fergus
Well-known
I have been thinking about this for a while now...
My background - I teach accounting, and write accounting textbooks, I have had a successful professional career, and now at quite a young age work part-time in academia. Time is not a problem - it used to be, when I was a work-a-holic, but not anymore.
Photography is an artistic outlet, I drive my friends crazy with cameras and photos on trips and on weekends... but, almost everything I take is woeful, woeful, woeful. Truly horrible. I don't much like looking at them myself.
Yet, I really enjoy the process, the thought involved, applying what is (for me) a very different thought process and skillset.
So I find myself with a great hobby, yet there's nothing to show. I don't have anything worth uploading, and thankfully apart from various photos that document events my friends don't ask for any.
I'm curious... how many others love their photography but not the results they get?
Cheers to all...
Fergus
My background - I teach accounting, and write accounting textbooks, I have had a successful professional career, and now at quite a young age work part-time in academia. Time is not a problem - it used to be, when I was a work-a-holic, but not anymore.
Photography is an artistic outlet, I drive my friends crazy with cameras and photos on trips and on weekends... but, almost everything I take is woeful, woeful, woeful. Truly horrible. I don't much like looking at them myself.
Yet, I really enjoy the process, the thought involved, applying what is (for me) a very different thought process and skillset.
So I find myself with a great hobby, yet there's nothing to show. I don't have anything worth uploading, and thankfully apart from various photos that document events my friends don't ask for any.
I'm curious... how many others love their photography but not the results they get?
Cheers to all...
Fergus
gavinlg
Veteran
I am happy with some (a few) of my photos.
I find that I have the classic artists conundrum of knowing potentially what i COULD be creating, but lack the experience and skills to create it every single time consistently. Compared to a good seasoned photographer, I must take twice as many photos to get the same amount of small keepers. This is with professional/commercial shoots of late.
I feel I'm getting better every time I do it though.
With personal work, the situation is harder, because I'm not so great at setting guidelines for myself for the final images. I think I may be a more brutal critic of myself than I should be, but very few images make it through.
I find that I have the classic artists conundrum of knowing potentially what i COULD be creating, but lack the experience and skills to create it every single time consistently. Compared to a good seasoned photographer, I must take twice as many photos to get the same amount of small keepers. This is with professional/commercial shoots of late.
I feel I'm getting better every time I do it though.
With personal work, the situation is harder, because I'm not so great at setting guidelines for myself for the final images. I think I may be a more brutal critic of myself than I should be, but very few images make it through.
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zuikologist
.........................
I can safely say I am in the same boat.
It is probably worth remembering that the great work you see here and elsewhere, including that of great photographers, is the result of practice and thousands of frames shot. You are seeing a handful of photos out of thousands - we all have dud results. Some photographers regard one or two keepers out of a 36 frame roll as a good outcome.
Keep shooting - some photos will be good and will hopefully encourage you to develop a style that works.
It is probably worth remembering that the great work you see here and elsewhere, including that of great photographers, is the result of practice and thousands of frames shot. You are seeing a handful of photos out of thousands - we all have dud results. Some photographers regard one or two keepers out of a 36 frame roll as a good outcome.
Keep shooting - some photos will be good and will hopefully encourage you to develop a style that works.
Yammerman
Well-known
I can't believe your photo's are entirely without merit maybe you're too hard on yourself. Do your thing don't let self proclaimed experts tell you anything the camera and time will be your friend. I get brief excitment then disappointment and come back years later and get excited again. Even genius photographers end up with half a dozen images that last, almost all of the rest of us will be adding to landfill. Enjoy the moment who knows the people of the future may think your woeful work perfectly captured the time you lived in.
Pickett Wilson
Veteran
If it brings you pleasure, in the end it just doesn't matter.
I've played guitar all my life. I've spent a small fortune buying guitars and taking lessons over the years. And despite my best efforts at buying talent, I have none for guitar. I really am only a barely competent guitar player. But the joy I get from playing (and buying guitars!) is worth every hour I've spent practicing and every cent I've spent on gear.
fergus, just enjoy the ride.
I've played guitar all my life. I've spent a small fortune buying guitars and taking lessons over the years. And despite my best efforts at buying talent, I have none for guitar. I really am only a barely competent guitar player. But the joy I get from playing (and buying guitars!) is worth every hour I've spent practicing and every cent I've spent on gear.
fergus, just enjoy the ride.
