Avotius
Some guy
Lets try and have a logical and calm conversation here about this topic since it is so obvious the likes of dpreview and such are incapable.
I for one could care less that the EP1 is metal on the outside and plastic on the inside because it keeps weight and such down. I was looking at HP net books the other day and the metal shelled one was noticeably heavier then the plastic one despite having similar guts.
I dont get the whole argument against the insides of the camera being plastic and everyone up in arms about it. The inside of my Canon 20D is plastic, so it my girlfriends 5D, that did not stop casual snappers or pros for using them. Hell Canon's xxxD models have had plastic shells for years and still people bought them up. I know my Ricoh GRD has a metal shell but the insides are plastic but that weight savings is part of why I keep it with me at all times.
In the end this is the kind of camera that will go on a wrist strap with a prime lens, shaving every little bit of weight off they can while still giving me that nice tactile feel of metal on the outside is fine with me!
I for one could care less that the EP1 is metal on the outside and plastic on the inside because it keeps weight and such down. I was looking at HP net books the other day and the metal shelled one was noticeably heavier then the plastic one despite having similar guts.
I dont get the whole argument against the insides of the camera being plastic and everyone up in arms about it. The inside of my Canon 20D is plastic, so it my girlfriends 5D, that did not stop casual snappers or pros for using them. Hell Canon's xxxD models have had plastic shells for years and still people bought them up. I know my Ricoh GRD has a metal shell but the insides are plastic but that weight savings is part of why I keep it with me at all times.
In the end this is the kind of camera that will go on a wrist strap with a prime lens, shaving every little bit of weight off they can while still giving me that nice tactile feel of metal on the outside is fine with me!
pvdhaar
Peter
My Nikon P5100 has a metal alloy frame.. and I think it's money wasted.
The only thing positive about it is that it adds some weight to such a small camera. But from a point of view of longevity, it makes no difference. The miniaturised electronics and mechanics will give up earlier than a (let's not call it plastic) polycarbonate inside would.
The only thing positive about it is that it adds some weight to such a small camera. But from a point of view of longevity, it makes no difference. The miniaturised electronics and mechanics will give up earlier than a (let's not call it plastic) polycarbonate inside would.
teo
Well-known
Uhm, sorry, but aren't EOS 20D and 5D made of magnesium with only the external layer made of plastic?
amateriat
We're all light!
I'm of two minds about this. (No Zaphod Beeblebrox jokes, please.)
My last pro-grade SLRs were a pair of Minolta 9xi bodies. The only metal components of the body were the mirror box (aluminum/stailness-steel) and bottom plate (cast magnesium). The film chamber was made of an industrial-grade plastic, while the top plate was an even fancier plastic (fiberglass-reinforced polymer, with a UV coating). The cameras were solid-feeling, and tough as nails; even with a fair amount of knocking about, they hardly took a scratch. Plastic doesn't always equal cheap. (I remember someone at Canon mentioning that it cost them more money to make a metal-clad plastic shell for the early EOS-1 cameras than it would have to make a conventional all-metal shell. They went to more-expensive "hybrid" route for strength with weight-savings.)
Of course, these are top-of-the-range cameras. Smaller cameras rarely get this sort of treatment, and when they do, you pay dearly.
The skeleton of the E-P1 doesn't look terribly robust to me, but it may in fact be tough enough: the average buyer of this thing isn't likely to be madly swinging it around in swashbuckling fashion like someone would an E-3 (not sure I'd swing one of those around that way, either...with my luck, I'll break the rear screen). I'd like to think it will take the occasional drop with little damage, although, if it had an exterior like my old Minoltas, it wouldn't get scratched or dinged like that pretty external metalwork doubtless will.
So, no, the plastic in the E-P1 doesn't bother me much, assuming it's of decent quality. The lack of an optical/electronic viewfinder is another story.
- Barrett
My last pro-grade SLRs were a pair of Minolta 9xi bodies. The only metal components of the body were the mirror box (aluminum/stailness-steel) and bottom plate (cast magnesium). The film chamber was made of an industrial-grade plastic, while the top plate was an even fancier plastic (fiberglass-reinforced polymer, with a UV coating). The cameras were solid-feeling, and tough as nails; even with a fair amount of knocking about, they hardly took a scratch. Plastic doesn't always equal cheap. (I remember someone at Canon mentioning that it cost them more money to make a metal-clad plastic shell for the early EOS-1 cameras than it would have to make a conventional all-metal shell. They went to more-expensive "hybrid" route for strength with weight-savings.)
Of course, these are top-of-the-range cameras. Smaller cameras rarely get this sort of treatment, and when they do, you pay dearly.
The skeleton of the E-P1 doesn't look terribly robust to me, but it may in fact be tough enough: the average buyer of this thing isn't likely to be madly swinging it around in swashbuckling fashion like someone would an E-3 (not sure I'd swing one of those around that way, either...with my luck, I'll break the rear screen). I'd like to think it will take the occasional drop with little damage, although, if it had an exterior like my old Minoltas, it wouldn't get scratched or dinged like that pretty external metalwork doubtless will.
So, no, the plastic in the E-P1 doesn't bother me much, assuming it's of decent quality. The lack of an optical/electronic viewfinder is another story.
- Barrett
aizan
Veteran
i have a phd in engineering and i'm appalled and dismayed that the e-p1 is made out of plastic.
actually, no, i don't care one bit.
actually, no, i don't care one bit.
