Film coming off reel

[wintoid]

It's over a year since I started developing my own BW films and I've got it nailed, or so I thought. I'm using a plastic AP 330ml tank which is lovely, and inside I have a Hewes "Paterson-fit" stainless steel reel, which I can load with no problems 100% of the time.

Now, I've been mucking around with a new developer (Tanol), but the last 2 rolls I've processed have come off the reel during development 😱 I currently agitate by rotating the stem to rotate the reel, but obviously I'm now considering inversions instead. Of course that may affect the whole process, which I'd finally got down pat.

Any opinions about this? Is Tanol causing the problem (seems unlikely but I don't know)? Is this a dirty reel or something? I really can't see what I'm doing wrong.

 

[Toby]

I'd use an old roll of unexposed film and do a dummy run with water, checking at every stage. Also is is a multi format reel that somehow opened up v slightly?

 

[schmoozit]

You need to change to a different technique for agitation at any rate. Using the twister is not recommended, even by the manufacturer (at least not Paterson). It's intended for a quick first agitation only to help dislodge air bubbles. To use it for your entire agitation routine can possibly cause uneven development. You are effectively agitating the outer film area more than the inner area, and there was another reason or two that I forget as to why you shouldn't use the twister that I cannot recall.

All that said, it would probably be hard to tell with at least some developers whether there is indeed uneven dev or not.

I've not used any stainless steel reel yet, but I would guess that the possible cause of your woes is indeed the twist method with your new developer. If your new developer is more "slippery" than your old, it's possible.

 

[wintoid]

Thanks both for your input. It's not a multiformat reel, so it wouldn't open up. I hadn't realised that twisting the twizzler wasn't a recommended way of agitating. I can't bear the prospect of another disappointment at the tank-opening stage, so I think perhaps I'll just switch to inversions and be done with it. It sounds like I needed to make that change anyway. Every cloud has a silver lining...

 

[schmoozit]

Keep in mind that I'm not too confident that inversions for your agitation will solve your main problem. You may want to wait for someone else who uses stainless steel to chime in before doing any more souping.

Also, how do you feel about your reel? I'd like to give stainless a try, but wonder how hard they are to load.

 

[wintoid]

I used to use the plastic AP reels, and then the plastic Paterson reels. When I had problems with those reels, there didn't seem to be an easy way to "back up a few stages and have another go". If something felt snarled, I always had to take the reel apart and reload from scratch, and sometimes that meant I would damage the film. Often the film would snarl at the same point the next time I loaded it.

When I switched to stainless steel, I learned to wind the film on to the reel a couple of turns, then wiggle it back and forth to check it was sitting in the tracks properly then on to the next few turns and so on. You can really feel what's going on, and you can very very easily back up a couple of turns if you get it wrong. Since about the 3rd roll I did with stainless steel, I have had absolutely zero problems with loading the reel.

I'm using the Hewes reel because of the good reputation it has. I don't have experience with other reels, but I would say that the most important thing with stainless steel reels is the initial connection of the film to the reel, in other words how it clips on or attaches. With my Hewes reel that's very easy and I can tell instantly if everything is OK.

I'm also trying to use the medium format Hewes "Paterson-compatible" reel. I am finding that harder, but once I've learned to clip the film in consistently, I don't think I'll have any problems.

 

[Ronald M]

Taper the leading corners for plastic reel loading and never get wetting agents on them. They will get sticky over time and can not be repaired. Used purchases can be a problem because they don`t feel sticky, just don`t load properly.

Twist for initial quick agitation only. Invert for all the rest. It is right in Patersons instructions.

 

[schmoozit]

Thanks for relating your experience, Wintoid. I'll likely try stainless as some point.

 

[eric]

If you really want to do the twist method (guessing film is being forced out from the opposite direction of the flow), you can tape the end of the film to the back of the film.

 

[BILLC]

I use stainless for most work and had the same problem before I got a tank lid that I could invert with out spilling. I would twist back and forth and the film would walk off the reel. I now have plastic caps that don't leak and invert with no problem. I never use the clip to load the reels, just start next to it and roll it on. It is hard to get the film centered under the clip and it wind on. Does anyone know how to do that?
Bill