stupid but showed the triumph of the human spirit.

 

[Hiyawaan]

How would you like it if some foreigners came and shredded up your backyard...?

Well as a Palestinian, I can say they came, they shredded and never left. At least in the Dakar when it over they have the courtesy to F-off !

If you have a problem with the Dakar why not write to them, let them know that you care, that you have trouble sleeping at night. If you did why don't you post an address so that other who are so inclined can do the same?
Now back to serious matters...

Screwy,

that's a beautiful bike. A few things about Italian bikes,

lumpy at small throttle opening's

= drive faster your bike's got racing pedigree and it's Italian. Fuel/air mix?

While I know ducks have dry clutches I didn't think the clutch made the noise. The source of the horrendous noise comes from the gears that time the valves, most rice rockets use internal chains the ducks use gears, it better as chains stretch and rod get shorter.

Race cans? Akrapovitch? Love the sound! Loud pipes save lives!

I'd love a duck, a chicken yellow Sport Classic 1000 Monoposto but I'm too tall for it. Also I wouldn't know what to do with it day to day, I commute on a BT1100 Bulldog which is a lazy standard/cruiser. I love it, it still faster than any car on the road and it bright orange. That the way the women and children can see me when I bump the curb and drive down the side walk. Driving in Greece is like the Dakar & Moto GP rolled in to one.

Alex

 

[Marc-A.]

Well as a Palestinian, I can say they came, they shredded and never left. At least in the Dakar when it over they have the courtesy to F-off !

The comparison is unacceptable. You'd better apologize.

If you have a problem with the Dakar why not write to them, let them know that you care, that you have trouble sleeping at night. If you did why don't you post an address so that other who are so inclined can do the same? Now back to serious matters...

What's the matter with you, Alex? We're talking cars, race. Could you at least tolerate that some people doesn't find the Dakar as "wonderful" as you do?

Fernando,
Your point is sensible again; I appreciate your balanced argument. I just wanted to point out that the problem is not about motorsport (I like myself F1 races that I used to watch), not even with all rallies, but only with the Dakar. But I understand your point. Thanks for the discussion.
Best,
Marc

 

[Hiyawaan]

You know I am sorry, I was angry. My deepest heart felt apologies to my people, the Palestinians, for using our plight and problem to make a point in a stupid argument, it demeans the cause and I humbly ask your forgiveness.


"What's the matter with you, Alex? We're talking cars, race."


Yes we were, you threw in your two cents, and I respond stating "If you want to complain about something complain about how British and French colonialism has affect millions of Africans." My two cents. You took this to mean I was attacking you personally and started ruffling your feathers saying that I picked the wrong guy to mess with, or some drivel along those lines, since someone deleted your comments I have to remember what you said, some thing like "YOU PICKED THE WRONG GUY TO ATTACK…DON'T TALK TO ME ABOUT THE AFFECTS OF COLONIALISM, MY FAMILY WAS A VICTIM OF FRENCH COLONIALISM...THE DAKAR IS AN EXTENTION OF NEOCOLONIAL...ETC" ,for which Screwy(Paul) replied "I'm pretty sure no one was attacking you , more pointing out that Africa is a complex country with complex problems and some of those problems are historical ."

I then said to clarify my point because your knickers were in a right twist.
"Marc-A,
my comment was not meant as an "attack" on you and I'm sorry that you perceived it that way.
The point I was trying to get across was that there are other things going on in Africa that are much more detrimental to the life of the African people than a race which for the most part does a lot of good for the countries it passes through by bringing those people to the attention of the western world."..."My statement does not in anyway infringe on your right to hate the race"

You then got really up tight with mw_uio and started some sort of list and if I'm not mistaken it was about this time that our wonderful moderator Mr. Joe stuck his head in and deleted your comments(I might be mistaken maybe you deleted them).

I don't know why, maybe you think the world revolves around you, that only your point of view matters, that we owe you something. Well numb nuts your wrong, if any thing you owe me an apology for your accusatory out burst. If and when I "attack" you it'll start with me pulling your head out of your head out of your a$$ long enough for you listen to what I say and look in my eyes. I won't do it through the internet.


Just for the record I did apologies to you when I had no need to, just to make this place a better place, I backed down even though you were wrong you snide little pr!ck, all because you felt "attacked". Blame the French ok. If you don’t understand sarcasm and/or my sense of humor that’s your problem. You say I’m intolerant what about all you snide remarks which have been deleted? If you don’t believe they buy 70% of their food locally tell them, that’s what I was going on about when I was said “If you have a problem with the Dakar why not write to them, let them know that you care, that you have trouble sleeping at night.” Yeah that’s a question wrapped in sarcasm but still a valid question, why complain to a bunch of photographers who can do very little. Complain to the Dakar and the ASO. I’d even say to the UN but that’s the most castrated organization in the world, they can’t do sh!t right for anyone.