Keith
The best camera is one that still works!
Geez Fergus ... you're being a little hard on yourself!
I swing back and forth between producing stuff that I'm happy with ... and then producing results that bore the crap out of me with their lack of imagination. I don't seem to have a consistent level ... I'm either on or I'm off.
Often I'll be sitting there looking at something not really thinking about taking a photo and I'll realise that what I'm seeing could potentially make a good image, or several in fact ... I'll rush off and get a camera and the process will just flow. These moments are where my best photographs come from ... I've learned not to push or force it though!
I swing back and forth between producing stuff that I'm happy with ... and then producing results that bore the crap out of me with their lack of imagination. I don't seem to have a consistent level ... I'm either on or I'm off.
Often I'll be sitting there looking at something not really thinking about taking a photo and I'll realise that what I'm seeing could potentially make a good image, or several in fact ... I'll rush off and get a camera and the process will just flow. These moments are where my best photographs come from ... I've learned not to push or force it though!
__hh
Well-known
Photography is a bit like life for some people, it's all about the journey and (hopefully) not just the destination
ruby.monkey
Veteran
I'm starting to get to the point where I like more of my photos than I dislike. I think it comes from a number of factors: I now know my cameras well enough that I don't have to worry all the time about the mechanics of taking a photo, and can concentrate instead on light and composition; I'm more comfortable about judging the light by eye; I'm more selective about what I take (perhaps helped by having available only ten to sixteen shots per roll); and I think I'm getting far more aggressive about throwing away stuff that doesn't spark any interest.
Still have a long way to go, though.
Still have a long way to go, though.
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mfogiel
Veteran
Photography is lots of things Fergus. When I started uploading my photos on Flickr, initially I was quite surprised at the judgement they were receiving, as it seldom coincided with mine. And even now, after more than a thousand shots uploaded, it is still true to a big extent. During the process, I have decided I want to shoot B&W only, I began slowly converging on the choice of film&developer for various subjects, and frankly, I am continuing to sniff around for what specific type of photography I like best.
I have found two types of themes that never seem to be tiring: portraiture and what I'd call the research of form. I think both these themes can be very satisfying, and teach you continuously how to progress. When you are disatisfied with your last shots, you find them dull, static, not original, you can always "defocus" your eyes, let your artistic side of the brain guide you, and look for the form:
Or, you can go to see friends, and you can try to capture their humanity, best expressions, moment of relaxation:
Then, every now and then, you might take a photo which you believe is great, even if nobody else agrees - and so, who cares... the important thing is what your photography is giving to YOU...
Keep on going, and if you want to open your photographic mind, you might like the book " The Tao of Photography" By Gross and Shapiro
These are some of MY preferred shots that aren't flying high on Flickr:
I have found two types of themes that never seem to be tiring: portraiture and what I'd call the research of form. I think both these themes can be very satisfying, and teach you continuously how to progress. When you are disatisfied with your last shots, you find them dull, static, not original, you can always "defocus" your eyes, let your artistic side of the brain guide you, and look for the form:
Or, you can go to see friends, and you can try to capture their humanity, best expressions, moment of relaxation:
Then, every now and then, you might take a photo which you believe is great, even if nobody else agrees - and so, who cares... the important thing is what your photography is giving to YOU...
Keep on going, and if you want to open your photographic mind, you might like the book " The Tao of Photography" By Gross and Shapiro
These are some of MY preferred shots that aren't flying high on Flickr:
sojournerphoto
Veteran
It's normal, but if you make something you like and no one else does then that's very fine too, as mFogiel says. At that point you are making pictures of what you see, and not just what pther people want. Most people will repsond to postcards rather than vision when all is said and done.
Here's one that I think no-one but me likes
Mike
Here's one that I think no-one but me likes
Mike
WHY do you put photos on Flickr and worry about what people think about them? You're just adding to an avalanche, a flood of endless images.
sojournerphoto
Veteran
Me or Mfogiel? I only put images on Flickr to share them with a few other people. I don't expect either views or comment from Flickr itself.
