XTOL Mishap

[Kai-san]

I’ve clearly been doing something wrong for decades.

It seems to me that your "wrongdoing" has produced some excellent images. Those who fear "sudden death" should rather go for the Adox XT-3, it lasts longer than the current Kodak XTOL and you can get it in one litre packs. I have not tried any of the other XTOL clones out there.

 

[wlewisiii]

I’ve clearly been doing something wrong for decades.

Heh.

I'll still stick to my preferred D-76 & Diafine but that works well for you so, enjoy! The results are a delight.

 

[Sonnar Brian]

I’ve clearly been doing something wrong for decades.

No- YOU actually take time to understand what you are doing, and then do it as well as possible.

 

[Freakscene]

No- YOU actually take time to understand what you are doing, and then do it as well as possible.

Thank you.

 

[yanchep_mike]

I’ve clearly been doing something wrong for decades.

Your images are up there with the best, in my opinion, I have used XTOL / ECO-PRO for 10+ years and never pulled a blank film.

 

[titrisol]

View attachment 4832566

This one is on Neopan 1600 in Xtol 1+3. I miss that film.

I have had mishaps with Xtol, but it never cost me any shots because I check each batch. I used to mix it 50L at a time, but Kodak stopped supplying them. The lab I help out at doesn’t replenish, so they use a lot of Xtol/X-T3.

The Neopans (400, 1600 and Acros) were fantastic!
Acros in Ilford DDX was just a thing of beauty

So what's the problem with low contrast negatives?

PS I found the magazine with the Genesis of Xtol article, if anyone wants a scan send me a PM

 

[Ororaro]

All wonderful examples that would have been even more wonderful with D76. At least that’s the case with all my negatives.

What’s really cool about buying D76 is that your money still goes to Kodak. Just saying.

 

[Coldkennels]

All wonderful examples that would have been even more wonderful with D76.

Am I the only one who thinks D76 and ID11 are perhaps the most boring developers?

I tend to use them both (I know, they're the same thing) as a starting point: they give me a baseline for a film. But they don't excel at anything: they don't give me higher speed or pushing capability (Microphen), increased sharpness (Rodinal), reduced grain (HC-110/LC29), easier workflows (I hate mixing powders), decent shelf-life (once mixed), or even the best possible tonality from a film (literally anything other than D76, in my eyes).

Both developers are the beige of the film developing world, in my eyes. They're fine... but there's always something better.

Also:

What’s really cool about buying D76 is that your money still goes to Kodak. Just saying.

I see no reason to give money to a company that has been chronically mis-managed, has a long track record of anti-consumer practices (gimmicky formats to try to lock people into proprietary or semi-proprietary camera/film/flash combinations, often involving selling less film for more money in the process), sells their products for higher prices than their competitors, and more importantly... doesn't even produce films that I particularly like!

 

[Ororaro]

Am I the only one who thinks D76 and ID11 are perhaps the most boring developers?

I tend to use them both (I know, they're the same thing) as a starting point: they give me a baseline for a film. But they don't excel at anything: they don't give me higher speed or pushing capability (Microphen), increased sharpness (Rodinal), reduced grain (HC-110/LC29), easier workflows (I hate mixing powders), decent shelf-life (once mixed), or even the best possible tonality from a film (literally anything other than D76, in my eyes).

Both developers are the beige of the film developing world, in my eyes. They're fine... but there's always something better.

Also:

I see no reason to give money to a company that has been chronically mis-managed, has a long track record of anti-consumer practices (gimmicky formats to try to lock people into proprietary or semi-proprietary camera/film/flash combinations, often involving selling less film for more money in the process), sells their products for higher prices than their competitors, and more importantly... doesn't even produce films that I particularly like!

Kodak is a pathetic company, they went from being BIGGER than NASA to nothing… not even capable of producing their own chemicals.

Still, the forum mob is very effective at mobbing. If D76 wasn’t a kodak company, this would have quickly turned into lynching at my expense. Happened with chinese lenses… 😝

D76 is such a great developer. It’s easy to see it as you see it because that is what humans do best: quickly judge, based on trivial information, heresay, and contrarial hipster thubking. But there is a reason why D76 is legendary.

By the way, TMX was created and developed uniquely with D76 as its benchmark. But it truly looks best with ilfosol-3.

