viggi
Established
I've been pondering lately, more generically about cameras as tools, for what purpose, and also as something to admire and feel good about using. Nothing new here. This existential camera angst was brought on by the Fuji X100. I'm very excited about that camera. I covet it. But at the same time I'd like a digital camera that I know is a reliable travel partner and tool.
I travel to India frequently, to meet family. I like to walk around the neighbourhood and take photographs. I took my old DSLR (Nikon D50) and Konica auto s3 with me. Unfortunately, both acted up. Had to change the sensor in the D50 and the Konica seems to have an intermittent light leak. I enjoy shooting it, and I felt it was pretty sturdy, and it was old so I could drop it or lose it without agonizing. I sort of feel the same about the D50 - it's a decent, inexpensive camera.
I've been planning a trip, whereby I jump onto a train and just slink around, meeting people, taking photos, etc. I could take my D50 and an old film camera or two with me. They have to be sturdy though. Perhaps the Nikon FM2n, or the Konica TC (nice lenses - not as reliable as the Nikon I imagine). But I think the right tool for the trip is a rangefinder. When I start thinking along these terms I see the attraction of the Leica film cameras; well built, reliable, reasonably small, quiet. You know, a user, a good tool. Actually, the Nikon FMs feel similar. Real stuff.
But I'll need a digital camera as well. I think Fuji X100 could be suitable in some ways (if the promise is met) - large sensor, good lens. But is it really a workhorse? Is it really a 'tool' that one can rely on when on the road?
Anyways, it is quite expensive, so I doubt I'll throw it in the rucksack when slumming it. And I somehow have the impression that the Ricoh GXR is a better bet as a photographer's tool.
I have cameras that take photos, enough to keep me happy. I'd love to get the X100 but what's it for? Nice enough to take street photos, but beyond that? I'll just have to hope my D50 holds up, that my old rangefinders work, and as a backup, the Samsung EX1.
I travel to India frequently, to meet family. I like to walk around the neighbourhood and take photographs. I took my old DSLR (Nikon D50) and Konica auto s3 with me. Unfortunately, both acted up. Had to change the sensor in the D50 and the Konica seems to have an intermittent light leak. I enjoy shooting it, and I felt it was pretty sturdy, and it was old so I could drop it or lose it without agonizing. I sort of feel the same about the D50 - it's a decent, inexpensive camera.
I've been planning a trip, whereby I jump onto a train and just slink around, meeting people, taking photos, etc. I could take my D50 and an old film camera or two with me. They have to be sturdy though. Perhaps the Nikon FM2n, or the Konica TC (nice lenses - not as reliable as the Nikon I imagine). But I think the right tool for the trip is a rangefinder. When I start thinking along these terms I see the attraction of the Leica film cameras; well built, reliable, reasonably small, quiet. You know, a user, a good tool. Actually, the Nikon FMs feel similar. Real stuff.
But I'll need a digital camera as well. I think Fuji X100 could be suitable in some ways (if the promise is met) - large sensor, good lens. But is it really a workhorse? Is it really a 'tool' that one can rely on when on the road?
Anyways, it is quite expensive, so I doubt I'll throw it in the rucksack when slumming it. And I somehow have the impression that the Ricoh GXR is a better bet as a photographer's tool.
I have cameras that take photos, enough to keep me happy. I'd love to get the X100 but what's it for? Nice enough to take street photos, but beyond that? I'll just have to hope my D50 holds up, that my old rangefinders work, and as a backup, the Samsung EX1.
user237428934
User deletion pending
After all the discussion in this forum i have the impression that the x100 is for taking photos.
You need a workhorse? Are a D50, a GXR or a EX1 your definition of a workhorse? No one in this forum ever had a production X100 in his hands. So what help do you expect?
viggi
Established
It was more a thought process... a bit vague and not a direct question (hence the existential angst part... ). I wanted X100 but I didn't know what for really. I've chosen D50 and the old rangefinders because they were cheap and I could afford to lose them. But at the same time, I felt I should have a piece of machinery that would be fit for purpose, that would be a solid tool. And what cameras are, apart from professional DSRL and some old film cameras.
