kshapero
South Florida Man
What does that mean? I hear over and over how much people love the Fuji X100 but that it is quirky. Or that once you understand it's limitations. Or it took awhile to master it. What does all this mean? I have a Nikon D7000 that has about 44,000,000 settings. I just turn to mode dial to A and fiddle with a few more settings. Voila, I am done. A little advice, please. Thanks.
gavinlg
Veteran
What does that mean? I hear over and over how much people love the Fuji X100 but that it is quirky. Or that once you understand it's limitations. Or it took awhile to master it. What does all this mean? I have a Nikon D7000 that has about 44,000,000 settings. I just turn to mode dial to A and fiddle with a few more settings. Voila, I am done. A little advice, please. Thanks.
i'd hazard a guess that they're:
a) Used to SLR type viewing and don't understand parallax in separate VF cameras
b) Used to Leica M's and think that the x100 is a manual focus rangefinder for $1000 new and thus think they can use it like one.
c) Used to DSLR autofocus with 55 points and think that to correctly focus you need to move the single AF spot around in the frame rather than just focusing and re-composing.
d) Trying to use it continuous focus mode for tracking subjects which TBH shouldn't even be an option on the camera.
And so on...
I use a lot of different cameras for work. The nikon DSLRs with their menu complexity bordering on insanity and littered with buttons are far more quirky than the x-series cameras (to me). The x-pro1 is the easiest digital camera to use that I've experienced, bar maybe the r-d1 and digital M's. The x100 is a little less easy mainly because the buttons on the back are slightly smaller and the body itself is smaller lending to a slightly more cramped grip.
Still much simpler than DSLRs.
kshapero
South Florida Man
If that is the case, then it certainly seems to be no big deal, thanks.
boomguy57
Well-known
I have to say that I came from a D700, GF1, and NEX-5n to the X100. I think it's "quirkiness" has a lot to do with the early adopters (the firmware has since smoothed things out a lot) and that the reputation has stuck.
kshapero
South Florida Man
I am looking for a day to day digital. Seems like with the prices down and the firmware mature, that this might be the way to go.
boomguy57
Well-known
It's a great camera. I've had it a year now and haven't looked back. I won't get rid of it and would buy another in a second if it was lost/stolen/broken.
avikrc
Established
That reputation probably from the early firmware. I got the X100 as soon as it was available and have been using it regularly ever since.
The only thing that might border on "quirky" is that it is sometimes difficult to get the focus right if there isn't much light around and I am using the optical finder, switching to the digital one immediately solves this. However, this does not bother me at all since the digital finder is pretty nice.
The only thing that might border on "quirky" is that it is sometimes difficult to get the focus right if there isn't much light around and I am using the optical finder, switching to the digital one immediately solves this. However, this does not bother me at all since the digital finder is pretty nice.
umcelinho
Marcelo
I was pretty used to compact digital P&S like the GX100 and the LX3 before I started on rangefinders, and still the camera did need some time from me to get used to it, but pretty much on the focusing department only. Setting the camera is quite straightforward, as well as using the analog dials but it took me a few weeks to get used to its AF. If you don't set the AF area to be the smallest possible, it will often focus on things that are inside the rectangle but just not are what you are willing to select, thus having the smalles area possible. Also in lower contrast areas or low light it can hunt for focus and just not find it, unless you pick a higher contrast spot in the distance or area you want in focus. the thing is, what is enough contrast to focus a rangefinder wont be contrasty enough for the camera to be able to focus, so you have to learn how much contrast it can handle. in these situations I often turn to manual, pick up focus somewhere close and fine tune it manually.
I almost sold it a few weeks after I got it because of the AF "quirks", but eventually brought it along to a 1 month trip in which my M4 was pretty much useless due to a mechanical issue and I just had to get used to it, and made 80% of the photos of the trip using it. Finally got the hand of it and I'm glad I did, nowadays is my take-everywhere camera, incredibly versatile.
I almost sold it a few weeks after I got it because of the AF "quirks", but eventually brought it along to a 1 month trip in which my M4 was pretty much useless due to a mechanical issue and I just had to get used to it, and made 80% of the photos of the trip using it. Finally got the hand of it and I'm glad I did, nowadays is my take-everywhere camera, incredibly versatile.
kshapero
South Florida Man
Nice rant.