Mike
Mike
projectbluebird
Film Abuser
I'm with Keith on this one, for the last while I seem to be on, or off. No middle ground. Lately it's been off, I can't seem to do anything beyond boring, boring, and more boring. The last big project I did was the exact opposite, most of the shots came out well.
Before that, I can remember when I first started photography. I thought every photo was great! As I learned more about composition, and my own likes/dislikes, I found that the number of keepers per roll dropped, eventually reaching only 2 or 3 per roll of 36. I was okay with that though, because those pictures really were good.
Before that, I can remember when I first started photography. I thought every photo was great! As I learned more about composition, and my own likes/dislikes, I found that the number of keepers per roll dropped, eventually reaching only 2 or 3 per roll of 36. I was okay with that though, because those pictures really were good.
FrankS
Registered User
Hi Fergus,
I think that you should do one of two things, either:
1.) Consciously analyze the situation. Post a few pics here, and we can talk about them. You can tell us why you took the shot, what you were hoping to achieve, and why you think it didn't work. Folks here can try to help.
or
2.) Just keep enjoying the process. With practice you will improve.
Either one would work. It depends on your nature which process would work best.
I'm only happy with a few of the pictures I take for myself.
I think that you should do one of two things, either:
1.) Consciously analyze the situation. Post a few pics here, and we can talk about them. You can tell us why you took the shot, what you were hoping to achieve, and why you think it didn't work. Folks here can try to help.
or
2.) Just keep enjoying the process. With practice you will improve.
Either one would work. It depends on your nature which process would work best.
I'm only happy with a few of the pictures I take for myself.
SolaresLarrave
My M5s need red dots!
I shoot for the pleasure of taking the photograph and preserving some instant in time. Not masterpieces of any type. My photos are probably woeful... but I like them, and rarely share them (except for a select few). But then, photography, like guitar, are just outlets for my other inclinations, so that I have a real intellectual life besides my professional endeavors.
antiquark
Derek Ross
It might be helpful to scrutinize your own photos closely, to figure out what went wrong, why you don't like them, and what you could have done better.
Then, once you know what to fix, go out and take better pics!
Let's see some of your crummy photos and we can decide.
What do you think is wrong with them?
1) Technically deficient, like out of focus or poor exposure?
2) Bad framing, bad subject matter, bad composition?
3) Just don't like them, boring?
Pick a few of them, post them, and caption them as to what you think is no good.
What do you think is wrong with them?
1) Technically deficient, like out of focus or poor exposure?
2) Bad framing, bad subject matter, bad composition?
3) Just don't like them, boring?
Pick a few of them, post them, and caption them as to what you think is no good.
sanmich
Veteran
99% percent of my pictures are pure crap.
I don't think it's me.
It's the same for most people I think.
Photography, as I pratice it (Not really "Ansel" workstream) leaves a very large place to chance.
I'm really pissed off when I manage to have 100% crap out of a good situation, no time limit etc.
And that happens too often....
I don't think it's me.
It's the same for most people I think.
Photography, as I pratice it (Not really "Ansel" workstream) leaves a very large place to chance.
I'm really pissed off when I manage to have 100% crap out of a good situation, no time limit etc.
And that happens too often....
Al Kaplan
Veteran
On the bright side you seem to realize that your photos are the result of your own vision and efforts. You're not chasing after The Magic Camera.
You may just be putting too much effort into it. After a life of using my cameras to pay the bills, buy houses, cars, see an ex-wife through medical school, one kid through law school, the other now working on his doctorate (and I'm next to broke), I learned something important about photography. You don't have to always make great photographs. You have to have the competance to always come back with useable photographs, something the editor or art director can work with.
Some shoots turn out great, others so-so, and a few you're ashamed to hand in. It happens to everybody. It happened to photographers shooting photo essays for Life Magazine. You can't always control or pick your subjects, sometimes the light or the weather stinks, your foot might be hurting, your kid failed the big math test Friday, your mind is elsewhere.
