Flash advice

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robbert

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I didn't know exactly where to post this thread, but since I'm planning to buy a flash for my Leica M6ttl, I thought I should post it in this section of the forum.

I am looking to start using a flash again. I previously had a Metz 45CL1, the problem I had with that flash, is that is was too big. At the time I was using it with a big camera, but ever since I got back into Leica again, I got used to traveling light again, and can't be bothered with that big of a flash again.

I'm not planning to use it on top of my camera, and I don't necessarily need a TTL function. I am going to use it with a cord in my left hand with my M6 with 28mm zone focused in my right hand.

I saw Bruce Gilden use a Vivitar 285 here

Still a bit big, but better size wise than my old 45CL1.

Then I came acros a video of Mark Cohen here and here too
What flash is he using? It looks a lot smaller and browsing through his book Grim Street, it's still emitting a lot of light.

Also, if I'm using it with a pc cord, does the Voltage thing matter? I understand if the flash has a high voltage, it will fry the TTL system, but is that only if I use it on the hot shoe?

Besides the flash from Mark Cohen, does anyone else have some reccomendations? Or do I have to suck it up and get the bigger 285?
 
The trigger voltage does matter even if you use PC cord.

Vivitar 285 is safe but most of the older Vivitar 283 strobes are not safe. Btw. make notice that Vivitar doesn't use the standard PC cord. Other than this minor annoyance it's very good. Nikon SB-24 would fit the bill too.
 
Be bold...

Be bold...

Look robbert, if you're a scaredy cat just use a WEIN safe sync. Then use any flash of your choice and learn to use guide numbers. Screw depending on TTL and thyristor flash.

Mark Cohen is a BS artist. He goes out with a video crew, takes hundreds of haphazard snaps, then looks at all the crap he shot and makes up another BS rap on a pic or two that he got lucky with. I personally believe he's an egomaniac... totally self propelled.

Come on ! Just look at his eyebrows and hairdo in the rain that he had Tammy do 'oh so heavy' before the shoot.

Now, Bruce Gilden, as obnoxious as he might seem is the real deal along with Gary W. (God bless him). Gary did not do street, he just took pictures.

Ya know, there comes a time in life when you gotta develop your own style and stop looking at other peoples stuff.
 
Make no mistake that I am trying to emulate either one of these photographers.
I referenced to them because of their use of small cameras accompanied with a small flash, that's it. Neither do I believe that if one uses the same equipment the photos will be alike, everyone photographs in their own way.

With that out of the way, thank you Mablo for the tip on voltages with pc cords!
 
Nikon SB-28, In my opinion the best flash in terms of size, power and features. It has an auto mode that works with leicas and a manual mode that gives you a distance scale to work with too.
 
I don't know how or when the prohibition of using an on camera flash developed among Leica users but holding a flash in one hand and the camera in the other seems like a recipe for disaster in any fluid situation. I use an SF24D on my M7's with no problems at all. For other work I do have handle mount Metz unit but that's because I can't shoot TTL flash with a 21mm lens and finder mounted on the M7.
Good luck.-Dick
 
I don't own a Leica, but I do know that unless you get the flash off the camera you're going to get rough, overlit, amateur-ish looking photos that I will doubt you will like. Not to mention the fact that your camera has a very slow flash sync speed that makes it difficult to do fill-flash during the day.

Anyway, if I were you I'd invest in a quality flash, like the Nikon SB-28, which is a great, highly flexible flash, and invest in a wireless system if possible. These are not expensive these days, and the ability to put your flash literally anywhere you want it and fire away with your camera is worth $$$. Your flash images will change dramatically and it will open up a whole new way of using light.

I don't know of Mark Cohen, but I guarantee you that with wireless flash and some practice, you can do street photography with flash that will be beyond what that guy is doing...
 
