Help me choose which Leica.

[-fp]

Hi all.

I have wanted to own a digital Leica since selling my M6. I love the idea of film, but practically it no longer makes sense for me. So I find myself wanting to add a digital M to sit alongside the X100T.

I don't need it, but I deeply deeply want it. I have set myself the task of owning one by my 40th, which is 3 years away, but I'm growing impatient!

I cannot afford a new 240, and so I need to choose between a used M8 or M9.

This camera will be used to print to 12x8. It will be my 'considered' camera, the one I take with me when I want to slow down and shoot 100% manual including exposure. It will be more about the experience when shooting than much else.

I've seen M9 files which have had such an impact on me, they are... wow. But, I know any camera including a Fuji disposable can do this in the right place and with the right hands. I've had a brief go on an M8, but no more than 10 minutes. I used an M6 for a fair while, and loved it.

I wonder if an M8.2 (which I can't find) would be up to it or if I should spring for the M9? Like I say, 12x8 is as big as I go. And I can always upgrade later. Full frame pulls me in only because it means a 35 is a 35 but I guess maybe I could get used to the crop factor.

Is the M8 dangerous as it's no longer supported? Should I spend the extra bit to go with the M9 which, if it fails, Leica will still fix for me? I would buy this body to last me for 4-5 years, before being able to look at another.

It's an important purchase for me.

Advice please.

Thanks 🙂

 

[Roger Hicks]

M9 if focal lengths matter.

Cheers,

R.

 

[Huss]

The M9/ME is a great buy used as Leica has officially said they will replace the sensor for free for the life of the camera if it has any issues. No matter who is the current owner.

The M8 does not come with that level of support.

And that is before you consider full frame vs crop, ISO issues, rear LCD issues etc.

If you can swing an M9 series camera, go for it.

 

[mfogiel]

If you want to slow down and want the digital, then it would be much more logical to get a Sony full frame mirrorless camera, and compose through the EVF or better still, through the back screen. You can put it on a tripod and use a black cloth to see the subject better. The only advantage of digital Leicas ( if any ) lies in the OVF and manual focusing speed. Leica itself seems to be moving in the direction of mirrorless EVF only cameras. I've handled the Leica Q, and the EVF is clear and focusing speed is remarkably fast. Focus peaking helps you with manual lenses. You can still put Leica glass on top.

 

[bobby_novatron]

If you want the rangefinder experience then I'd say M9. Prices have gotten much more reasonable on used M9's in the past 6 months. It's still a great camera.

 

[Huss]

I have wanted to own a digital Leica since selling my M6. ..

I don't need it, but I deeply deeply want it.

If you want to slow down and want the digital, then it would be much more logical to get a Sony full frame mirrorless camera

Kinda misses his point entirely.

 

[Godfrey]

If you want the responsiveness and feel of your M6, I'd recommend waiting, saving up some money, and buying an M typ 240 (new or secondhand from a good dealer). Tamarkin Camera (http://www.tamarkin.com — my usual Leica equipment source, and an excellent dealer to work with) has used M240 cameras selling for right around $5000 plus or minus at present. M9s are about $1000 less.

I had the M9 for three years. While I liked it, I always found it sluggish in operation and was never particularly happy with the white balance and look of its in-camera JPEGs. I replaced it with the M-P when Leica offered the upgrade. The M/M-P typ 240 cameras produce much better in-camera JPEGs and are far more responsive, etc. I like everything about the M-P much more than I did the M9.

Regardless of which model M you buy, I would recommend buying from an established Leica dealer with good service and support. For me, these are expensive, long-term purchases and I like the security of having a good dealer's help if/when any problems arise.

G

(BTW: I had a Sony A7 for a year and some. It's not the same thing, not the same thing at all. It doesn't work all that well with most shorter focal length Leica RF lenses either. I sold it after I bought the M-P ... )

 

[rscheffler]

I would go with a used M9. It's what I 'started' with in late 2010 when I was in a similar train of thought as you.

