Direction of film in film spiral

[userid0]

Hi everyone,

i just had a conversation with a friend regarding spoling the film into the spiral of the developement tank. He said, that i have to spool the film such that the side with the chemicals on should face inwards. Normally, this is also easier to be spooled onto the reel as the film naturally rolls this way.

With my Minolta X-700, it is actually the opposite as it spools the film the other way within the camera body so after complete exposure and rolling back the film into the capsule it is would roll the other way. So when I then want to have easy spooling onto the development reel, I would have to do it with the exposed side facing outwards.

Can i do this without any problems or is there anything to take care of or to be concerned about?

Cheers,
Walter

 

[erikhaugsby]

The only problem I could imagine is at the very end of the roll, when you're making the last spiral around the reel, the emulsion side would directly face the canister. Although there should be clearance between the film and canister, it would seem that the chances of scratching the (softer) emulsion are higher than if the non-emulsion side faced outwards.

 

[userid0]

Hi and thanks for the hint. Actually, a quick look into the paterson tank manual revealed that if films are rolled that way in a camera, they should be spooled back into the canister first and left there for quite some time to get the original rolling from the canister again.

That simple.
Walter

 

[sevo]

Sure the camera rolls up the film inside out in the cartridge (without being defective)? While cameras reversing the film on the take-up spool or drum are fairly common (maybe one third of them), I've never run into a camera that reversed the film when winding back onto the canister spool. And it does not sound safe - spools are asymmetric, and pulling in the film against the natural direction would pull the film across the sharp metal edge behind the light trap, with a considerable risk of scratching the film.

In the regular case, the film will be outward wound on the take-up spool only, if at all, which has never caused problems loading into reels for me.

 

[Takkun]

I think OP meant that the take-up spool on the Minolta winds counter-clockwise, when viewed from above, like you mentioned. That would mean the film curls emulsion-side-out after being left in the camera, so when you develop soon after rewinding, it's curved in the direction you don't want it to be.

Though I suppose hypothetically you could rewind the crank in the opposite direction. I know for a fact my leica (M5, ratcheted/geared rewind) won't, but I'll try it on my Nikon with some dead film sometime..

But to answer the original question: I don't think there's any particular harm to loading emulsion-side-out.

 

[userid0]

Thanks guys.

Yes, the takeup spool winds the film exactly the other way as the film canister does it. But i think if you leave the film which is rewinded into the canister (in the way it was originally winded) there for a day or two, the issue with wrong rolling habits of the film onto the developement reel are gone.

Thanks for your support on that,
Walter

 

[sevo]

But i think if you leave the film which is rewinded into the canister (in the way it was originally winded) there for a day or two, the issue with wrong rolling habits of the film onto the developement reel are gone.

There should be no issue. Indeed I'd have expected it to be irrelevant or even beneficial. Having the film curve strongly inwards (like straight from the spool) is not desirable, and many books and references actually recommended reverse-winding the film for a few hours before threading it onto metal reels.

 

[Bill Clark]

As I recall, my first brand new camera, bought back in the 1960's, was a Minolta SRT-101.

Just curious, I once tried to spool the film with emulsion side out onto my Paterson reel and I gave up as I couldn't get it to load properly. I thought it might help as I was using film that had a curling problem.

As an aside, I don't understand, if the film is in the canister with emulsion side one way, how does it get reversed when the film is attached to the reel in the film cassette?

With my Leica cameras the take up reel spools the film with emulsion side out as it winds counterclockwise and I load the take up reel emulsion side out. But it doesn't reverse on the cassette reel!

Hope this helps.

 

[userid0]

Hi guys,

maybe this link of the x-700 Manual will shed some light.

http://www.mir.com.my/rb/photography/hardwares/classics/minoltax700/index1.htm

Please look for the part where the procedure of putting film into the camera is handled.

So to summarize:
1. Film in the canister is "emulsion facing inside"!
2. Film on the take-up spool is "emulsion facing outside"
3. Rewinding the film into the canister and immediately taking it out will remain the "emulsion facing outside" bending that the film has gotten when winded on the take-up spool.
4. Solution from Paterson: After rewinding the film to the canister again, leave it there for some time so that it can regain its original bending from the canister (or at least get straight again) for easier spooling when the emulsion will face inwards on the Paterson reel.

On the weekend i am going to develop some film so i let you know how it turned out.

Cheers,
Walter