getting a rangefinder on a budget

[dannybear]

Hey all, I'm new to the forum and I was looking at getting my first rangefinder
I was hoping to get a M mount system so that later on I can upgrade to a leica
but being a poor highschool student Im on a budget of around $550
so what would the cheapest way to get a M mount system?
I was thinking a used voigtlander and a jupiter lens or another cheap lens?
Thanks for the help! 🙂

 

[Chinasaur]

Purchase a fixed lens RF first. Yashica or Canon or Konica or Olympus or whatever. Recommend a Yashica CC from Frontman here on RFF - http://stores.ebay.com/Japan-Camera-Exchange?_rdc=1. Can get into a Yashica for under $150 and use the rest of your budget for film and processing/chemicals.

Then, get an interchangeable M system "IF" you find you like it.

The Yashica CC was all I ever really needed but got it 2nd..AFTER I got into bodies and lenses. Learn from my mistake 😉

 

[kshapero]

Welcome aboard. Get a used Bessa, they pop up in our classifieds and a Jupiter lens and you are in business.

 

[gb hill]

Hi & welcome to the forum. Buy a nice P&S rangefinder like a Canonet QL17GIII. Take your time & save the rest for the camera you really want. Keep your eye on the classifieds here & stay away from ebay!

 

[daninjc]

Second hand bessa R + color skopar 35 for around 500$... You wouldn't need anything more than that, and the quality would be pretty close to anything more expensive.

 

[mooge]

hey-o,

my suggestion would be to grab a fixed-lens RF like a Canonet GIII QL 17 (~$50) and save your pennies for that Leica. the Canonet or similar will have:

-as good a lens as a cheap LTM/M lens
-focusing closer than 1m (LTM lenses do not... M lenses start at ~$300)
-a lightmeter (might be important for you)
-stuff

so basically you're 'missing out' on a better viewfinder, which is not really necessary for a fixed lens, interchangeable lenses, the name and the price tag.

and there's no advantage in having interchangeable lenses when you've only got one.


CONVERSELY, you could buy a Canon rangefinder (like a Canon 7, ~$150) or a Voigtlander ( a used Bessa R2 sold here for... ~$300?) and get a russian or Canon lens to go with it, but that'll still cost you a good deal. I'd suggest you buy one of those if you really want it, you're not really saving anything if you do this but you want a Leica.


...

cheers.

 

[Field]

I would not bother with a QL17GIII. They stop cocking the shutter really easily. Plus the lens looks real sharp but fake at the same time. I would go with a different brand, personally.

Yashicas, the CC is smaller and convenient but lens is not as nice as larger models. What about a Lynx 14e? Minolta 7sII is nice as well.

I would spend $50 and get a flash too.

 

[jordanstarr]

I have a Konica Auto S3 that has the quality of a $500 Canon system and can be had for $150. In fact, the Konica comes pretty close to a Leica with a fast 35mm lens, which would cost you upwards of $1800. I've made 11x14 prints from all 3 systems under similar lighting situations with the same film.

 

[Paolo Bonello]

Some good advice here and no point adding camera suggestions but one thing I'd like to point out is that if you have a passion for photography then likelyhood is, when you have more funds you will want another camera as you already know but your ideas might change between now and then so you might desire very different cameras tomorrow to the ones you are considering today.
The other point I'd like to make is that there's not a whole lot of depreciation going on in film cameras if you don't destroy or damage them. (shhhhh dont tell everyone or todays bargains will become tomorrows untouchables). So even if you compromise by buying a fixed lens instead of the M mount (that you want) then you're probably going to get most of your money back if you decide to sell it later when the funds become available to upgrade.

 

[sparrow6224]

Ok. If you want a REAL rangefinder and one of the best 50mm lenses you'll ever encounter, try this combination: Canon P rangefinder; Canon (or Canon Serenar) 50mm f/1.8. The Canon P is a beautiful classic Leica-Thread-Mount (also known as screwmount, SM, and M39) camera with a very good rangefinder/viewfinder and great weight, construction, ergonomics. And the lens! It still amazes me.

If you watch carefully you can get each for a little less than $200 though you'll generally see them going for $250-260.

This is a camera you could work with for the rest of your life.

Other absolutely fantastic affordable lenses for the LTM mount: Voigtlander 21mm f/4 color skopar; Voigtlander 35mm f/2.5 color skopar and the Canon 80mm f/2 Serenar; Canon 100mm f/3.5; and the really amazing Canon 135mm f/3.5. Those last two, don't confuse the f/3.5 with the inferior f/4's.

If you want to learn a lot about these lenses and cameras check out this site (its author is a member here): http://www.antiquecameras.net/home.html

Here are some pictures taken with the Canon P and Canon 50mm f/1.8 -- Photos 1 - 5, 8, 10, 11 all are that combo:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/commodiusvicus/sets/72157625628792146/

PS Check out KEH.com ALWAYS, before buying from eBay or elsewhere. They currently have a Canon 7 (Canon 7 has a meter, but often unreliable due to age; Canon P has none) for under $200. If they say it's in EXC condition, it is. Their BARGAIN (BGN) condition stuff is usually pretty flawless looking. Page is here:
http://www.keh.com/Camera/format-Co...a-Bodies?s=1&bcode=CR&ccode=2&cc=79265&r=WG&f

PS Don't worry about "wrinkled curtains"as this is common in Canon rangefinders and almost never affects their functioning.

