Trius
Waiting on Maitani
Marty: What looked weird? The formula or the results?Freakscene said:
Wayne: Cheers!
Keith
The best camera is one that still works!
Harking back to using wine bladders for chemical storage ... I think the way to go is water casks. At our local supermarket you can buy filtered water in 3, 5 or ten litre casks. Cheaper than the wine and no headache in the morning ... also no issues with cleaning them first ... just fill 'em up, and I've noticed the boxes are a lot stronger!
Freakscene
Obscure member
>Marty: What looked weird? The formula or the results?
I was sure the formula would work - the main effect is making the Xtol a lot more alkaline, but I did scratch my head a little.
I tried it on 3 x 12 shot film clips - one of Acros, one of Neopan 400 and one of Tri-X. All had lowered midtones like I would expect from Rodinal, but it was not sharp like I would expect either dilute Xtol or Rodinal to be. The Tri-X particularly was disappointing, since it looks great in either developer (I don't really like the look of any of the Neopans in Rodinal). I wondered if the alkalinity was low enough that the ascorbate was being activated alone, rather than synergistically with the other developing agents. A few grams of borax might help, but why bother?
Keith - you still need to rinse those water casks for Xtol - there is a lot of calcium and other ions in 'mineral' water, often enough to cause sudden developer death syndrome. Rinse with distilled water first.
Marty
I was sure the formula would work - the main effect is making the Xtol a lot more alkaline, but I did scratch my head a little.
I tried it on 3 x 12 shot film clips - one of Acros, one of Neopan 400 and one of Tri-X. All had lowered midtones like I would expect from Rodinal, but it was not sharp like I would expect either dilute Xtol or Rodinal to be. The Tri-X particularly was disappointing, since it looks great in either developer (I don't really like the look of any of the Neopans in Rodinal). I wondered if the alkalinity was low enough that the ascorbate was being activated alone, rather than synergistically with the other developing agents. A few grams of borax might help, but why bother?
Keith - you still need to rinse those water casks for Xtol - there is a lot of calcium and other ions in 'mineral' water, often enough to cause sudden developer death syndrome. Rinse with distilled water first.
Marty
grainhound
Well-known
Robert, thanks. I'm about to end an extended bout of procrastination; haven't dev'd a roll for months. Tomorrow, Dave & Victor, & possibly other GTA guys will join me in a casual 35mm lens comparison, over beer of course. We'll use Tri-X for its versatility & your Rodinal/Xtol combo is a consideration for the developer. I'll probably go with Xtol diluted with water only for the TMAX; it works well enough.
Trius
Waiting on Maitani
Resurrecting this thread ... I got around to processing a roll of Tri-X. This was shot at 1600, I used the medium dilution Rodinal/XTol (actually, Kentmere KTol) formula, 12 minutes @ 20C, 30 seconds if initial agitation, 3 gentle inversions @ 3, 6 & 9 minutes.
Note: No sharpening for this shot. Zuiko 50/1.8 miJ.
Note: No sharpening for this shot. Zuiko 50/1.8 miJ.
venchka
Veteran
Earl,
Looks very good.
Define "medium dilution" for the Xtol with a Rodinal red eye?
I got the spigot off the plastic bladder. All ready for some Xtol. Oh, need Rodinal too.
Looks very good.
Define "medium dilution" for the Xtol with a Rodinal red eye?
I got the spigot off the plastic bladder. All ready for some Xtol. Oh, need Rodinal too.
Trius
Waiting on Maitani
"medium" dilution =
3ml Rodinal + 150ml water + 150ml XTol
BTW, dispensing the XTol from the winebox worked perfectly... I have rescued another box that the missus finished off, and I'm going to use box wine containers for all my chemicals. Eventually I'll have fixer & hypo clearing agent in wine bladders as well.
3ml Rodinal + 150ml water + 150ml XTol
BTW, dispensing the XTol from the winebox worked perfectly... I have rescued another box that the missus finished off, and I'm going to use box wine containers for all my chemicals. Eventually I'll have fixer & hypo clearing agent in wine bladders as well.
rodneyAB
Established
i've been useing 100ml Xtol plus 300ml H2O plus 4ml of Rodinal.
this film is NeopanSS that was developed with a Neopan1600@800 for 9minutes
this film is NeopanSS that was developed with a Neopan1600@800 for 9minutes
Chriscrawfordphoto
Real Men Shoot Film.