Carry a camera everyplace, but don't head out with the intent of "making photographs". Keep track of the light by metering from time to time, and keep your camera set accordingly. Keep the focus set to a point further away than your likely subjects so you always know which way to turn it to focus. Work on learning one lens so well that your brain projects a "bright frame" around your proposed picture. You can learn other focal lengths later. Don't kick yourself on the days when you didn't take picture number one. If the picture had been there that bright frame in your brain would have lit up and "aim, focus, fire" would have been a compulsion. Keep reminding yourself that this should be relaxing, that there's no editor waiting for you to come back to the office with a selection of useable photographs. No deadlines. Your family will still eat and still have a roof over their heads.
Now there's also another way to go about it. Pretend that there's an over-riding reason for shooting photos. Maybe "testing" three or four films in a new developer, trying to zero in on the optimum developing time. Maybe borrow every lens you can find in a given focal length, and camera bodies too if the lenses won't fit yours, and seeing how they render various subjects, or just checking their bokeh at a few f-stops. No pressure. No attempt to "make great photographs". Raid comes up with some of the most fantastic photos of his daughters while he's trying to show the difference between a Biotar from 1959 and a Pancolar from 1971, and somehow he manages to convince them that they're having as much fun as he's having.
I'll admit it. I always carry a camera. I'd feel naked without it. There's a small incident light meter in a belt pouch and an extra roll or two in my pocket. That's it. If I'm out shooting for a reason, yes, I carry several cameras and lenses, too much film, an assortment of filters, usually a small flash with spare batteries and synch cords, notebook and a couple of pens, and a stack of business cards.
Even with that camera always there, hanging from the strap, there are times when I'll go a few days without exposing a single frame. I don't feel guilty or unfulfilled. There's no sense in taking bad pictures "just because" and no sense in shooting useable pictures when they have no use.
You may just be putting too much effort into it. After a life of using my cameras to pay the bills, buy houses, cars, see an ex-wife through medical school, one kid through law school, the other now working on his doctorate (and I'm next to broke), I learned something important about photography. You don't have to always make great photographs. You have to have the competance to always come back with useable photographs, something the editor or art director can work with.
Some shoots turn out great, others so-so, and a few you're ashamed to hand in. It happens to everybody. It happened to photographers shooting photo essays for Life Magazine. You can't always control or pick your subjects, sometimes the light or the weather stinks, your foot might be hurting, your kid failed the big math test Friday, your mind is elsewhere.
Carry a camera everyplace, but don't head out with the intent of "making photographs". Keep track of the light by metering from time to time, and keep your camera set accordingly. Keep the focus set to a point further away than your likely subjects so you always know which way to turn it to focus. Work on learning one lens so well that your brain projects a "bright frame" around your proposed picture. You can learn other focal lengths later. Don't kick yourself on the days when you didn't take picture number one. If the picture had been there that bright frame in your brain would have lit up and "aim, focus, fire" would have been a compulsion. Keep reminding yourself that this should be relaxing, that there's no editor waiting for you to come back to the office with a selection of useable photographs. No deadlines. Your family will still eat and still have a roof over their heads.
Now there's also another way to go about it. Pretend that there's an over-riding reason for shooting photos. Maybe "testing" three or four films in a new developer, trying to zero in on the optimum developing time. Maybe borrow every lens you can find in a given focal length, and camera bodies too if the lenses won't fit yours, and seeing how they render various subjects, or just checking their bokeh at a few f-stops. No pressure. No attempt to "make great photographs". Raid comes up with some of the most fantastic photos of his daughters while he's trying to show the difference between a Biotar from 1959 and a Pancolar from 1971, and somehow he manages to convince them that they're having as much fun as he's having.
I'll admit it. I always carry a camera. I'd feel naked without it. There's a small incident light meter in a belt pouch and an extra roll or two in my pocket. That's it. If I'm out shooting for a reason, yes, I carry several cameras and lenses, too much film, an assortment of filters, usually a small flash with spare batteries and synch cords, notebook and a couple of pens, and a stack of business cards.
Even with that camera always there, hanging from the strap, there are times when I'll go a few days without exposing a single frame. I don't feel guilty or unfulfilled. There's no sense in taking bad pictures "just because" and no sense in shooting useable pictures when they have no use.
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Roger Hicks
Veteran
Dear Al,
Also, in my case, my typewriter (or computer used as a glorified typewriter).
I agree with everything you said. But what is 'trying too hard'? I am pretty confident that I know what you mean; but I also think I could fill a book trying to define it.
Cheers,
Roger