Film is Dead for Overseas Travel…

[HHPhoto]

....something really out there and go live in some cool North Atlantic islands for a couple months. All the travel and lodging logistics are well worked out and in budget but I am facing a big, BIG problem.

One can simply no longer travel with film in tow overseas and expect to avoid the nasty new CT scanning technology with carry on luggage.

So, if I have understood you right you want to be on the Farör islands for several months for a professional film photography project.
Due to what all the American film photographers have said so far, for flights in between the USA there won't be a problem, because the TSA rules are that you have a right for film hand inspection if you want (especially at those airports which have the new CT scanners).
So flying from your home (Colorado?) to maybe New York for the oversea flight is not a problem.

The problem could be in Europe: After landing in Europe you need the second flight to the Farör islands. I guess Frankfurt, Amsterdam, London, Kopenhagen, Oslo maybe the right airports for that.
So asking these airports which are possible for the second, final flight should be the way to go:
- which of them has still the older, film-safe scanners (those with these scanners are the right choice)
- if one has the new CT scanner: Do they offer hand-checks for film.

Honestly, I have my doubts that all possible European airports that offer flights to the Farör have both
- new CT sanners
and at the same time
- refuse hand-checks generally.
There are probably 1-2 airports which either have still the older film-safe scanners, or are offering hand-checks if they are running the new CT machines.

Cheers, Jan

 

[Guest]

It was Manchester airport that refused to hand check my film and cameras. So I think it’s how they feel on the day if they want to be pleasant and helpful. The chinese in Shanghai flatly refused to hand check, it was X ray or no flight. They make it awkward for all English and American citizens.

 

[HHPhoto]

I was planning to use 4x5” ektachrome here in Chile and bring it back to the USA for development since I can’t find anyone to do it here. This changes that plan. I just don’t want to deal with hoping for hand check while dealing with immigration crap, etc. Might have to go b&w unfortunately.

I guess you are using a non-stop flight from Chile to the US?
Then you have only to ask the airport of your departure (Santiago?) whether they are
- still using the older film-safe scanners (if yes, you are fine with your film)
- or using new CT technology.
If CT is used, ask before travel if they are doing hand-checks for film. If yes, you are fine again.

Cheers, Jan

 

[HHPhoto]

Similar to OtL, I emailed the 4 airports in UK I use the most (Manchester, Liverpool, Birmingham and Heathrow). Liverpool and Manchester replied so far.
Liverpool said that their current hand luggage machines are safe for films. If the passenger suspects not that be suitable for X-RAY to have an officer informed as they offer other imagining scanners and manual inspection.

Manchester airport (which is one of those suspected having CT scanners) replied
"If your film(s) are not suitable for x-ray screening our security officers can conduct additional security checks so these particular items can avoid going through the x-ray tunnel

I think printing these statements on paper and having it with you on the travel should be a good thing:
If there is a problem with the security staff you can show him/her the official statements and can say that you have relied on their word.
The security staff certainly would not like to have trouble with their boss(es).

Cheers, Jan

 

[bcostin]

Not really a concern right now.

https://www.npr.org/sections/corona...-travel-advisories-citing-risks-from-covid-19

I suppose that depends on one's overall balance of life's many concerns. These sorts of travel advisories are informational. As always, we each must make decisions appropriate to our own interests, comfort, and best judgement.

 

[drew.saunders]

Strict security measures tend to apply to passenger crafts because they are targets for terrorism. On the other hand the terrorism risk is low for cargo planes so courier parcels only get random scanning and do not get the heavy X-ray dose like passenger airlines.

Hmmm, how does freestyle and B&H (among others) ship film all over the world?

Here's a business idea that's free for the taking, and likely worth as much as I'm charging for it:

B&H or Freestyle could set up a shipping option, not just for new film that you buy and have shipped to you (wherever you are in the world), but for return shipping from your work/vacation spot back to your home.

Drew

 

[SaveKodak]

Fed Ex your film. It's a safer way to go and you don't have to deal with grumpy TSA type people potentially opening a 120 roll. Fed Ex does not X-ray all packages.

 

[KenR]

The TSA people here in the US are polite but can be very insistent on running things through the scanner. If you give them a hard time you are liable to be arrested or to receive a thorough all body cavity search. In Italy some years ago, the security agent in Rome pointed an Uzi type machine gun at me and insisted that I run my film through the scanner. I was not in the position of calling his supervisor and insisting on a hand search. So it’s kind of hit or miss depending on who is working and when you are going through security.

From this thread, it sounds like the best option for an important trip is to ship the film from home or to buy from one of the big retailers in the country of your destination and either process it abroad or ship it home separately.

 

[Highway 61]

The security staff certainly would not like to have trouble with their boss(es).