The M9 has a host of quirks, but has a few advantages over the M8. It's apparently less picky about SD cards, though is still temperamental in this respect. You get a wider usable ISO range, full frame and don't have to deal with IR filters on lenses.

As with Godfrey, I moved on to the M240. It's definitely a snappier camera that feels more refined and responsive than the M9. But I 'survived' for over 3 years with the M9, whereby I learned its quirks and adapted my approach to work best with what it offered. Low ISO image quality is very pleasing and the files are quite robust in post. There certainly are better full frame cameras on the market now, from a technical perspective, but I still believe it's very difficult to top the Leica M shooting experience.

If you need to save up for some time for this purchase, maybe by the time you're ready M240 prices will be within reach. It's the camera I would recommend first if you had the budget and wanted to buy now. The last couple years seems to have eased up on Leica resale values, with used M240s often at price points now that are less than the M9 was at the same time in its product cycle. Depending on how things progress in the next couple years, this trend may continue, which will benefit you and anyone else (including me) interested in building a system with used equipment.

 

[jaapv]

Hi all.

Is the M8 dangerous as it's no longer supported? Should I spend the extra bit to go with the M9 which, if it fails, Leica will still fix for me? I would buy this body to last me for 4-5 years, before being able to look at another.

The M8 is still supported fully except for the LCD screen. But it will become increasingly less economical to repair over the years, as the price will exceed the cost of another body, depending on what went wrong of course.
After 2020 support will gradually wind down, I expect, but knowing Leica they will repair any old model as long as parts are available.

I would say go for a good M9 with a decent guaranty from a trusted dealer. If money is a concern buying a bargain privately or even worse on eBay is a high risk. Leicas can be expensive to repair.

The best thing to do, however, is to buy an M9 with sensor corrosion. The price should be quite low and Leica will put in a new sensor, giving the camera a thorough CLA in the process, for free.

 

[Mudman]

I had the same same question a few years ago. I went with the M8 and have been very happy. With prices down so far on the M9 though, I would say I'd probably choose that one. The difference at the time wasn't worth the extra money to me.

 

[MCTuomey]

M9 I'd say. Pricing well lately. Its quirks are manageable for most shooters. Leica has committed to support its sensor problems. Nice SOOC files, I believe. Not a lot of post processing required, most of the time.

None of the recent mirrorless alternatives play well with M mount wides, if you haven't heard. A shame because the Sony A7s produces beautiful files, would love to couple it to M glass.

 

[noisycheese]

I would recommend this, price be damned: http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1124723-REG/leica_10933_m_p_typ_240_digital.html

The Safari set is a better deal in terms of price than buying a black or chrome M-P and the Summicron 35mm for it.

Based on the results I have seen, the M-P with Leica M glass mounted easily equals or surpasses the image quality produced by 120/220 format film cameras.

Yes, this is a costly kit; it is also a camera for life. As with everything else, you get what you pay for.

 

[-fp]

I've found, from a dealer, a recently serviced M8.2 for £1k. Roughly 1/2 the cost of the M9. I reckon it may suit me for my first digital M, and the glass I can take with me to the 240 which will be more sensibly priced in 2-3 years.

 

[-fp]

I would recommend this, price be damned: http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1124723-REG/leica_10933_m_p_typ_240_digital.html

The Safari set is a better deal in terms of price than buying a black or chrome M-P and the Summicron 35mm for it.

Based on the results I have seen, the M-P with Leica M glass mounted easily equals or surpasses the image quality produced by 120/220 format film cameras.

Yes, this is a costly kit; it is also a camera for life. As with everything else, you get what you pay for.

I could not own a green Leica. I would hate myself.

 

[oscroft]

I don't need it, but I deeply deeply want it.

Deeply wanting it is far more important than needing it - I mean, I need to lose weight, but... 😉

I'm actually in a similar position myself and thinking of getting my first digital Leica, and for me it would have to be a full-frame because after 45 years of grocking 35mm and 50mm focal lengths, I just can't get my head round crop factors.

