Eugene Smith Spanish wake technique

[megido]

Hi all
I have a commision for a photo shoot in Spain which will be in very low light. The location remided me of Eugene Smith famous photo of the wake in Extramadura. I've read several references to Smith using some type of flash for this image. Does anyone here have any more info on Smiths technique or just general tips/references for lighting when available light is very limited?
Thank you

 

[MCTuomey]

if the image you have in mind is the one where the women are grieving next to the deceased, then i'd say if flash was used it had to be off-camera left/high (emulating window light).

a softbox would do fine, either flash or strobe, don't need a lot of power. or something like the Westcott icelight (which is continuous) and imitates window light.

 

[megido]

Yes, that's exactly the image I was referring to. I have no previous expereince using artificial light but I think given the location and that I will be using a 24mm 2.8 lens (and pushed 400 film) then some lighting assistance will still be neccesary.

 

[PKR]

if the image you have in mind is the one where the women are grieving next to the deceased, then i'd say if flash was used it had to be off-camera left/high (emulating window light).

a softbox would do fine, either flash or strobe, don't need a lot of power. or something like the Westcott icelight (which is continuous) and imitates window light.

What's the difference between a flash and a strobe?

 

[Liam Maloney]

Years ago I read that he used a bare-bulb flash to achieve the deep focus he needed for this shot while maintaining the mood of the sombre scene. Smith performed an extraordinary amount of dodging and burning in all of his work and this photograph would have been no exception. See here for more info:

http://www.alteredimagesbdc.org/eugene-smith-spanish-wake/

L

 

[Larry H-L]

I went to a lecture by Gene Smith years ago, and he said bare-bulb flash, held over his head, for several of his photos.

 

[charjohncarter]

I went to a lecture by Gene Smith years ago, and he said bare-bulb flash, held over his head, for several of his photos.

I agree it doesn't look like a electronic flash (strobe). It could be it was just a light bulb moved to be in the right place. Flash bulbs really did a better job of lighting than EF, but they were also difficult to avoid harsh flash shadows.

If he did use a flash bulb he had the aperture set more for fill flash and the darkroom fixed the image. Great image though.

 

[Larry H-L]

Some of the old Singer / Graflex electronic strobes had an available bare tube accessory called a "Globe." Many press photogs used to carry them.

 

[PKR]

Some of the old Singer / Graflex electronic strobes had an available bare tube accessory called a "Globe." Many press photogs used to carry them.

I think Norman portable flash was made in the late 50s early 60s. Bare bulb was in use with those units a lot. I had a newer unit that I used into the 90s. Smith may have used flash bulbs for Spanish Wake as it was done in the early 50s I think.50B flash bulbs were available into the 80s as they put out a lot of light and were great for architectural interiors. I'll bet he used a small flash bulb given the time the photo was taken and the remote location of the photo.

With higher power speed lights and faster film, bounce flash has become more popular. You don't see bare bulb flash photos much these days.

 

[Chriscrawfordphoto]

What's the difference between a flash and a strobe?

Some people says Strobe when talking about large powerpack or monolight studio flash units, and Flash to mean camera-mounted small battery powered flashes.

 

[PKR]

Some people says Strobe when talking about large powerpack or monolight studio flash units, and Flash to mean camera-mounted small battery powered flashes.

I didn't know that. It's always been Electronic Flash for studio and Speed Light for small units among my friends.. strobe usually means fast repeating flash or Stroboscope as in Edgerton. I guess Strobe is a catchall?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stroboscope

 

[jim_jm]

According to Jim Hughes' book, Gene wanted to maintain the quality of light coming from a candle to the left and above the man's head, he just needed more of it to take the photo. An assistant held a bare flash bulb near the candle and Gene got off 3 shots before he felt he should go.

 

[Chriscrawfordphoto]

I didn't know that. It's always been Electronic Flash for studio and Speed Light for small units among my friends.. strobe usually means fast repeating flash or Stroboscope as in Edgerton. I guess Strobe is a catchall?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stroboscope

Sppedlight is a trademark from Nikon that has become commonly used for shoe-mount flashes.

All electronic flashes are technically strobes, but the people I have known who did portraiture or commercial product photography in the studio used the term strobe to mean studio flash units. That was true in Indiana, and New Mexico. I've also seen that use of the word in numerous books on studio lighting and in photo magazines.

 

[PKR]

Sppedlight is a trademark from Nikon that has become commonly used for shoe-mount flashes.

All electronic flashes are technically strobes, but the people I have known who did portraiture or commercial product photography in the studio used the term strobe to mean studio flash units. That was true in Indiana, and New Mexico. I've also seen that use of the word in numerous books on studio lighting and in photo magazines.

I'm sure you're right. Just odd to me I guess. I own a bunch of flash gear. The power unit containing the capacitors is called a flash generator and the unit containing the flash tube is called a flash head. So, I guess that's why I've always used and mostly heard "flash units" . Strobe always meant repeating flash to me. But, that's just me.

It seems in the context of the Smith photo it may be flash bulb?

 

[Doug]

Flash bulb seems more likely in that instance... To me, "flash" could be either flash bulbs or electronic flash, whereas "strobe" is specific to electronic flash.

 

[megido]

I will be visiting the location tomorrow to measure the light etc. Will report back. Thank you all so far.

 

[leicapixie]

A great idea is to do a test or two.
In previous times, pre-digital, pre Village Idiot from Google,
photographers ran tests.
A flash bulb was used with long exposure, in Gene Smith's photo.
Films of that period were "Thick" Emulsion and "easy" to manipulate.
Gene was a Master printer and made magic!
Good Luck.

 

[sevo]

Retouche the eyes... 😉 Seriously, according to interviews with him, the picture was posed and heavily retouched for effect. Hard lighting with one single off-camera flash bulb - no soft-box nor natural light involved (see the hard shadows).

 

[megido]

A great idea is to do a test or two.
In previous times, pre-digital, pre Village Idiot from Google,
photographers ran tests.
A flash bulb was used with long exposure, in Gene Smith's photo.
Films of that period were "Thick" Emulsion and "easy" to manipulate.
Gene was a Master printer and made magic!
Good Luck.

I will certainly be doing tests. A softbox may be out of the question as there may be no local electricity!
Will report back.

 

[sevo]

I will certainly be doing tests. A softbox may be out of the question as there may be no local electricity!
Will report back.

He stated that he used a single flash bulb in place of a candle, and the single, hard shadow confirms that. And there were no soft boxes on flash bulbs and other light sources of the time, prior to electronic flash all photo lamps and flashes were hot enough that soft boxes would have caught fire.

Going by the DOF and texture he probably used a 4x5" for the Spanish wake - he started out with Graflex Reflex cameras, but by that time it was probably a Speed Graphic.