). I wanted X100 but I didn't know what for really. I've chosen D50 and the old rangefinders because they were cheap and I could afford to lose them. But at the same time, I felt I should have a piece of machinery that would be fit for purpose, that would be a solid tool. And what cameras are, apart from professional DSRL and some old film cameras.Archlich
Well-known
Just wait and see. It's really strange to see people asking if a camera is a workhorse four months before its release.
viggi
Established
Nothing strange to discuss cameras in various ways. We all know they take pictures. If that was it, then there would no need for any discussion on this forum except for advice to fix'em. I'm not really that concerned about the X100 - it was just a catalyst, thinking if any small, rangefinder-like camera is really a workhorse. If there are any cheaper or different alternatives to professional DSRL. I felt that my interest in and appreciation of cameras really didn't extend to serious use, that the stuff I owned or wanted wasn't actually as useful as I thought it was. I wasn't looking for a engineering solution from the forum members, merely pondering, see if it resonated with some other photographers.
ElectroWNED
Well-known
get an olympus XA if you want something to throw in a bag.
nightfly
Well-known
Probably not what you want to hear but almost any film camera will probably work for you. I really like the Yashica t4 for travel where I'll be shooting a lot of color. The lens does wonderful things and I've taken it everywhere. It's water resistant and well sealed. Not much control but it generally does the right thing but you have to like the 35mm focal length.
If it really mattered to me and I wanted a lot of control, I'd take my Leica because it's super reliable and it works. I'd probably just throw the 35mm summicron on it and go.
If I were going digital I'd grab one of the m4/3s right now since they are pretty cheap and small.
I've traveled with the Yashica as my only camera (Equador, Peru Brazil), a Mamiya 6 (Argentina) and a Pentax K1000 (Mexico) and various places with the Leica for black and white and the Yashica for color.
Personally, an SLR or DSLR or the Mamiya are too much for me. I'd rather go light.
As much as it will pain people who love to agonize over cameras, really anything will work. Hell, I'd just take my iPhone and have fun.
If it really mattered to me and I wanted a lot of control, I'd take my Leica because it's super reliable and it works. I'd probably just throw the 35mm summicron on it and go.
If I were going digital I'd grab one of the m4/3s right now since they are pretty cheap and small.
I've traveled with the Yashica as my only camera (Equador, Peru Brazil), a Mamiya 6 (Argentina) and a Pentax K1000 (Mexico) and various places with the Leica for black and white and the Yashica for color.
Personally, an SLR or DSLR or the Mamiya are too much for me. I'd rather go light.
As much as it will pain people who love to agonize over cameras, really anything will work. Hell, I'd just take my iPhone and have fun.
user237428934
User deletion pending
You are absolutely right. If you only want to do snapshots, then anything will work, even the iPhone.
The X100 is for people who want a smallish digital camera, with a high quality fixed lens, that is not designed like an SLR, and that feels more like a rangefinder.
You only "get" this type of camera, and the need for it in the marketplace, if you cannot stand the alternatives i.e. DSLRs, Micro 4/3 cameras without built in VFs, and consumer oriented P&S cameras.
It really comes down to your preference in camera type. If you like DSLRs, then you should stick to that... it's a better value.
You only "get" this type of camera, and the need for it in the marketplace, if you cannot stand the alternatives i.e. DSLRs, Micro 4/3 cameras without built in VFs, and consumer oriented P&S cameras.
It really comes down to your preference in camera type. If you like DSLRs, then you should stick to that... it's a better value.
nightfly
Well-known
If you want to do some post production at home, you could probably blow those iPhone shots as big as you want. I just printed something at 8 x 8 from my phone on my Epson 3800 and it looks pretty good straight out of the camera (well, through Hipstamatic)
Hell there was some Hipstamtic stuff that accompanied a NY Times story about the troops in Afghanistan and they were good enough for the front page.
Just depends on your aesthetics and ideas of what is "good enough".
I tend to like the snapshot aesthetic so absolute quality isn't as important to me as immediacy.
However the chromes I brought back from Patagonia taken with the Mamiya 6 wouldn't have really worked with an iPhone or probably 35mm either.