There's also a Canon P on eBay looking good, and if you go to the seller's other items you'll see an identically priced Canon 50mm f/1.8
(I have no relationship to the seller, though I've bought from them and they're reliable; nor to KEH).
http://cgi.ebay.com/Canon-P-Rangefi...313976586?pt=Film_Cameras&hash=item484027830a

Good luck!

 

[stupid leica]

I'd suggest a Canon P and one or two Canon RF lenses.

 

[sparrow6224]

PS You'd be nuts to pay $150 for a Canonet GIII QL17. I have one (it's cool, and in cherry condition, takes great pictures but limited and not quite up to the level you want, I suspect) that I got for $40 -- works great -- so if you're REALLY looking to pay $150 for one, look no farther. I'm ready to ship..... The great frustration of the fixed lens rangefinders is that what you see in the viewfinder is so small and dark you don't actually enjoy snapping the picture: even though the lenses are often great and the pictures look good. But in a pinch they certainly do the job.

If you go in that direction though, the Canonet is great; so is the Olympus 35-SP; but the very very coolest of all is the Olympus XA (don't mess with XA2 or higher -- just the original XA). Look it up. You could carry it in your shoe, practically, and the design is worthy of the Museum of Modern Art.

All these cameras get extremely intelligent coverage from the great Karen Nakamura on her "photoethnography"site. She's an anthropogist at Yale who is really into classic cameras. She's very sensible (and Canon P is her favorite street camera....)
http://www.photoethnography.com/ClassicCameras/index-frameset.html?OlympusXA.html~mainFrame

Have fun.

 

[shyoon]

Fixed-lens RF cameras aren't worth the trouble or the money. Buy a cheap LTM or M-mount camera with a Canon or CV lens and you'll be infinitely better off.

 

[sparrow6224]

"CV" lens means Cosina Voigtlander or often just Voigtlander (a German company long ago, now a name bought from that defunct concern and used by a Japanese company, Cosina). They make excellent new affordable lenses for classic cameras -- and they make excellent affordable RF cameras under the "Bessa" name. "CV" for short.

 

[Brian Legge]

I gunk the real answer here is that it's hard to go wrong with any camera that is in good working condition. 🙂 Finding one canbe non-trivial. Beyong that, it gets into personal ergonomcs, values, asthetics, etc.

I went on a binge last year when I first tried rangefinders. I picked up a bunch of fixed lens rangefinders, looking for the one that worked best for me. I got onto medium format rangefinders and LTM cameras. Almost everythng people talked about worked well.

- The Canonet 17 GIII was well balanced and had a nice finder.
- The Olypmus 35SP had a brilliant lens
- The 7SII was small and handled nicely with a nice lens.
- The Yashica GX was simple and got the job done.
- The XA and XA4 were great compact cameras.
- The Retina IIIc is compact and has a stunningly sharp lens
- the Leica III and Jupiter 8/Summar/Elmar was sharp, compact and felt refreshingly simple.

My favorite is irrelevant as all of the cameras were a pleasure to use. It took me a lot of coloring but I eventually realized that I'm totally happy using any of the cameras. I'd suggest figurng out what you value first - focal lengths, size, automatic funtionality, finder, low light performance, mobility to a digital camera, etc. Once you have a hunch there, you can figure out what makes the most sense. If you primarily shoot in the 40-55mm range, a fixed lens camera may be a good stating point.

It you primaily shoot outside this range, an LTM body may be a good stating point. You can alway use a converter down the road for an M. If you want this and automation, an M mount body (or a Bessa) may make more sense. Once the investment gets big though, figuring out if rangefinders are right for you wry a cheaper camera you could alway resell may be worth it. Over all, I think it's hard to go wrong as long as whatever yu buy works. 🙂

 

[dannybear]

wow! thanks for the awesome replys everyone!
Im stunned at how helpful everyone has been! 😀

 

[btgc]

Whatever you choose, but I agree that buying Yashica GX or CC is safe bet. They will sell for same or even more, if you don't like it or grow out of it's limitations. Once you get into body+lenses system, there's very narrow path back.

 

[keytarjunkie]

Hey! Not long ago I was a poor high school student. Now, I'm a poor college student. When I was in high school, I faced a similar decision and ended up going with a Nikon S2. That's a fabulous camera for your first rangefinder. Not all of these are rangefinders, but since the S2 I've owned an Olympus XA2 and a Nikon FM2n and a Leica M2 and now a Yashica T4D. I still think the Nikon is my favorite. If you're really picky about the M-mount, get a used Bessa R2M with a 35/2.5 skopar.

 

[Kolame]

Second hand bessa R + color skopar 35 for around 500$... You wouldn't need anything more than that, and the quality would be pretty close to anything more expensive.

+1
Alternative: You may either also start out with a Bessa R + Industar/Jupiter, would be cheaper…

 

[filmfan]

Hexar AF or Bessa R + 35mm skopar.