I have nothing against the people of Africa, as I said before they are the victims of the French and British colonialist. I will state again that the Paris-Dakar or just the Dakar even though it’s the Lisbon-Dakar(see jon), is the least of Africa's problems and that I believe, it brings more good than harm. I sorry that people get hurt, people get hurt every day for things they didn’t do or deserve to happen to them, just turn on CNN.

As far as I am concerned this issue with you is dead, if you wish to go further PM me. Let’s not waste everybody’s time, after all Dakar is a week away. And I’ve got to figure out the point system.

On another note Nando, whom I might add, provide some great information and gave his views without dismissing others, you said "Even the Vatican is against the rally as they feel it is a vulgar display of wealth in one of the poorest areas of the world."

I got to say that that is rich coming from one of the richest organizations in the world who protects child molesters and who are in MY OPINION party responsible for the spread of AID’s and HIV across Africa because they do not condone premarital sex, the use of birth control, sexual education and /or condoms. They did too little too late in my eyes but its better than nothing.

Now back to Dakar. Seven day to go…….blast away!

 

[mw_uio]

I am looking forward to watching the craziness of the Cars and the Motorcycles. I have no interest in the Trucks.


Cheers

Mark
Quito, EC

 

[Nando]

On another note Nando, whom I might add, provide some great information and gave his views without dismissing others, you said "Even the Vatican is against the rally as they feel it is a vulgar display of wealth in one of the poorest areas of the world."

I got to say that that is rich coming from one of the richest organizations in the world who protects child molesters and who are in MY OPINION party responsible for the spread of AID’s and HIV across Africa because they do not condone premarital sex, the use of birth control, sexual education and /or condoms. They did too little too late in my eyes but its better than nothing.

Now back to Dakar. Seven day to go…….blast away!

I'm not going to argue against that. I just brought up that particular point because when the Vatican made a statement against the Dakar Rally, it was big news in motorsport circles. The fact is that this rally is not for the faint of heart. Its without a doubt the most dangerous sort of motorsport for motorcyclists with so many deaths and serious injuries. This compounded with the problems the rally has caused with the locals really calls for serious criticism. Even diehard racing and rally fans have been critical of the Dakar. Some sports publications like Sport Illustrated in the United States have published articles criticizing the Dakar.

I'll stick with my original stance. The rally itself is spectacular and it has the potential to do good things for Africa. It is probably the ultimate test for man and machine in the world of motorsport. However, the organizers of the rally have done an extremely poor job in addressing its problems.

I can't think of a reason why that rally can't be reorganized in such a way that it could benefit the locals more economically, be safer and minimize potential harm to farmers and the environment. The Dakar is the only motorsport event that the ASO organizes and sanctions and I'm afraid that they are out of their element. Motorsport is not like cycling, running or golf. Motorsport is fast, extremely dangerous, vehicles can cause significant damage to anything in their path, and participants are usually nut-cases. If the FIA was in charge, I feel that the rally would be better for everyone. The FIA does offer an alternative in the little known World Cross-Country Rally Championship or Rally Raid. It has rounds in Argentina, Tunisia, the Iberian Peninsula (Portugal/Spain), Morocco, South Africa, Egypt and the United Arab Emerates with very scenic and challenging routes. FIA Rally Raid does not have anywhere near as many problems as the Dakar does. Many Dakar participants also compete in Rally Raid. All professionals and not amateurs like Margaret Thatcher's son who got lost in the desert for a number of days and a search party had to go find him. I never quite understood why Rally Raid isn't followed very much but the Dakar is extremely popular. Perhaps its the spectacle.

I'll be watching the rally on television. I'm hoping, above all, for a safe rally for everyone involved. I must say that the ASO does know how to make excellent television coverage. Their camera crews must be among the best in the business.

 

[Marc-A.]

You know I am sorry, I was angry. My deepest heart felt apologies to my people, the Palestinians, for using our plight and problem to make a point in a stupid argument, it demeans the cause and I humbly ask your forgiveness.

Yes we were, you threw in your two cents, and I respond stating "If you want to complain about something complain about how British and French colonialism has affect millions of Africans."

The reason I don't like the Dakar is just that it shows very little respect for the people of African countries; mw_uio replied, I deeply disagree with him. That's it.
But you're the one who talked about French and British colonialism, you're the one who used the Palestinian issue to make argument. (And don't ask my forgiveness, cause you really don't give a ... ). You're angry because some of us (maybe only me) don't like the Dakar? That's a reason to mention French colonialism or Israeli colonialism, in a conversation about motor racing?
The rest is blablabla.
Won't PM you, don't count on me.
BTW, I deleted my own messages, Joe has nothing to do with this. But I renew my apologies to him; and tell him again, that if he considers some of my messages are inappropriate, he can delete them, I won't take it bad.
End of the conversation. I go back to photography.