Hell there was some Hipstamtic stuff that accompanied a NY Times story about the troops in Afghanistan and they were good enough for the front page.
Just depends on your aesthetics and ideas of what is "good enough".
I tend to like the snapshot aesthetic so absolute quality isn't as important to me as immediacy.
However the chromes I brought back from Patagonia taken with the Mamiya 6 wouldn't have really worked with an iPhone or probably 35mm either.
nikku
Well-known
Whatever you do, don't bring too much gear. I've made that mistake all too often.
viggi
Established
Thanks all. Agonizing over gear is an indulgence (and a pleasure at times). I'm usually very happy shooting with what I have at the time - always find something to photograph. Looking forward to just roam around, sit quietly, watch and shoot. I think the XA is a clever and useful choice. And I saw the same series from Afg. shot with the iphone. Captivating stuff, never thought about the picture quality really.
David_Manning
Well-known
Viggi,
I totally "get" what you're talking about. Don't worry...no flip "it's not even out" comments from me.
In fact, I've wondered myself if the X100 will become my go-to camera if it ends up being all it's sold as. The ease of post-production makes digital capture a siren song, but I rarely want to drag my D700 and lenses (or even just a single prime!) along. The small relative size and large sensor, along with my favorite focal length, in the rangefinder format, seems fantastic. I'd say an X100 and maybe an Olympus miu-II (Stylus Epic) for b&w film. The Oly can be the throw-away camera just in case.
I don't think I'd let the purchase price of the X100 be off-putting. Any professional equipment will be worth a bit of money. The nice thing is, the X100 seems small-enough to throw in a small bag and keep with you, as opposed to leaving it in a hotel room or a car while traveling.
The X100 also seems to follow the mantra of simplicity...single body, single lens. There are plenty of post-production options for your files too, my favorite being either of Nik's fantastic film look packages (SilverEfex Pro or ColorEfex Pro).
My wish list, of course, would be an M-mount so I could use my oh-so-favorite Biogon 35/f2, but Fujinon builds fantastic glass, so I don't think I'd be missing out on anything technical.
I say go for it. I think that's what I'll be doing, too.
I totally "get" what you're talking about. Don't worry...no flip "it's not even out" comments from me.
In fact, I've wondered myself if the X100 will become my go-to camera if it ends up being all it's sold as. The ease of post-production makes digital capture a siren song, but I rarely want to drag my D700 and lenses (or even just a single prime!) along. The small relative size and large sensor, along with my favorite focal length, in the rangefinder format, seems fantastic. I'd say an X100 and maybe an Olympus miu-II (Stylus Epic) for b&w film. The Oly can be the throw-away camera just in case.
I don't think I'd let the purchase price of the X100 be off-putting. Any professional equipment will be worth a bit of money. The nice thing is, the X100 seems small-enough to throw in a small bag and keep with you, as opposed to leaving it in a hotel room or a car while traveling.
The X100 also seems to follow the mantra of simplicity...single body, single lens. There are plenty of post-production options for your files too, my favorite being either of Nik's fantastic film look packages (SilverEfex Pro or ColorEfex Pro).
My wish list, of course, would be an M-mount so I could use my oh-so-favorite Biogon 35/f2, but Fujinon builds fantastic glass, so I don't think I'd be missing out on anything technical.
I say go for it. I think that's what I'll be doing, too.
andersju
Well-known
Any recent dSLR or m4/3 - hell, even my trusty old Ricoh GRD - is "good enough" quality-wise for me. The one thing I, and many others, miss is a decent, built-in optical viewfinder.
My K-5 with the 21mm or 40mm pancake is a great, compact combination - but the viewfinder sucks. The viewfinder in the 5Dmk2 I had sucked. The viewfinder in the D700 sucks. Leica is currently the only company making digital cameras with viewfinders that don't induce depression. I'm hoping the X100 will be the first alternative (other than the RD1...).
kbg32
neo-romanticist
Oh my! You're thinking way too much. A workhorse? Any camera, cheaper ones too, will do if if the results are in synch with what you are after. Eventually any camera will need some service, a CLA at least, after awhile.