Sounds like you haven't travelled by plane for a long time. In many airports, large European ones for instance, the security staff are people hired on short-term contracts with low salaries, they'll do what they want to with your belongings and asking for some hand check of your films bag is a gamble. Either will it work out fine, or it will be scan (thus, damaged films if the machines are of the new CT scan type), or it will be possible confiscation of your films bag if you still refuse that your films get scanned and if the discussion turns into a kind of an argument because they don't want to perform the requested hand check. I haven't travelled as much as many fellows here but I still have to meet friendly security staff people (to the exception of the very nice guy at Washington Ronald Reagan airport, as stated above). I have even been put aside and triple checked many times because of my film camera gear being something they hadn't seen before, and which looked suspect to them somehow.

 

[valdas]

Sounds like you haven't travelled by plane for a long time. In many airports, large European ones for instance, the security staff are people hired on short-term contracts with low salaries, they'll do what they want to with your belongings and asking for hand check of your films bag is a gamble. Either will it work out fine, or it will be CT scan (and damaged films), or it will be confiscation of your films bag if the discussion turns into a kind of an argument. I haven't travelled as much as many fellows here but I still have to meet friendly security staff people (to the exception of the very nice guy at Washington Ronald Reagan airport, as stated above). I have even been put aside and triple checked many times because of my film camera gear being something they hadn't seen before, and which looked suspect to them somehow.

My experience in Europe is that in smaller cities it’s quite ok. In Helsinki for example it’s extremely polite, also never had any issues in Copenhagen, but I feel it’s getting worse now. Big airports, on the other hand, are really a gamble. I once had a good experience in Heathrow - a security person even commented that those days people rarely use such cameras (looking at my Rolleiflex) and we chatted friendly, but that was rather an exception. Paris, Rome, Madrid - you never know... I don’t even know if this hand inspection is somehow formally regulated (I doubt it). Even if it were, it’s not worth arguing with the security. Complaints are possible ex post, but even if one proves something and airport would apologize later, it does not help because it’s too late.

 

[Disappointed_Horse]

What a miserable world we live in where a film camera arouses suspicion and paranoia prevents us from traveling with our chosen artistic medium.

 

[KM-25]

So, if I have understood you right you want to be on the Farör islands for several months for a professional film photography project.
Due to what all the American film photographers have said so far, for flights in between the USA there won't be a problem, because the TSA rules are that you have a right for film hand inspection if you want (especially at those airports which have the new CT scanners).
So flying from your home (Colorado?) to maybe New York for the oversea flight is not a problem.

The problem could be in Europe: After landing in Europe you need the second flight to the Farör islands. I guess Frankfurt, Amsterdam, London, Kopenhagen, Oslo maybe the right airports for that.
So asking these airports which are possible for the second, final flight should be the way to go:
- which of them has still the older, film-safe scanners (those with these scanners are the right choice)
- if one has the new CT scanner: Do they offer hand-checks for film.

Honestly, I have my doubts that all possible European airports that offer flights to the Farör have both
- new CT sanners
and at the same time
- refuse hand-checks generally.
There are probably 1-2 airports which either have still the older film-safe scanners, or are offering hand-checks if they are running the new CT machines.

Cheers, Jan

No matter how I book the flight, it goes from the U.S. to Copenhagen, generally considered to be a hand check friendly airport. But they now use the new technology scanners. So a couple things...let's say I am going to through with shipping the majority of the 400 rolls of film.

1. I am going to try to carry 40-50 rolls of 120 film in wrappers then ziplock bags while traveling, depending if SAS airlines lifts their current one item only carry on baggage restriction.

2. I have found in many travel scenarios that while I can get a hand check in the U.S. in the airport of departure, it will need to be checked again upon arrival in the main hub airport before my final destination.

So I am expecting to need to have a hand check of these 40-50 rolls in both Denver and then when I arrive in Copenhagen. Then I will need to have a hand check when I depart and when I arrive in the U.S.

If the 40-50 rolls of film gets forced through a CT scanner in Copenhagen on the way in, they are trash and I will have to rely solely on the film I shipped ahead. If I end up with say, 30-60 rolls unused at the end of the project, I would ship it all back together with the exposed film.

I am also looking at what it might cost to send the film out somewhere in Europe to have it processed and then shipped to my home....an amount I am guessing will easily exceed the price to ship the unexposed film back to my home in the first place, where I can process it to my taste and using my tight quality control methods.

So you can see the complexity, uncertainty and possible cost of now seriously using film in a country that is not your own.

Here's a business idea that's free for the taking, and likely worth as much as I'm charging for it:

B&H or Freestyle could set up a shipping option, not just for new film that you buy and have shipped to you (wherever you are in the world), but for return shipping from your work/vacation spot back to your home.