The only thing that bothers me about the x100 is that it's autofocus gets tricked by reflections more so than any camera I have ever used. It will also focus on the background instead of an intended close-up object in the foreground if the object in the foreground is too small. It's happens in both OVF and EVF modes. My work around is to go to manual focus, but I haven't had to do that with most other AF cameras that I've used. It is quirky for this reason IMO.
willie_901
Veteran
About a third of the quirkiness is gone after firmware updates.
About a quarter of the quirkiness is based on the experiences of DSLR owners who didn't understand parallax error, contrast exposure, the limitations of leaf shutters and the difference between the setup and menu parameter selection between the camera they knew and the Fuji.
About another quarter of the quirkiness was because people ddn't read the manual and the fact that the manual is not an example of clarity and completeness.
I took me a dozen or so sessions to understand how to best use the camera in different circumstances. Some people don't have the patience to do this. Their opinion, which is certainly valid, is the camera should be simple to operate and they paid too much money to have to study and learn it. I was highly motivated to learn the camera because of it's potential to produce technically excellent photos, because I could take it with me everywhere and because I could use it as I used a rangefinder camera.
The reminding quirkiness is due to Fuji's firmware group and the fact at the camera is inherently more complex than most modern cameras. Not only do you have to know when to use or not use the EVF or OVF, you have to know when to use the ND filter, and that macro mode requires aperture openings of f4 or smaller for the best results. You have to know which operation modes give the quickest focusing. You have to be willing to switch to EVF mode in order to visually check the focus region. You have to know the battery electronics are unsophisticated and don't give much warning before the battery dies. For many the investment in understanding the camera is worth the results. For others it is a frustration and an unnecessary waste of time.
About a quarter of the quirkiness is based on the experiences of DSLR owners who didn't understand parallax error, contrast exposure, the limitations of leaf shutters and the difference between the setup and menu parameter selection between the camera they knew and the Fuji.
About another quarter of the quirkiness was because people ddn't read the manual and the fact that the manual is not an example of clarity and completeness.
I took me a dozen or so sessions to understand how to best use the camera in different circumstances. Some people don't have the patience to do this. Their opinion, which is certainly valid, is the camera should be simple to operate and they paid too much money to have to study and learn it. I was highly motivated to learn the camera because of it's potential to produce technically excellent photos, because I could take it with me everywhere and because I could use it as I used a rangefinder camera.
The reminding quirkiness is due to Fuji's firmware group and the fact at the camera is inherently more complex than most modern cameras. Not only do you have to know when to use or not use the EVF or OVF, you have to know when to use the ND filter, and that macro mode requires aperture openings of f4 or smaller for the best results. You have to know which operation modes give the quickest focusing. You have to be willing to switch to EVF mode in order to visually check the focus region. You have to know the battery electronics are unsophisticated and don't give much warning before the battery dies. For many the investment in understanding the camera is worth the results. For others it is a frustration and an unnecessary waste of time.
DtheG
Established
As said upthread, a lot of the quirks have been ameliorated by firmware updates, others are a matter of perception based on what you are accustomed to. Another firmware update, a slight redesign incorporating improvements seen on the X10 X-Pro1 etc might make it perfect...
I've used it since May 2011. I've never known anything other than focus-and-recompose, nor was the autofocus slow compared to my 20 year old Canon EOS. I am used to using a single focal length. So I was well prepared: it takes superb pictures, it works in available light, the essential manual adjustments are to hand when necessary.
The menu options can be awkward, but the same is probably true for every other piece of software. The secret is to think of it like a film camera: take time to discover, experiment and set all the options in ways that suit you, once per 'roll'. You have a dedicated controls of shutter, aperture, and focus if you need them: now find a subject and make a picture.
I've used it since May 2011. I've never known anything other than focus-and-recompose, nor was the autofocus slow compared to my 20 year old Canon EOS. I am used to using a single focal length. So I was well prepared: it takes superb pictures, it works in available light, the essential manual adjustments are to hand when necessary.
The menu options can be awkward, but the same is probably true for every other piece of software. The secret is to think of it like a film camera: take time to discover, experiment and set all the options in ways that suit you, once per 'roll'. You have a dedicated controls of shutter, aperture, and focus if you need them: now find a subject and make a picture.
Out to Lunch
Ventor
Don't worry about it. Use the camera for a month in a row and you'll be comfortable. Great sensor and lens...you'll be surprised.
