EK Double-XX frame tilt?

[Steinberg2010]

Curious to know if this is normal:

I shot my first roll of Double-XX last week through a new-to-me M4 as a test roll. The exposures all look good, but there's a slight consistent tilt to each frame at an angle on the long edge (so one end of the frame is closer to the bottom perforations than the other end). Is this caused by the slight difference in perforation shape?

Thanks in advance!

~S

 

[Dan]

My guess: it's a camera issue.

 

[Rob-F]

I haven't seen this when shooting XX in my M2, M5 , M7, or MP. (I haven't shot XX in my other Leicas.)

 

[davidnewtonguitars]

I guess a loading issue, a slight misalignment of the film across the gate. If the film leader is not cut deep enough, it rides too high on the tulip. Or, the film roll is not pushed all the way down.

 

[Nokton48]

The perforations are smaller, to fit sprockets in Hollywood movie cameras, like Mitchell or Arriflex.

Sounds like a camera loading issue to me. +1 ^^

 

[Steinberg2010]

Ok - the reason I was confused was that the tilt resets frame by frame. (E.g. the distance looks consistent across the roll with a similar amount of tilt on each frame). I will try another roll of a more standard stock to see if I can reproduce it!

~S

 

[Guy Pinhas]

Been shooting XX with either an M4, CL or my half frames and there was nothing unusual. So yeah, like everyone says, probably loading issue? Might help if you posted an image of a strip of six frames?

 

[davidnewtonguitars]

That would indicate the film strip is tracking at a slight tilt across the camera film gate or frame.

Ok - the reason I was confused was that the tilt resets frame by frame. (E.g. the distance looks consistent across the roll with a similar amount of tilt on each frame). I will try another roll of a more standard stock to see if I can reproduce it!

~S

 

[Nokton48]

Maybe the roll wasn't taped straight on the spool??

 

[Ambro51]

Yes now I see a difference in the perfs, the xx has a semi rounded top. Never noticed this before I thought this perf size was standardized in Edison’s day. Live and learn. I’ve shot this film a lot and never had any issues.

 

[Phil_F_NM]

The perf is Bell and Howell which is superior to the Eastman Kodak perf because the BH perfs have rounded corners and don't tear as easily. This standard has been around since the 1920s when Bell and Howell ruled motion picture production and Eastman Kodak ruled film production. All the other film manufacturers basically had to adopt the BH perf size and shape if they were to be able to supply film for motion picture shooting, printing and final projection. Only motion picture film has these perfs.
Regarding your tilted frames issue, I'm really curious to see what the individual frames look like all the way out to the edge of the acetate. Sounds like the film is moving across the rails slightly sideways but in a repeatable fashion. I can't figure out how this would happen though.
Since the M4 is compatible with Leica reloadable cassettes, it could be an issue with the reloadables you used for the roll/s that have this issue. I had this problem with a Leica IIIf not wanting to play with a certain brand of reloadable cassette I was using years ago.
Phil Forrest