Fed 3 shutter speed issue

[defconfunk]

Over the weekend I picked up a Fed 3b. It's my first FSU, and while the later Zorkis seemed preferable to me, this one was local and inexpensive, so I took a chance.

The contrast patch is gorgeous, much brighter than my Yashica Minister was. There are zero frame lines, which is a shame, but since I'm shooting roughly 50mm (industar 61), I should be able to guess well enough. If I get a 35mm lens in the future I'll probably get an accessory finder for that.

Now, the purpose of my post - I'm having a problem with the shutter. It fires, but always at the same speed. I'm guessing it is firing at something close to 1/60 - 1/125. Definitely not 1/30, and I doubt 1/250. I haven't checked this with film, just by holding open the back and watching the shutter. Even when set to B it fires the same.

I'm thinking the issue may be related to the shutter speed selector.

From the FSU shutter setting sticky (http://www.rangefinderforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=134577)

If you have a FED or Zorki, take a look at the speed selector dial. There are 2 styles: one has a one-piece dial marked with the speeds and an index mark on the camera body. The other has a 2-piece dial with a centre shaft that carries the index mark and an outer rim with the speeds marked. The dial AND index mark revolve together on the 2-piece dial.

Mine is the later, only the outter dial doesn't rotate. only the inner/top dial rotates when I wind. Currnetly I lift the selector and turn it to the right number. Is this wrong? Should I be leaving it down and turning it? There's a fair amount of resistance (enough that I didn't think that was the right way to chose the speed and tried lifting).

 

[wolves3012]

The FED 3b has a 1-piece dial. Cock the shutter first (that's important), then lift and turn the dial to the speed you want. By "the outer dial does not rotate", do you mean the part with the numbers marked? If so, that's correct, it shouldn't rotate.

As for why it's firing at only one speed, there could be several reasons. Firstly, when you lift a turn the dial to a slower speed (say 1/2 or 1 sec), can you feel some resistance and feel/hear the clockwork delay mechanism being wound? If not, the dial might be loose on its shaft and not actually changing speeds at all - there are two small screws just under the rim - are they loose?

If the dial isn't loose, then the fault lies internally and it'll need to be partly dismantled to access the problem. The usual cause is a small spring in the curtain release mechanics. We can give you further advice if you want to tackle that.

 

[defconfunk]

Thanks wolves!

I don't feel resistance moving to the slow speeds. Tomorrow when I get a chance, I'll investigate the screws under the rim. I'll post back when I've tried that.

I got the camera knowing it would be a bit of a camera-repair lesson for me. I've ordered a set of spanners so I can replace the grease in the Industar-61. Eventually the leatherette will need to be replaced. I'm hoping nothing serious in the internals needs work, but it seems like of all the cameras to learn surgery on, the FSUs are a good place to start.

 

[defconfunk]

Thanks Wolves, that was indeed the problem.

Unfortunately, now I know that my low speeds aren't working properly. Does anyone know of a how-to guide (web page, or book that I can atually find) to fix/adjust the shutter speeds on one of these?

I know I could send it off for a CLA, but I'd like to learn how to CLA it myself.

 

[wolves3012]

What's wrong with the slow speeds exactly? Internally, the setup is very similar to the Zorki 4, for which there's a CLA sticky. Things to note: You can safely remove the winder without the precautions noted in the Zorki thread, it won't all fly apart on you. Also, when you remove the top there's a large washer around the eyepiece tube on the inside, it's likely to fall out and leave you wondering where it came from. Note very carefully the order of the parts you remove from the frame counter/film reminder dials. Apart from those things, taking the top off a FED 3b is straightforward enough.

 

[defconfunk]

What's wrong with the slow speeds exactly? Internally, the setup is very similar to the Zorki 4, for which there's a CLA sticky.

Thanks!

The slow speeds are running too fast. The 1/2 second is much faster than 1/2s (maybe more like 1/15 or 1/8).

 

[Penny Lane]

Just to be sure on our (the readers) end: are you absolutely positive that you've fixed the shutter speed dial in the right position when you tightened the grub screws?

Derk

 

[defconfunk]

Just to be sure on our (the readers) end: are you absolutely positive that you've fixed the shutter speed dial in the right position when you tightened the grub screws?

Derk

I think so. I say "think" because the B setting is correct (it's the easiest to test for, so I used it as my baseline). The shutter speed definitely changes values, and the 1/500 is definitely faster than the 1/250, which in turn appears faster than the 1/125 (but the difference is not as distinct as between the 500 and 250).

I am not certain that I've got it properly because it has a hard time 'finding' the 1s stop, and I can't tell a difference between set to 1s and set to 1/2.

 

[rfaspen]

I was thinking the same as Penny Lane, slow speeds aren't often *faster* than they're supposed to be. The usual case is the opposite. If the speed dial was offset from the correct position, it would have been an easy fix.

Did you fully remove the outer speed dial to check the condition of the "dial" underneath? I wonder if there's some elongation to the index holes from people attempting to make a broken camera conform to their expectations (I've had 2 cameras with wind-on mechanisms destroyed by heavy handed people forcing the knob to turn the direction they think it should go. Even though the little arrow on top says otherwise.)

BTW, if you decide to lift off the speed dial, don't remove the grub screws completely. Just back them off enough so you can lift the dial. They are sooooo easy to lose and they roll, roll, roll.

 

[rfaspen]

And of course, you're setting the shutter speed *after* winding....right?

 

[defconfunk]

Yes, definitely setting speed after.

I did fully remove the selector. Underneath looks clean and smooth. I was actually surprised there were specific indents for the grub screws, just a channel the whole way around.

I'll play more with it and bring back better answers.