Besides, the M9 produces beautiful images. I've seen some full-frame ones produced by reviewers and others on the web, and if the M-240 didn't exist then I'd be very happy with an M9 for the next decade or more. (As it happens, I'm fortunately in a rare position where I could afford to buy a new 240, so I'll almost certainly go that route).

The other advantage is better support from Leica for longer, including the commitment to replace the sensor at any time should it suffer from corrosion.

Having said that, you say...

I've found, from a dealer, a recently serviced M8.2 for £1k. Roughly 1/2 the cost of the M9. I reckon it may suit me for my first digital M, and the glass I can take with me to the 240 which will be more sensibly priced in 2-3 years.

If your first digital M is going to be a stopgap anyway, then that might indeed be a good way to go, and that's a pretty good price for a serviced M8.2.

On the other other hand, should you go for an M9 then it won't be such an obvious stopgap, and you might not feel the need to upgrade until you can get a used M-260 (or whatever the next model is called) at a decent price.

I don't know if any of that helps, but one thing I've found is that the more I ask people for advice on things like this, the more options (and more reasons for supporting each option) I get, and that only confuses me more.

So I say trust yourself and go with your instinct.

 

[-fp]

Let's just say I buy the M9 tomorrow, I'm looking for a 50mm to go on it. I can't afford a new or new ish Leica lens so what's a good alternative?

 

[Fraser]

Let's just say I buy the M9 tomorrow, I'm looking for a 50mm to go on it. I can't afford a new or new ish Leica lens so what's a good alternative?

Rather than a 50mm I would go for a 40mm Summicron.

 

[Kwesi]

Hi all.

I have wanted to own a digital Leica since selling my M6. I love the idea of film, but practically it no longer makes sense for me. So I find myself wanting to add a digital M to sit alongside the X100T.

I don't need it, but I deeply deeply want it. I have set myself the task of owning one by my 40th, which is 3 years away, but I'm growing impatient!

I cannot afford a new 240, and so I need to choose between a used M8 or M9.

This camera will be used to print to 12x8. It will be my 'considered' camera, the one I take with me when I want to slow down and shoot 100% manual including exposure. It will be more about the experience when shooting than much else.

I've seen M9 files which have had such an impact on me, they are... wow. But, I know any camera including a Fuji disposable can do this in the right place and with the right hands. I've had a brief go on an M8, but no more than 10 minutes. I used an M6 for a fair while, and loved it.

I wonder if an M8.2 (which I can't find) would be up to it or if I should spring for the M9? Like I say, 12x8 is as big as I go. And I can always upgrade later. Full frame pulls me in only because it means a 35 is a 35 but I guess maybe I could get used to the crop factor.

Is the M8 dangerous as it's no longer supported? Should I spend the extra bit to go with the M9 which, if it fails, Leica will still fix for me? I would buy this body to last me for 4-5 years, before being able to look at another.

It's an important purchase for me.

Advice please.

Thanks 🙂

My advice is, sell the M6 and the X100T and get a used M240. Don't throw your money away on costly half measures. You haven't yet so why start now?
The M240 really is that good.

 

[oscroft]

Let's just say I buy the M9 tomorrow, I'm looking for a 50mm to go on it. I can't afford a new or new ish Leica lens so what's a good alternative?

I'm looking at the Zeiss Planar 50/2 myself - not inexpensive, but a lot cheaper than Leica (£599 new at Ffordes, compared to £1,489 for a Summicron 50/2 or £1,159 for a Summarit 50/2.4 - used prices will presumably be similarly proportionate).

Rather than a 50mm I would go for a 40mm Summicron.

And yes, that's an excellent little lens and can be found for a relatively modest price - I had one and got great results from it on my Leica CL, but it got sold in one of my thinning-out phases.

 

[MCTuomey]

Voigtlander Nokton 50/1.5 would be my choice. You'll like having the speed, the Nokton compares well to the pre-asph Summilux image-wise.