 

[Coldkennels]

If D76 wasn’t a kodak company, this would have quickly turned into lynching at my expense. Happened with chinese lenses… 😝

Nah, I referenced ID11 as that's what I usually use. I've never bought a packet of D76 in my life; ID11 is easier to get here in the UK and costs less. My issue with the developer is because of the developer - my issues with Kodak are with Kodak. Different thing altogether.

D76 is such a great developer. It’s easy to see it as you see it because that is what humans do best: quickly judge, based on trivial information, heresay, and contrarial hipster thubking. But there is a reason why D76 is legendary.

I'm not saying this out of hearsay - I'm saying this out of testing it with the films I prefer to use (and some oddball ones I've used here and there over the years). As a result of my own experience, I'd argue it's legendary because it's consistent - like I said, it's a baseline developer, in that it works with everything and never really looks bad. Doesn't matter if you're using Pan F+, HP5+, Delta 3200... you'll get a workable image. That doesn't mean it's the best possible image, but it'll never produce something as divisive as HP5+ in Rodinal will.

This is the same reason I generally prefer Fomapan 100 over FP4+; FP4+ isn't bad, it's just not as interesting to me as Fomapan is, and the way Fomapan 100 looks in Rodinal is second to none.

 

[Ororaro]

No kidding. Foma100 is closer to original Tri-X than current Tri-X.

And it’s so flexible that it seems it almost could get developed in water alone. Foma100 always looks good.

 

[Freakscene]

All wonderful examples that would have been even more wonderful with D76. At least that’s the case with all my negatives.

What’s really cool about buying D76 is that your money still goes to Kodak. Just saying.

I don’t see any difference between sending my money to Kodak or to Adox/Fotoimpex, except that Kodak can’t deliver product that is reliably within spec. D76 included. Perhaps you can explain Ned.

You also may note that the formula for Kodak’s current ‘legendary’ D76 differs substantially from the original, and changed without notice when Sino Promise took over production, same as Xtol.

 

[Ororaro]

I don’t see any difference between sending my money to Kodak or to Adox/Fotoimpex, except that Kodak can’t deliver product that is reliably within spec. D76 included. Perhaps you can explain Ned.

You also may note that the formula for Kodak’s current ‘legendary’ D76 differs substantially from the original, and changed without notice when Sino Promise took over production, same as Xtol.

All of Kodak’s chemicals are coming back, soon. The whole complete list.

 

[Ororaro]

You didn’t know?

Insider info.

 

[wlewisiii]

Kodak lost me the day Plus-X went away.

I'll stick to Freestyle's Arista clone of D-76 & their fixer as well. More consistent, cheaper, yada yada yada.

Ilford for film stock, especially if they figure out how to make decent C-41 (Phoenix - so close and yet so far ... ) so I can walk away from Kodak completely.

 

[Freakscene]

You didn’t know?

Insider info.

Of course everyone who is interested knows. It is not insider info at all. Kodak have stated that they found a new subcontractor, Photo Systems Inc and it has been public announcements. They already make Freestyle’s clone developers. You can visit them in Dexter, Michigan.

There will be no original D76, Kodak label or not. For D-76 you can always make that yourself if you want the ‘legendary’ formula.

Kodak lost me the day Plus-X went away.

I'll stick to Freestyle's Arista clone of D-76 & their fixer as well. More consistent, cheaper, yada yada yada.

Ilford for film stock, especially if they figure out how to make decent C-41 (Phoenix - so close and yet so far ... ) so I can walk away from Kodak completely.

The new Kodak products will be the same as the Freestyle ones. Except with a yellow package. Including watery HC-110.

 

[maddoc]

That one was Double-X, exposed for 400ISO.

201102-09-M7-XX-400ISO-40ROK-135HEKTOR-19 Kopie.jpg by Gabor Samjeske, on Flickr

 

[Freakscene]

That one was Double-X, exposed for 400ISO.

201102-09-M7-XX-400ISO-40ROK-135HEKTOR-19 Kopie.jpg by Gabor Samjeske, on Flickr

I love the small backstreets in Japanese towns and cities. This looks just like a late night wander.

 

[dourbalistar]

Including watery HC-110.

Hey now, the official name is LegacyPro L110, ok. 🤪

 

[Freakscene]

Hey now, the official name is LegacyPro L110, ok. 🤪

Indeed. And fresh it works just the same as the old stuff, sensitometrically it’s exactly the same and it’s much easier to measure. But if you find that seven eighths empty bottle in 15 years time it might not be the same . . .