A Wein Safe Sync will plug into your hotshoe and you can use either a PC cord or if you want to use the on camera flash; it also has a hotshoe. I use Paul Buff Cyber Sync triggers that solves the cord and the trigger voltage problem. My biggest problem is using the Leica or any focal plane shutter outside, the shutter sync is something that always has to be worked around. So whatever flash you get get a powerful one and one that has power control (plus use slow film if you are outdoors). I think someone said above that the PC cord solves the trigger voltage problem, I'm not sure about that; I'd check with the Leica people.
 
robbert said:
Also, if I'm using it with a pc cord, does the Voltage thing matter? I understand if the flash has a high voltage, it will fry the TTL system, but is that only if I use it on the hot shoe?
Click to expand...

If you're concerned about the voltage, why not just get a Leica SF-20 flash and Nikon SC-17 cord?

John
 
Check out Martin Parr's work for...

Check out Martin Parr's work for...

Using flash for street photography...Either love him or hate him, his work has had a major impact on contemporary photography. He has used every manner of flash for his "street" observational type photography, and IMO has really shown the value of using some fill-flash for daylight street photos.

Anyway, being part of the exclusive Magnum collective puts him in the photo guru category.
 
Thanks for all the replies!

I checked our local ebay-like site and it had a vivitar 285 on it.
I decided to check it out, and it feels alot lighter than my old metz 45CL1.
I got it for €15, which translates to about $20, good deal I say!

It's an old made in Japan unit, so I'm guessing it's putting out a high voltage.
I'm going to see if I can measure it somewhere, just to see what voltage it is putting out.

Thanks for bringing up the wireless triggers!
I've used them before with large format photography, ****ty ebay ones, but still.
The problem I had before with the PC cord, was that it didn't seem to stay put, and i had rubber bands around them and everything!

Now the decision lies between the wein hot shoe + cords, or the cybersync triggers (not touching those ebay ones!).

My issue with the triggers would be size and with the cord that it won't stay put. Does anyone have experience with the wein hot shoe and the pc jack? Is it loose like all other pc jacks? The downside with handholding the flash is that I'm constantly moving the flash and thus jerking the cord.

Do you tape the receiver to the back of the flash?
 
Gaffer tape is your best friend when dealing with strobes, sync cords and triggers. Some Nikon strobes can be secured with a nifty screwlock sync cord. Check out flashzebra.com for these and other flash related items.
 
You should also consider the Phottix Tetra set -- many people like these and they will work with old flashes like the Vivitars. If you're like me and will use these triggers for basic flash firing inside a studio or not long range, these are perfectly good for that purpose:

http://cgi.ebay.com/Phottix-Speedlight-Studio-Flash-Trigger-3-Receivers-/230533238632?pt=AU_Cameras_Photographic_Accessories&hash=item35acda0f68

For $70 you get transmitter and three receivers, so you can fire all at once, or put on separate channels.
 
I was very frustrated this past weekend when I couldn't get the Pocket Wizard TT1 transmitter (for Canon) to work with the digital M. It is supposed to work in manual trigger-only mode (have latest firmware installed), but haven't been able to trigger a flash yet.. Tried the Flex TT5 as a transmitter and still no dice. grrr - need to figure this out!

Anyone using the newer Pocket Wizards with an M?
 
Perhaps a little late but the Metz 20 C-2 is compact, has a tilting head. I bought mine for $24 on ebay and use it for fill flash on my M3 or Bessa R3a. I also have the Metz 36 C-2 which I use if I need more power, and it allows me to attach a pocket bouncer or Omnibounce.

I cycle between using a flash and not. It can slow down shooting but it can improve pictures. Harsh shadows outdoors at noon make results look horrible without a fill flash.

I always underpower my fill flash by a 1/2 stop or stop. So if lighting calls for f/8 and 1/50, I'll set the flash to read for f/5.6 - f/6.3. The slow flash synch is sometimes an issue with fill flash, especially with faster films.
 
I've collected a bunch of Viv 285s and they can be 'hot'. Most of the Made in Japan are ~300v, so if you are going to use flash triggers, you need to buy those that can handle it. I bought some cheap Phottix Asters off of ebay because they can handle the 300v and I don't feel that great a need to flash.

BTW - this old and new junk is an absolute blast to play around with, particularly with a DSLR. I learned a lot experimenting with it.

- Charlie
 
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