Carl Zeiss LTM Finally! ~ I bought a "wartime" 1943 CZJ Sonnar T f1.5/50 in LTM

Carl Zeiss M39 lenses
Brian Sweeney said:
The above lens lacks the column of two set screws in the focus ring, and looks like a regular J-3 focus mount. Remount or early J-3? Hard to tell.

I use 99% Isopropyl alchohol.
Click to expand...

I have been tempted to buy a 1950 J-12 in LTM from one of the Russian eBay sellers, to compare it to an LTM Biogon. Also, I have seen both Biogon Krasnogorsk (BK) lenses and J-12s with a date of 1950, and both were produced by KMZ, according to the beauty ring.
 
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Every estate sale on my end sports Kodak Instamatic cameras at best.

with our Belgian neighbours, Dutchmen are known for being cheap. I disagree, except when it comes to camera gear!

UPDATE: had word from the seller of the Biogon I bid on. Serial number 284xxxx, what year does that correspond to?
 
buzzardkid said:
UPDATE: had word from the seller of the Biogon I bid on. Serial number 284xxxx, what year does that correspond to?
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Theile shows one batch of Biogons with 284 serial number range, dated Nov 1945, in leica mount. Book has Leica-F in the "Fassung" category, which means "mount", I think.

I have an LTM Biogon in this range, and it appears to be a zeiss product, including matching serial numbers and the three white paint-filled part numbers that Brian has described on wartime sonnars. Brass holding the lens groups together, but aluminum body, including the helicals- helicals had the paint-filled part numbers. I took it apart a while ago to clean the sand out of it. It did not occur to me until after I spent hours trying to screw the helical together correctly that those two little scratches on the outer helical were register marks probably put there by the person that assembled the lens in the first place. Lined those up, and it went together perfectly.
 
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The 'mismatched' Biogon is mine.

🙂😀🙂😀

I made an offer and we bargained, I just paid for it. No, I'm not gonna tell how much. But, gotta thank Tom for pointing the 'mismatch' out to me since it definitely wasn't the selling price from the sale!

🙂🙂🙂Thank you, Tom!!!🙂🙂🙂

My Sonnars will have a 1942/1945 new friend soon. And, I cleaned house, selling off a lot of small stuff online to fund it. So even the wife is happy, three boxes of 'rubbish' gone from the attic.
 
Sounds like you got the lens for a decent price-congratulations! A fun lens to use, if not especially ergonomic when it comes to changing aperture.
 
hmmm. Anyone see this auction?

5388787587_1a6f075891_b.jpg
 
Thanks Dexdog, I'm looking forward to receiving and using mine. My only 35 lens is a Konica 35/2.0 L-Hexanon, modern lens with high contrast and I was looking for something less contrasty when I ran into the Biogon so it was double luck I guess.

Tom, that 85 you sent a link from sold after all, in the last minute. Guess that seller got lucky. Buyer with deep pockets.

I've ordered Hartmut Thieles book on Zeiss production figures and dates from Peter Loy in the UK. Think I have seen Sonnars with 268, 270, 271, 272, 283, 284 and 285 serial numbers and I wanted to know that the other serial ranges where used on. And also find out what other nice stuff they made!
 
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I didn't think that the price on that 85 was too bad...I was watching it, but figured that I would hold out for an earlier lens, instead of a Dec 1945 version. Still, a really good lens, one of my favorites in Contax RF mount.
 
dexdog said:
I didn't think that the price on that 85 was too bad...I was watching it, but figured that I would hold out for an earlier lens, instead of a Dec 1945 version. Still, a really good lens, one of my favorites in Contax RF mount.
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I found one other 85 on sale online, but it's EUR 650 for a 277xxxx serial number, so that USD 500 starts to sound quite good. Had the seller of my MixMatch Biogon declined my offer I might have jumped on it, but I definitely could not afford them both. The search for an 85 will be off for quite some time, no more boxes of 'rubbish' to sell off left (wife still happy though).

Anyway, guess search criteria for eBay US must be different for US residents, I never dig up these nice lenses you guys are following...

Anyone care to write me off the board with some tips on where to look for what criteria? Just window shopping, but still.
 
I went back to check mine's pictures (lens is in the mail) but it's in meters 😀

Great lens Tom! Too bad the kit it was part of was broken up, quite a unique set-up too I guess.

I agree that the current macro camera is a bit less detailed but the photographers skills (and the camera p*rn!😛) easily make up for it!

The Sonnars are ready to go outdoors for a shoot but I've so little time it will be a while before I can. And then there's the backlog in film🙄 Guess I will have to make the Sonnar film cut some corners to come out first!
 
I find it kinda odd that the lens is calibrated in feet, instead of meters. Who knows where this lens has been, and what circumstances it was built under.
 
Photos of my two LTM Biogons. The one on the left is a 271 series CZJ lens, with aperture ring extending beyond the front of the outer barrel (Theile production date March 1943), which looks more or less similar to Tom's lens. The second is a 284 series CZJ lens with the aperture ring flush with/slightly inside of the outer barrel (Theile production date of Nov 1945). Both lenses have brass interiors, and aluminum helicals and barrels. I have taken both lenses apart, and they appear to be be Zeiss products, with matching white paint-filled part numbers and matching numbered lens elements (Note: the part numbers on the wartime lenses do not appear to be related to the serial numbers). The 271 series lens looks very much like Tom's lens, except the one I have has no distance scale. My 271 lens has the same two-stage machining of the front lens barrel as seen in Tom's lens, as seen in the third photo. The 284 series lens is calibrated in meters and has a small "m", and looks a lot like the Biogon Krasnogorsk lenses and the early J-12 lenses (circa 1950), except that the BK lenses have a capital "M' mark on the distance scale.
 
Mine is in the mail, but has the exact same screw. And it wasn't worked over in the US, it's coming from Ukraine...

This might be a version difference only between your lenses and others, PAN-F? Even if both Toms lens and mine were worked on, how big is the chance of them having identical screws while half a world apart?
 
Infinity marking of my 284 series Biogon; different that Tom's. Probably not too surprising, given the exigencies of wartime production
 
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