__hh
Well-known
It all comes down to tradeoffs....
otherwise, I'd prefer a metal camera if there was a choice between the two without any other factors taken into consideration (e.g. price/cost)
otherwise, I'd prefer a metal camera if there was a choice between the two without any other factors taken into consideration (e.g. price/cost)
btgc
Veteran
I'll second Amateriat - quality durable plastics is better than soft metal which is there for cosmetics (I'm not meaning GRD, though).
Manufacturers know that nowadays buyers are smart - they watch for high-ISOs, wide lens and "stylish and durable metal body", not megapixels or zoom (whatever it means).
Those metal (or metal-like plastic) bodies anyway aren't as tough and durable as cameras from mid of previous century. They just gimmick metal.
Manufacturers know that nowadays buyers are smart - they watch for high-ISOs, wide lens and "stylish and durable metal body", not megapixels or zoom (whatever it means).
Those metal (or metal-like plastic) bodies anyway aren't as tough and durable as cameras from mid of previous century. They just gimmick metal.
Pickett Wilson
Veteran
Yep, the 20D and 5D are made of magnesium. Why do you think they are made of plastic? Only the covering is an incredibly tough plastic.
kywong
Established
Boo, we like our compact cameras to weigh a tonne! And what is this nonsense about companies trying to make a profit.
ZeissFan
Veteran
I would expect most digital cameras (especially those in the P&S category) to be made as cheaply as possible.
However, as others have said, plastic doesn't always mean that the quality of construction will be poor. And I also fully expect the sensor or electronics to fail before the body has problems.
And quite truthfully, the general public drops their cameras a lot. And I mean A LOT. Plastic will allow the camera to bounce when a metal camera will just get dented.
However, as others have said, plastic doesn't always mean that the quality of construction will be poor. And I also fully expect the sensor or electronics to fail before the body has problems.
And quite truthfully, the general public drops their cameras a lot. And I mean A LOT. Plastic will allow the camera to bounce when a metal camera will just get dented.
Rayt
Nonplayer Character
I hope in the future all cameras will be made of biodegradable and recycled materials. I drove a Pinto in the 70's and that was made from pure turd. Way ahead of its time.
Avotius
Some guy
I said the inside of the 20D and 5D were made of plastic, there are metal parts inside but a lot of plastic too which I know from opening my 20D many times to clean crud out of it, their shells are magnesium which actually if you know a bit about material science you know that the type of magnesium alloy used in cameras and laptop computer cases has some similar properties to certain engineering plastics, magnesium is better for things like heat diffusion while engineering plastic takes hard knocks better in some cases as it is not as rigid as metals and its flexibility is quite useful for frames.
Another thing to think about in all of this....how many people looking to buy this camera are thinking of still being able to use it in 10 years? Most cheap plastic film cameras lasted this long just fine so im not worried in the slightest about this camera not lasting a decade because if it performs well now and lets me take some nice pictures I only have to sell a couple shots to make it all back and it will be more then worth it.
Another thing to think about in all of this....how many people looking to buy this camera are thinking of still being able to use it in 10 years? Most cheap plastic film cameras lasted this long just fine so im not worried in the slightest about this camera not lasting a decade because if it performs well now and lets me take some nice pictures I only have to sell a couple shots to make it all back and it will be more then worth it.
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historicist
Well-known
I couldn't care less, assuming the plastic is of decent enough quality (I'm no engineering major, but I'm assuming that the fact that the EOS1, F4, Dynax 9, etc. etc. had plastic bodies means that it is possible to make a one as good as or near enough a metal body).
It seems to me that the major advantage of metal is that it just feels better in the hand than plastic, and thus a plastic body skinned in metal makes a lot of sense to me.
My concerns about the EP1 are more about focus speed and the quality of the 17mm than anthing else.
It seems to me that the major advantage of metal is that it just feels better in the hand than plastic, and thus a plastic body skinned in metal makes a lot of sense to me.
My concerns about the EP1 are more about focus speed and the quality of the 17mm than anthing else.
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250swb
Well-known
Its got so few moving parts does it really matter if its made of plastic? Of course not. Use the best materials for the job, and metal skin and plastic inside is perfect.Steve
JoeV
Thin Air, Bright Sun
I like the look and feel of my Retina IIIC; it's built like a Swiss watch, the Schneider Xenon lens is superb. But it weighs a ton. Or "tonne" for you Brits. Even if you could put it into your coat pocket, the weight would drag that whole side of the garment down so low you'd need a counter-weight on the other side just to keep from falling over.
Okay, I exaggerate. But sometimes having a well-engineered camera that's light in weight can be a good thing. Think aircraft; well designed, light in weight and extremely strong. If it takes engineered polymers (read: plastic) to do the job, then okay. Just be glad the next airplane you fly in isn't machined from a solid block of brass.
~Joe
Okay, I exaggerate. But sometimes having a well-engineered camera that's light in weight can be a good thing. Think aircraft; well designed, light in weight and extremely strong. If it takes engineered polymers (read: plastic) to do the job, then okay. Just be glad the next airplane you fly in isn't machined from a solid block of brass.
~Joe
Pickett Wilson
Veteran
Aircraft are actually extremely fragile.
back alley
IMAGES
i don't care!
isn't magnesium a metal alloy?
isn't magnesium a metal alloy?
BillBingham2
Registered User
Keith
The best camera is one that still works!
Bit hard to find a plastic that's as rigid and stable over an extreme temperature range as magnesium alloy. In a smaller camera it's unimportant but for a larger SLR it can be critical for sensor alignment and numerous other issues which is why it's the chassis material of choice for the top end gear that will often be subjected to such extremes!