Shab
Veteran
I have bought mine two weeks ago. I'm using it ike everyday-everywhere camera and I'm really happy. It's very small and light camera and when I see its raw files in LR I think "it is really a GREAT camera".
Yes, AF isn't too fast, but it's enough for me. And it is very simple to use.
I like:
* spot metering
* Image Quality
* High ISO "grain"
* its lens: it's really good even at 2.0
* It is really quiet, more quiet than a Zeiss Ikon ZM (much more quiet)
* Colours
* Macro mode (with EVF).
I dislike:
* EVF (but it is very usable)
* Using OVF tle frame lines aren't really exact.
* It doesn't have image satibilisation systeman like OM-D (it would be GREAT)
I'm enjoying it a lot.
Some examples:
* Portraits at F2.0:
* High ISO Color:
* Bokeh:
Yes, AF isn't too fast, but it's enough for me. And it is very simple to use.
I like:
* spot metering
* Image Quality
* High ISO "grain"
* its lens: it's really good even at 2.0
* It is really quiet, more quiet than a Zeiss Ikon ZM (much more quiet)
* Colours
* Macro mode (with EVF).
I dislike:
* EVF (but it is very usable)
* Using OVF tle frame lines aren't really exact.
* It doesn't have image satibilisation systeman like OM-D (it would be GREAT)
I'm enjoying it a lot.
Some examples:
* Portraits at F2.0:
* High ISO Color:
* Bokeh:
paulfish4570
Veteran
i've had the RFF x100 for a year. it IS quirky. wonderful lens. lovely files. but after more than 3,000 frames i still have not bonded with it. i may be asking the membership before long who might be nominated next in line ...
Rob-F
Likes Leicas
The exposure compensation dial is placed where my thumb can accidentally move it too easily. The same dial on the X10 is in the same place, but is stiffer and harder to move accidentally.
On the other hand, it has the shutter speed dial where it belongs: on top of the camera; and the aperture ring where it should go, on the lens. I like that! The viewfinder tells you when focusing is complete, by turning from white to green. Pretty cool!
On the other hand, it has the shutter speed dial where it belongs: on top of the camera; and the aperture ring where it should go, on the lens. I like that! The viewfinder tells you when focusing is complete, by turning from white to green. Pretty cool!
GaryLH
Veteran
Think the 70s or 80s type fixed lens camera
Think the 70s or 80s type fixed lens camera
Think the 70s or 80s type fixed lens camera when it comes to the essential control layout.
- shutter speed on top - dial w/ A for auto (used for aperture priority)
- aperture ring where it belongs on the lens w/ A for auto (used for shutter priority)
-- both set to A gives u full program mode
- exposure comp dial on top
- programmable fn (function button) on top - default ISO changes
- in ovf mode, frame lines for far and near. Can c outside frame lines
- evf mode more like like evf of dslr
Quirky.. I would say
- af focus - as light gets darker, horizontal lines are harder to focus, sometimes refuses. Need to find vertical lines.
- af can be tricked, but lessons learn from cameras such as contax g series will come in handy.. There is a distance scale at bottom of ovf/evf/LCD in custom mode that allows one to confirm correct distance. Btw dof info is show there as well.. Change f-stop and as it increases, the bar around focus point increases.
- Exposure compensation dial too easy to nudge off of any setting. Need to remember to double check.
- if u have never used a rf camera from old days takes a while to learn
-- especially the idea of parallax correction and close focus
- menu system has been said to be quirky, personnelly I find it rather simple compared to dslr menu systems.
Outside of Leica, currently hard to find any beside Fuji x series w/ the back to basic ideas in control UI.
Yes it is a quirky camera, but in grand thing of things I like it...
Cheers
Gary
Think the 70s or 80s type fixed lens camera
What does that mean? I hear over and over how much people love the Fuji X100 but that it is quirky. Or that once you understand it's limitations. Or it took awhile to master it. What does all this mean? I have a Nikon D7000 that has about 44,000,000 settings. I just turn to mode dial to A and fiddle with a few more settings. Voila, I am done. A little advice, please. Thanks.
Think the 70s or 80s type fixed lens camera when it comes to the essential control layout.