_goodtimez
Well-known
Hi all,
having personally been through the process several times of looking for the new perfect digital camera which would fulfil all my dreams I can now say that this never happened.
On all occasions I came back (and will remain) to film gear as long as I can.
The only reason to this is that most probably Fuji is already working on the X100 type II at the time we speak. Type one, the one most of us will rush for buying, is already obsolete for the company because they have recongnized that it could be improved. Of course the same thing will happen to type II, III, IV...
I think the real workhorse is a film camera and its brothers are plenty available, cheap, and easy to buy on the web.
Think about the 2 real beauties you can get for the price and still be able to sell them at the same price whenever you want.
Just my 2 cents...
having personally been through the process several times of looking for the new perfect digital camera which would fulfil all my dreams I can now say that this never happened.
On all occasions I came back (and will remain) to film gear as long as I can.
The only reason to this is that most probably Fuji is already working on the X100 type II at the time we speak. Type one, the one most of us will rush for buying, is already obsolete for the company because they have recongnized that it could be improved. Of course the same thing will happen to type II, III, IV...
I think the real workhorse is a film camera and its brothers are plenty available, cheap, and easy to buy on the web.
Think about the 2 real beauties you can get for the price and still be able to sell them at the same price whenever you want.
Just my 2 cents...
kxl
Social Documentary
I always travel with one digital camera and 1 film camera (specifically for B&W film). On a recent trip to Costa Rica, knowing that street photography would have to take a backseat to macros and wildlife (by choice), I took my D700 and F100 - they're my (D)SLR workhorses, but with the two bodies and 3 lenses (up to a 70-200mm), "slinking around" was not something I could do. PLUG: see the Costa Rica gallery on my website.
When street photography is on the agenda, I bring my ZI and 2-3 lenses (21-35-50/75) and currently my Nex5 with its 16mm kit lens plus an M to Nex adapter.
I may eventually get an X100 (after all of the early adopters have tried it out), but for now, I'm good.
When street photography is on the agenda, I bring my ZI and 2-3 lenses (21-35-50/75) and currently my Nex5 with its 16mm kit lens plus an M to Nex adapter.
I may eventually get an X100 (after all of the early adopters have tried it out), but for now, I'm good.
Last edited:
Andy Kibber
Well-known
Whichever camera you take on a trip, make sure to use it extensively before you go. Get to know what the camera will do and how it works.
That's the best piece of advice I've seen on RFF. If I don't follow it, I'm often sorry.
And bring some spare battaries.
That's the best piece of advice I've seen on RFF. If I don't follow it, I'm often sorry.
And bring some spare battaries.
kuzano
Veteran
Fixed lens a "deal breaker" on the X100
Fixed lens a "deal breaker" on the X100
First, let me say I am a strong fan of Fuji, but at the price the the proposed camera should be playing in the interchangeable lens market. I do currently use an E-PL1 Olympus and find the potential for lens variety both exciting and flexible.
Want a pancake lens.... tons of them out there. Want an occasional telephoto, zoom or Macro. The world is your oyster. In addition, the native lenses are imminently usable and outshoot many legacy MF lenses.
Sorry, but as much as I like and have used Fuji in the past (my current favorite medium format cameras are a Fujica G690 and a same bl, plus the 100 and 65mm lenses), I simply can't see the X100 as a serious entry into the larger sensor mirrorless camera market.... not without interchangeable lenses. Won't happen for me.
Fixed lens a "deal breaker" on the X100
First, let me say I am a strong fan of Fuji, but at the price the the proposed camera should be playing in the interchangeable lens market. I do currently use an E-PL1 Olympus and find the potential for lens variety both exciting and flexible.
Want a pancake lens.... tons of them out there. Want an occasional telephoto, zoom or Macro. The world is your oyster. In addition, the native lenses are imminently usable and outshoot many legacy MF lenses.
Sorry, but as much as I like and have used Fuji in the past (my current favorite medium format cameras are a Fujica G690 and a same bl, plus the 100 and 65mm lenses), I simply can't see the X100 as a serious entry into the larger sensor mirrorless camera market.... not without interchangeable lenses. Won't happen for me.