 

[Hiyawaan]

I’m going to keep this as short as possible.

“… you're the one who talked about French and British colonialism, you're the one who used the Palestinian issue to make argument.”

Did you not say “YOU PICKED THE WRONG GUY TO ATTACK…DON'T TALK TO ME ABOUT THE AFFECTS OF COLONIALISM, MY FAMILY WAS A VICTIM OF FRENCH COLONIALISM...THE DAKAR IS AN EXTENTION OF NEOCOLONIAL...ETC" or words to that effect?

In my opinion you were by trying to elevate you position, getting righteous. You need to take long hard look in the mirror and if you’ve got a camera with you take a picture.

At least I have the conviction to stand behind what I said, wrong or right and not go about deleting it because I realized later it might not be appropriate, that people might not like me. I offered an apology when I realized that you got offended, even though it was unwarranted. I admitted I was wrong to say what I did about the Palestinian’s; I would have apologized anyway without your finger pointing. I was angry when I said/wrote it, but I said/wrote it none the less and someone out there read it, so I didn’t take it back(delete it) because once it out there you can’t. All I can do is hope to learn from my mistakes. Whether or not you believe the sincerity of my apology is not my problem.

I realize I might have avoided all of this if I only used the phrase: my 2 cents, IMHO, IMO etc. but I find remarks like that to friggin PC, redundant and stupid. Off course it’s my own opinion, I said it, I never claimed to be the voice of God stating anything other than my opinion and/or perceptions. So what I’m going to do is just put a disclaimer in with my signature. That way I can never have to write those stupid acronyms again.

Mw_uio :

“I always admired Fabrizio Menoi. He was a adventurous Italian rider for KTM who passed away in 2005.”

I remember when that happened. I said to my friend next to me that at least he died doing what he loved. Then later that year I saw a documentary on the Dakar and his family had the same sentiments. A quick search on the web show that 46 participants died on the Dakar. Good for them, they died doing something they believed in, something they loved, some thing they dedicated their life to, if only I could be so lucky.

“I have no interest in the Trucks.”
Come on, those trucks are awesome. Ok they might not be a fast and pretty like the others but they get the job done with there own style.

Nando, you are a veritable in encyclopedia on motor sports! If you are ever in Greece drop me a line and I’ll take you out for drinks while I pick you brain. If fact this is an invitation to all RFF’er and DSLR’ers and point & shooters, if you find yourself in Greece don’t hesitate to PM.

Best wishes to all for the New Year!



Disclaimer: All comment put forth by Hiyawaan are not the responsibility of rangefinderforum.com or dslrexchange.com. or their affiliates. They are for entertainment purposes only and are to be taken with a grain of salt. All above mentioned comments are the opinion of Hiyawaan and his multiple personalities and are just that opinions.

The terms : my 2 cent IMHO, IMO are implicitly implied by this disclaimer. For further clarification of you rights please write to Osama Bin Laden at the Discount Family Cave somewhere in an axis of evil country.

“Axis of Evil” is a trademark of the Bush family and was unlawfully used in this disclaimer.


I tried to put the disclaimer in but I got the message "Your signature can not be longer than 500 characters." even after I deleted my original signature.

 

[Marc-A.]

At least I have the conviction to stand behind what I said, wrong or right and not go about deleting it because I realized later it might not be appropriate, that people might not like me.

Ooh yeah ... now we're back when we were 12 ...

 

[back alley]

time for deep breaths and cold showers.
please don't let politics, debate, personal feelings and especially anger get in the way of our friendly forum.

this is no way to start the new year.

load up a camera and maybe take a nice long walk...

joe

 

[Hiyawaan]

Wooshaa, wooshaaa, woooosssshhaaaaaa!

Thank's Joe, I needed that.

"load up a camera and maybe take a nice long walk..."

A soon as it stops raining here in Germany I intend to do just that.

God Bless. Best wishes to all for the New Year.


Disclaimer: All comment put forth by Hiyawaan are not the responsibility of rangefinderforum.com or dslrexchange.com. or their affiliates. They are for entertainment purposes only and are to be taken with a grain of salt. All above mentioned comments are the opinion of Hiyawaan and his multiple personalities and are just that opinions.

The terms : my 2 cent IMHO, IMO are implicitly implied by this disclaimer. For further clarification of you rights please write to Osama Bin Laden at the Discount Family Cave somewhere in an axis of evil country.

“Axis of Evil” is a trademark of the Bush family and was unlawfully used in this disclaimer.

 

[mw_uio]

I am glad everyone like my post !

Dakar = the ultimate extreme race, where man is challenged by nature !
So much emotion !


Cheers

Mark
Quito, EC