celluloidprop
Well-known
I sold a nice Hexar AF a little bit ago because I have a stock of Tri-X/Neopan/etc. that I rate at box speed as I'm not developing my own right now.
I'm finding myself drawn more to color film these days, which (since I'd rate most 400-speed films @ 200 for daytime use) puts the AF back in the game, so to speak.
Currently have a Nikon 35Ti - it's nice, but a bit too thick to pocket and the viewfinder has nothing on the Hexar.
So I think I'm going to sell the 35Ti and pick up another film P&S. The Hexar AF is a definite possibility, but I'm also looking at the Fuji Klasse W and Klasse S from Japan - smaller, not much more expensive than a used Hexar and still being serviced by Fuji as a bonus.
Mostly I'm curious about the VFs and how they compare to the 35Ti/Hexar, if anyone has used all three/four.
I'm finding myself drawn more to color film these days, which (since I'd rate most 400-speed films @ 200 for daytime use) puts the AF back in the game, so to speak.
Currently have a Nikon 35Ti - it's nice, but a bit too thick to pocket and the viewfinder has nothing on the Hexar.
So I think I'm going to sell the 35Ti and pick up another film P&S. The Hexar AF is a definite possibility, but I'm also looking at the Fuji Klasse W and Klasse S from Japan - smaller, not much more expensive than a used Hexar and still being serviced by Fuji as a bonus.
Mostly I'm curious about the VFs and how they compare to the 35Ti/Hexar, if anyone has used all three/four.
filmfan
Well-known
Hexar AF is great with all ISO films. Just use an ND8 filter. I do, and I shoot Tri-X @400 in all conditions as well as color negs (Ektar and Portra).
The viewfinder on the Hexar is lightyears beyond anything else in this category of cameras.
The viewfinder on the Hexar is lightyears beyond anything else in this category of cameras.
gavinlg
Veteran
The klasse/s are much more point and shoot than the hexar. They're a lot smaller, a lot lighter too. They're really nice though - I want one.
celluloidprop
Well-known
Decided to leap - KEH had a EXC Klasse W that I couldn't say no to. The 28/2.8 looks great and if I find some more $$$ laying around, a Hexar AF would make a nice complement.
Archlich
Well-known
I recently acquired a Klasse W through classifieds here, completing my journey of luxury P&Ss. That is, I have used all three cameras in the title and currently have the Hexar (keeper) and the Klasse (still testing).
Quality wise, the Klasse is well-made (comparing to likes of GR1) but not as good as the Hexar and the overbuilt 35Ti. It's definitely smaller than the 35Ti, but still not pocketable.
The viewfinder has no frame lines, just fixed near focus marks. Size wise it's on the small side: bigger than the miserable CM/Minilux (bottom line), smaller than most in the catalog including the Nikons, and is no match of the huge one on the Hexar. The in-finder LCD displays five things: MF mode, compensation mark, focus confirmation, shutter speed, flash mode; the Hexar gives you parallax compensation and a distance readout (the Klasse's in the top LCD panel), which helps you in making sure the focus is on.
The Klasse leaves an impression of being slow. The shutter button requires much force to be half-pressed. When half-pressed, it takes a little while for the camera to open aperture blades and then start focusing - the AF speed is decent - and you are to press even harder to fire the shutter. There's some shutter lag.
Although the Klasse sports a compensation dial, all other settings (except data imprinting) have to be set through the mode button and dial. Being the last luxury P&S and released a decade after most of the similar cameras, the Klasse is extremely rich in feature. It has everything: flash, auto bracketing, manual focus, bulb exposure, self timer, custom ISO. Cramming all these features into one button/dial set can be somehow inconvenient: you have to watch to make sure you are dialing in the manual focus distance instead of setting up one of the camera's SIX auto bracketing modes.
The MF works, but the execution is on the worse side. Like on the Contax T3, there's no dedicated MF button or dial (the AF Lock button, also like on the T3, is completely useless for it works for only one shot). To manual focus to 2m (a habit from the GR1) you have to press the mode button three times, turn the dial clockwise six clicks, then half press the shutter. To go back to AF you have to do all these again in another direction, or turn off/on the machine - yes, it won't remember the MF setting after power off.