Trius said:Resurrecting this thread ... I got around to processing a roll of Tri-X. This was shot at 1600, I used the medium dilution Rodinal/XTol (actually, Kentmere KTol) formula, 12 minutes @ 20C, 30 seconds if initial agitation, 3 gentle inversions @ 3, 6 & 9 minutes.
Note: No sharpening for this shot. Zuiko 50/1.8 miJ.
You shoulda used that pic on our zuiko 50 body cap thread...lol It's NICE. I'll have to try that Xtol/Rodinal combo. I've never seen such nice tonality from a 1600 push of a 400 film. What do you use as a normal developing time (for EI 400)? How's the grain, is it a lot less than Rodinal alone? I like Rodinal's tonality but have been using D-76 1+1 for Tri-X because Rodinal was just too grainy.
rodneyAB
Established
goo0h
Well-known
OK, so I've got a roll of HP5+ shot at 1600. (Nothing especially important. Mainly just trying out HP5+ pushed to that speed.) I'm about to fix-up a new batch of XTOL. (I've been using it for the last year or so without probs.) Not terribly inclined to mess with the Rodinal just yet since I'm still getting used to various films and XTOL as it is.
Anyway, I've heard that it might be better to dev it in XTOL 1:2 solution (isn't 1:3 pretty risky?) as opposed to the typical 1:1 that I've been using. I think the advantage with a longer development time was that there was more shadow detail. Is that right? What are the pros/cons for doing 1:2 over the default 1:1?
The Massive Dev chart has 18min/20C for 1:1 and 21min/20C for 1:2. Does that jive with y'all's experiences?
Anyway, I've heard that it might be better to dev it in XTOL 1:2 solution (isn't 1:3 pretty risky?) as opposed to the typical 1:1 that I've been using. I think the advantage with a longer development time was that there was more shadow detail. Is that right? What are the pros/cons for doing 1:2 over the default 1:1?
The Massive Dev chart has 18min/20C for 1:1 and 21min/20C for 1:2. Does that jive with y'all's experiences?
venchka
Veteran
Here is Kodak's official word on Xtol at 1:1, 1:2 and 1:3 dilutions. It's on the German Kodak web page. Download the PDF and save it. Kodak may kill it someday. Page 13 has all the information on Xtol & Ilford films.
http://wwwfr.kodak.com/AT/plugins/acrobat/de/professional/xtolEntwickler.pdf
http://wwwfr.kodak.com/AT/plugins/acrobat/de/professional/xtolEntwickler.pdf
maddoc
... likes film again.
Wayne, thank you for the link ! That was what I was searching for. I recently developed 125PX (Plus-X) in XTOL 1:3 (120 film, one roll in 1.2 liter solution that is 300 ml XTOL + 900 ml water) and had for the first time problem with air - bubbles sticking on the emulsion. I used XTOL in 1:1 before and no problems at all. Could it be that to much diluted XTOL is a little critical ?
venchka
Veteran
You're welcome! No clue about air bubbles. I still have 10 1 gallon bags of D-76 to get through and then I will try Xxtol & Rodinal.
You certainly used enough developer-more than twice as much as Kodak specifies. Different tank? Plastic reels trapping air? Did you bang the tank to dislodge the bubbles?
You certainly used enough developer-more than twice as much as Kodak specifies. Different tank? Plastic reels trapping air? Did you bang the tank to dislodge the bubbles?
maddoc
... likes film again.
venchka said:
I also finished one gallon of D-76 and switched to XTOL with very good results in 1:1 (Tri-X, Plus-X, Neopan 1600). I recently switched to Masuko stainless steel tanks/ wheels and except this one case (1:3) no problem at all. Also bang the tank after every inversion. A friend suggested to pre-soak the film, I never did pre-soak a film, so can it prevent from air - bubbles ?
maddoc
venchka
Veteran
I love it!
I love it!
I think it's wonderful when one spouse supports the efforts of the other spouse. Your wife is a real trooper!
I love it!
Trius said:
I think it's wonderful when one spouse supports the efforts of the other spouse. Your wife is a real trooper!