Drew

Among other suggestions, I have already made both B&H and Freestyle aware of this kind of need.

Fed Ex your film. It's a safer way to go and you don't have to deal with grumpy TSA type people potentially opening a 120 roll. Fed Ex does not X-ray all packages.

Fedex is super straightforward in getting it there, but I will need to use DHL to send it back....and they are a nightmare to figure out. I am going back and forth with a supervisor right now in trying to just get a damned quote, it's brutal.

 

[das]

What a miserable world we live in where a film camera arouses suspicion and paranoia prevents us from traveling with our chosen artistic medium.

Amen.

Ask the FAA or TSA or the DOT or whatever to establish a rule that upon request, all film will be hand checked. Don't see why there would be any pushback to that. I mean, as late as the late 1960s, you could take an entire briefcase full of handguns on a plane and then purchase a life insurance policy at the gate. Why would film ever be considered suspicious?

 

[KM-25]

Why would film ever be considered suspicious?

It's funny you mentioned that...

I just got done mock packing a carry on of 40 rolls of 120 and thought from a bit of a distance it looked like a "Star Spangled Super-Saver Pack" of M-80's.

What a fun ride this is, eh?

 

[Bill Clark]

The first three words in the title of your thread says it all for me..

 

[sanmich]

Until now, with the old type scanners, the question of accepting a hand check was pretty much based on the good will of the team there, because the old machines were not strong enough to cause damage in one pass. My understanding is that paradoxically, the new machines where apparently you could just throw your film to the garbage instead of scanning it, change things in good and in bad. For example, in the US, it comes with the right for travelers to ask for a hand check, no questions asked, no matter the quantity of film. They will just do it. I contacted them ahead of my last travel there when I planned to buy several 30m rolls at BH, and that was their answers. So that's good. the bad might come from countries/airports where no new regulations have been adopted and they are just used to answer "no" because they have been explained that there is no damage done to film. I have no idea what to do in such cases, but maybe if locals would major hubs on the issue, some of the more "serious" place would do their homework on the subject and apply new regulations?

 

[Out to Lunch]

I received this reply to my query -which covers all airports in Canada:

"On behalf of the Canadian Air Transport Security Authority (CATSA), we thank you for your e-mail in which you enquired if your film may bypass x-ray screening.

Transport Canada regulates what is permitted onboard flights originating in Canada. These regulations are enforced by screening officers at pre-board security.

Film is permitted in both carry-on and checked baggage. We recommend that you put undeveloped film and cameras containing undeveloped film in your carry-on baggage and ask the screener to conduct a hand inspection when you arrive at the screening checkpoint".


Considering the feedback from Changi Airport and CATSA, all is fine in the biggest hub in SE Asia, and in all airports in Canada. Cheers, OtL

 

[Highway 61]

"On behalf of the Canadian Air Transport Security Authority (CATSA), we thank you for your e-mail in which you enquired if your film may bypass x-ray screening.
Transport Canada regulates what is permitted onboard flights originating in Canada. These regulations are enforced by screening officers at pre-board security.
Film is permitted in both carry-on and checked baggage. We recommend that you put undeveloped film and cameras containing undeveloped film in your carry-on baggage and ask the screener to conduct a hand inspection when you arrive at the screening checkpoint".

Still the same conventional X-ray versus new CT-scan confusing answer, besides what they say about film being permitted onboard their planes, which is fully off-topic.

Until now, with the old type scanners, the question of accepting a hand check was pretty much based on the good will of the team there, because the old machines were not strong enough to cause damage in one pass. My understanding is that paradoxically, the new machines where apparently you could just throw your film to the garbage instead of scanning it, change things in good and in bad. For example, in the US, it comes with the right for travelers to ask for a hand check, no questions asked, no matter the quantity of film. They will just do it. I contacted them ahead of my last travel there when I planned to buy several 30m rolls at BH, and that was their answers. (...) I have no idea what to do in such cases, but maybe if locals would major hubs on the issue, some of the more "serious" place would do their homework on the subject and apply new regulations?

Very good points. Up to now, films hand check has not become an international right for anybody travelling with a bag full of films in their carry-on stuff and going through a security checkpoint equipped with CT-scan machines. You have the right to ask for it.

 

[jsrockit]

I don’t trust a copy and paste e-mail at all... these checkpoints in the airport have some of the crankiest people I’ve ever met. I feel they believe it’s their job to make things rough. I would not rely on hand check at all. You definitely will come across a jerk at the worst possible time.

 

[Out to Lunch]

Sorry, but my question to CATSA was specifically about CT scanners and film. The next time I'll fly through Canada, I'll bring a copy of the CATSA reply. If you choose not to trust government agencies' responses, leave your film at home and limit yourself as per your preconceived ideas. Cheers, OtL