Overall it's a one of the most conventional luxury P&S: small viewfinder, nice lens, nicely finished alloy-on-plastic construction, slow. It's rich in features, yet these features are like the sum of many other cameras and the layout is standard - nothing unique.
The Klasse is good for leisure shots. It's not very responsive even in MF mode, thus is only OK for street works. If you want something pocketable, look for the GR1 series, the TC-1, and the T3. Otherwise, the Hexar rules in every aspects (especially with its lightning fast operations), hands down.
Quality wise, the Klasse is well-made (comparing to likes of GR1) but not as good as the Hexar and the overbuilt 35Ti. It's definitely smaller than the 35Ti, but still not pocketable.
The viewfinder has no frame lines, just fixed near focus marks. Size wise it's on the small side: bigger than the miserable CM/Minilux (bottom line), smaller than most in the catalog including the Nikons, and is no match of the huge one on the Hexar. The in-finder LCD displays five things: MF mode, compensation mark, focus confirmation, shutter speed, flash mode; the Hexar gives you parallax compensation and a distance readout (the Klasse's in the top LCD panel), which helps you in making sure the focus is on.
The Klasse leaves an impression of being slow. The shutter button requires much force to be half-pressed. When half-pressed, it takes a little while for the camera to open aperture blades and then start focusing - the AF speed is decent - and you are to press even harder to fire the shutter. There's some shutter lag.
Although the Klasse sports a compensation dial, all other settings (except data imprinting) have to be set through the mode button and dial. Being the last luxury P&S and released a decade after most of the similar cameras, the Klasse is extremely rich in feature. It has everything: flash, auto bracketing, manual focus, bulb exposure, self timer, custom ISO. Cramming all these features into one button/dial set can be somehow inconvenient: you have to watch to make sure you are dialing in the manual focus distance instead of setting up one of the camera's SIX auto bracketing modes.
The MF works, but the execution is on the worse side. Like on the Contax T3, there's no dedicated MF button or dial (the AF Lock button, also like on the T3, is completely useless for it works for only one shot). To manual focus to 2m (a habit from the GR1) you have to press the mode button three times, turn the dial clockwise six clicks, then half press the shutter. To go back to AF you have to do all these again in another direction, or turn off/on the machine - yes, it won't remember the MF setting after power off.
Overall it's a one of the most conventional luxury P&S: small viewfinder, nice lens, nicely finished alloy-on-plastic construction, slow. It's rich in features, yet these features are like the sum of many other cameras and the layout is standard - nothing unique.
The Klasse is good for leisure shots. It's not very responsive even in MF mode, thus is only OK for street works. If you want something pocketable, look for the GR1 series, the TC-1, and the T3. Otherwise, the Hexar rules in every aspects (especially with its lightning fast operations), hands down.
craygc
Well-known
I don't have experience across all the cameras in discussion here but I will say the Klasse W is a fantastic camera. I've had one since they were first released and no matter what other camera I' carrying, the Klasse W always comes along. It's certainly got a couple of little quirks but all camera do; once you understand them its a pleasure to use...
Just to make your decisions a little more difficult, here's some output Klasse W Shots
Just to make your decisions a little more difficult, here's some output Klasse W Shots
celluloidprop
Well-known
oh, there's some nice stuff there.
I'm excited about the W - I think I'm going to work on a roll-a-day project with the cheap rolls of Superia 400 from Wal-Mart.
With an Olympus mju II and the Klasse, there's no reason for me to not have a camera at all times.
I'm excited about the W - I think I'm going to work on a roll-a-day project with the cheap rolls of Superia 400 from Wal-Mart.
With an Olympus mju II and the Klasse, there's no reason for me to not have a camera at all times.
muf
Well-known
The Hexar is decent. Bulky though and is prone to shutter button problems. The Nikon 35TI is heavy, chunky and something that looks like it needs to be displayed rather than used. The Klasse I have never owned, but I do have a Rollei AFM35 which is a copy of the Klasse but with a 38mm f2.6 lens.