- shutter speed on top - dial w/ A for auto (used for aperture priority)
- aperture ring where it belongs on the lens w/ A for auto (used for shutter priority)
-- both set to A gives u full program mode
- exposure comp dial on top
- programmable fn (function button) on top - default ISO changes
- in ovf mode, frame lines for far and near. Can c outside frame lines
- evf mode more like like evf of dslr
Quirky.. I would say
- af focus - as light gets darker, horizontal lines are harder to focus, sometimes refuses. Need to find vertical lines.
- af can be tricked, but lessons learn from cameras such as contax g series will come in handy.. There is a distance scale at bottom of ovf/evf/LCD in custom mode that allows one to confirm correct distance. Btw dof info is show there as well.. Change f-stop and as it increases, the bar around focus point increases.
- Exposure compensation dial too easy to nudge off of any setting. Need to remember to double check.
- if u have never used a rf camera from old days takes a while to learn
-- especially the idea of parallax correction and close focus
- menu system has been said to be quirky, personnelly I find it rather simple compared to dslr menu systems.
Outside of Leica, currently hard to find any beside Fuji x series w/ the back to basic ideas in control UI.
Yes it is a quirky camera, but in grand thing of things I like it...
Cheers
Gary
Archlich
Well-known
I found four major quirky things with the camera:
Focus speed and accuracy aside, the thing's closest focus distance without engaging the macro mode is 80cm, a number hidden well in the manual. In the ads they say it focuses to 10cm - which indeed it does, in macro mode, slowly and painfully.
The projected frame line is far from accurate, even for someone who's used to rangefinders. Varies wildly when compared to the 35mm frame line of a M camera. It covers way smaller a field than the actual 35mm FoV, and is often misleading while you're composing. Weird quirk as it's still so with the latest firmware.
The camera can't remember the distance set in manual mode, nor does it have "snap" button like on the Ricoh GR cameras that focuses the lens instantly to a certain distance. Each time you want to perform hyperfocus on the street (and to fully utilize the silence of the leaf shutter), you'll have to go into the manual mode, turn the infamous manual focus dial, listen to the painful whining of the tiny motor, and wait till it goes into the right distance (and adjust it carefully so it doesn't wander beyond). Every time you switched to AF and then back, you'll have to do all these again.
The camera has three sets custom function settings. Unlike almost every other cameras that sport this nice feature, instead of instantly accessible via a button or dial these presets are buried in the menus. Which renders them fairly useless.
It's a camera with nice optics and more importantly an excellent idea. Sadly like almost all cameras of similar design before it, it's not executed very well. Hope they'll be getting (more of) it right with the X200.
Focus speed and accuracy aside, the thing's closest focus distance without engaging the macro mode is 80cm, a number hidden well in the manual. In the ads they say it focuses to 10cm - which indeed it does, in macro mode, slowly and painfully.
The projected frame line is far from accurate, even for someone who's used to rangefinders. Varies wildly when compared to the 35mm frame line of a M camera. It covers way smaller a field than the actual 35mm FoV, and is often misleading while you're composing. Weird quirk as it's still so with the latest firmware.
The camera can't remember the distance set in manual mode, nor does it have "snap" button like on the Ricoh GR cameras that focuses the lens instantly to a certain distance. Each time you want to perform hyperfocus on the street (and to fully utilize the silence of the leaf shutter), you'll have to go into the manual mode, turn the infamous manual focus dial, listen to the painful whining of the tiny motor, and wait till it goes into the right distance (and adjust it carefully so it doesn't wander beyond). Every time you switched to AF and then back, you'll have to do all these again.
The camera has three sets custom function settings. Unlike almost every other cameras that sport this nice feature, instead of instantly accessible via a button or dial these presets are buried in the menus. Which renders them fairly useless.
It's a camera with nice optics and more importantly an excellent idea. Sadly like almost all cameras of similar design before it, it's not executed very well. Hope they'll be getting (more of) it right with the X200.
bgb
Well-known
While i was at the dentist today he and I got talking about cameras and his M9 in particular. He said he hadn't used it much as he prefers his X100 i asked him why...... as an answer he handed me his X100 and said I could borrow it for a while and see what I thought. So far i think it's beautiful and I WANT ONE It has a thumb thingy and a soft release, it fits into my hand perfectly and I love the viewfinder.
Going to read the manual tonight and go shooting tomorrow ...
It has a thumb thingy and a soft release, it fits into my hand perfectly and I love the viewfinder.Going to read the manual tonight and go shooting tomorrow ...
alice
Established
the focus is still a bit unreliable, sometimes