Picture quality wise. I didn't rate the Hexar as this all singing, all dancing poor mans leica. I purchased a Minolta CLE with a Summicron and it wiped the floor with the Hexar. The Nikon takes sharp pictures and the matrix meter is fantastic, but I found the pictures a little flat and dull. The Rollei/Fuji is lightweight and easy to use. It's got a brilliant meter that has never been fooled. The lens coating is really impressive. I've taken shots facing the sun and never had any lens flare. It's a little big to call pocketable, but it is certainly more pocketable than the Nikon and the Hexar just simply isn't pocketable.
If you are looking at pocketable high quality, then look to the Ricoh GR1v, the Minolta TC-1 or the Contax T3 as mentioned by Archlich. I've owned them all and really there's so little in the quality of the pictures that ergonomics, price or bragging rights really could be the deciding factor.
Paul
Picture quality wise. I didn't rate the Hexar as this all singing, all dancing poor mans leica. I purchased a Minolta CLE with a Summicron and it wiped the floor with the Hexar. The Nikon takes sharp pictures and the matrix meter is fantastic, but I found the pictures a little flat and dull. The Rollei/Fuji is lightweight and easy to use. It's got a brilliant meter that has never been fooled. The lens coating is really impressive. I've taken shots facing the sun and never had any lens flare. It's a little big to call pocketable, but it is certainly more pocketable than the Nikon and the Hexar just simply isn't pocketable.
If you are looking at pocketable high quality, then look to the Ricoh GR1v, the Minolta TC-1 or the Contax T3 as mentioned by Archlich. I've owned them all and really there's so little in the quality of the pictures that ergonomics, price or bragging rights really could be the deciding factor.
Paul
Jamie123
Veteran
I had a Nikon 35Ti and now have a Klasse W. Didn't like the Ti that much due to the bulk and slowness. The Klasse W is really nice, thouh. It's smaller than the Nikon but not exactly jeans pocket size. And it's much lighter than it looks. I don't remember what the finder was like on the Nikon so I can't say how it compares. The one on the Klasse W is good. The picture quality from the Klasse W is really good, too.
I have a lot of point and shoots but the only ones I use regularly are the Olympus mjuII and the Klasse W. The Olympus is my 'just-in case' carry everywhere camera while the Klasse is a camera I reach for when I go out for a walk and I want to take some pictures.
I have a lot of point and shoots but the only ones I use regularly are the Olympus mjuII and the Klasse W. The Olympus is my 'just-in case' carry everywhere camera while the Klasse is a camera I reach for when I go out for a walk and I want to take some pictures.
celluloidprop
Well-known
Klasse W arrived today - it's a little more scratched up than I expected for KEH EXC and whoever owned it originally didn't seem to understand how the battery cover worked (seriously, how do you start to strip out a coin slot?). But I dig it so far - figured out how to kill the flash unless I turn it back on, and it probably wouldn't be jeans pocketable but it fits in cargo shorts. Since I live in Texas, I'll pretty much be living in cargo shorts for the next six months...
filmfan
Well-known
Paul, although the Summicron (40mm) that I used was fantastic, it did not best the Hexar AF's 35mm f/2 lens... neither did the VC Nokton 40mm f/1.4 which I tested to be as good, if not better than the Summicron 40mm.
The Hexar AF lens' only downside is distortion (which, frankly is not all that bad).
Jamie123
Veteran
The flash thing is a bit confusing at first. You have to turn on Custom mode 1 for the flash settings to stick even when you turn off the camera.
Here's the manual for the camera. Check page 70 regarding the custom modes.
celluloidprop
Well-known
That confused me for a bit - I figured turning it to off would be 'flash off on startup.'
Google Translate is turning out to be quite helpful for the manual.
Google Translate is turning out to be quite helpful for the manual.
Jamie123
Veteran
Yeah, it's a bit confusing. The guy I bought it from actually didn't know either how to turn off the flash permanently which is why he sold it and kept his Ricoh Gr1.
Anyways, the manual I linked to is English so no need for Google Translate.
muf
Well-known
Then I can only make the assumption that I had a bad one. I recently made the same assumption about the Contax T3 which I previously owned and wasn't impressed with. I've just bought another T3 to 'test'. Maybe if this one proves my previous one was dodgy, then I may look at another Hexar in the future. But that will require a little selling first...
Paul