How to turn down work without burning bridges

[koven]

I worked with this singer a month back. Took several portraits with her and the money was great. I did it mainly for the exposure and because the pics will be in a couple press magazines and on her album cover.

Anyways she turned out to be very difficult to work with it. She is also very self conscious. She didn't like how she looked in some pictures so she demanded we go through every pic and she picked the ones she liked and I processed all of them. It was good practice.

After the fact some other photographers have told me that shes difficult and that they would never work with her again. Anyways she wants to do some more stuff and I'm just not interested, I feel like its a waste of time because I actually put a lot of effort into the things I do. How do I let her down without burning bridges she has a lot of connections with people who I would want to shoot in the future. I told her I`m busy right now but I don't want to lead her on.

 

[Chriscrawfordphoto]

If the money is good, and she has connections that you can benefit from, why not just do the work? Making a living as a photographer is not easy, why turn down good paying work?

 

[back alley]

i agree with chris...this is the 'business' part of it.

 

[willie_901]

Not to pile on... but if you are being fairly paid for the extra effort, and she really can help you get more gigs, what's the problem.

As Joe said, sometimes paying the bills won't be fun.

I was wondering though, have the photographers you talked with who fired her suffered?

 

[Rogier]

I worked with this singer a month back. Took several portraits with her and the money was great. I did it mainly for the exposure and because the pics will be in a couple press magazines and on her album cover.

Anyways she turned out to be very difficult to work with it. She is also very self conscious. She didn't like how she looked in some pictures so she demanded we go through every pic and she picked the ones she liked and I processed all of them. It was good practice.

After the fact some other photographers have told me that shes difficult and that they would never work with her again. Anyways she wants to do some more stuff and I'm just not interested, I feel like its a waste of time because I actually put a lot of effort into the things I do. How do I let her down without burning bridges she has a lot of connections with people who I would want to shoot in the future. I told her I`m busy right now but I don't want to lead her on.

Increase your price!

There is a balance for anything.
Obviously you are not getting paid enough to make it worth while the trouble...

You might also try to push back hard. Some people don't know their limits and need to be educated where they are.

 

[Brian Legge]

So knowing what you do now, would you change your workflow working with her again? Perhaps there is something you could do on your end to make it less frustrating or time consuming? Or to change the way your rates work based on her needs?

 

[goamules]

Maybe tell her you are in a busy period, so you'd like to work with her but have to follow a new process. That is you will take the shots, then bring her a selection of YOUR favorites, for her to decide on. Bring her your best 5-10 proofs, and don't let her waste your time picking through dozens. Don't let her mandate what type of post processing you will do. Don't let her ask for anything different once you've brought the prints for the 5-10. Have a sitting fee, so you get paid even if she doesn't like any of them.

She is a singer, you're not telling her how to perform. You are a photographer, make sure she doesn't tell you how to perform. You make the pictures, she pays for your time, then pays more if she likes the ones you offer her.

 

[newsgrunt]

If she hired you, then you have to smile and deal with it and consider it a learning experience. Trust me, this will pay dividends down the road when you become more known and get more work. You're not at the point in your career where you can call the shots and if she wants to look at every frame, then just say 'sure'. Work with her some more and she'll eventually come to trust your work and judgement.

I deal with this pretty well every day and those I've photographed often, let me go about my business, as do their handlers.

and fwiw, I've found that sometimes working with people who appeared to be the most high maintenance, ended up producing some very good work. So don't be too quick to write this artist off, esp if she has contacts you desire.

You brush her off and those contacts may very well evaporate and you develop a rep as a photographer who in their eyes, is difficult to work with. It goes both ways is what I'm suggesting...

 

[gb hill]

So what if she's rude. It's her monie. Learn to deal with it or just do like someone else posted "Get out NOW" I'd love to have the confidence that I could take on a job like that. You should do it.

 

[Chriscrawfordphoto]

Maybe tell her you are in a busy period, so you'd like to work with her but have to follow a new process. That is you will take the shots, then bring her a selection of YOUR favorites, for her to decide on. Bring her your best 5-10 proofs, and don't let her waste your time picking through dozens. Don't let her mandate what type of post processing you will do. Don't let her ask for anything different once you've brought the prints for the 5-10. Have a sitting fee, so you get paid even if she doesn't like any of them.

She is a singer, you're not telling her how to perform. You are a photographer, make sure she doesn't tell you how to perform. You make the pictures, she pays for your time, then pays more if she likes the ones you offer her.

I disagree completely. When you do commercial work, you do what the client wants, not what you want. If you won't do that, the clients have no problem telling you to f--k off, and they'll tell every other person they know to avoid you.

 

[Chriscrawfordphoto]

Welcome to the real world!

If you think that is difficult to work with you should quit now.

Agreed! The OP could have it much worse. Where I live most jobs pay $8 an hour. I'll take any headache from clients to avoid working at Walmart or Burger King. Whatever she's paying him is a hell of a lot more than many people earn in their jobs, and probably less stressful. I've worked those kind of crappy retail jobs, you get ZERO respect from your bosses or the public. Even good paying jobs are stressful. I'm teaching in an inner-city high school. This guy who can't handle a whiny woman singer would crack by the end of his first day with my students!

 

[Brian Legge]

True, but it seems like the initial agreement koven had during the first shoot may not have covered workflow or how many shots were to be delivered?

I'm not a pro but it seems like that ought to be decided up front. I get the impression that this wasn't true during the first shot and koven ended up delivering more shots than initially intended which can be time consuming from a post processing standpoint. Would it not be fair to charge an additional fee - based on time spent in post - per photo delivered if the client asks for more than was initially specified?

 

[koven]

Thanks for the responses guys, gave me something to think about. Are some of you guys saying its normal to have difficult customers?


Anyway I think I may suck it up and just do it. The thing is I put a lot of effort into that first shoot and I acted very professional and courteous. I almost was taken advantage of. I just think I may have set a dangerous precedent with that last shoot.

I'll probably do it for the practice at least if anything. And to someone who said I shouldn't turn down work, I agree but I know for a fact If I chase every dollar my work and reputation may suffer.

Thanks again guys! Its good to hear some insight from people in the business.

 

[koven]

Agreed! The OP could have it much worse. Where I live most jobs pay $8 an hour. I'll take any headache from clients to avoid working at Walmart or Burger King. Whatever she's paying him is a hell of a lot more than many people earn in their jobs, and probably less stressful. I've worked those kind of crappy retail jobs, you get ZERO respect from your bosses or the public. Even good paying jobs are stressful. I'm teaching in an inner-city high school. This guy who can't handle a whiny woman singer would crack by the end of his first day with my students!

I live in Toronto Canada, not Indiana. There a way bigger market for photographers.

I just took a look at your site and you really have no right to tell me I should quit. No offence. Everyone has their strengths and weakness......You're better suited to dealing with bratty kids while I'm better suited for taking pictures. Please tone it down a notch!

 

[Richard G]

In my line of work the customers have infinite rights. Sometimes they're difficult and sometimes their professional problem is difficult and sometimes both are difficult. I tell my team we are not there to soak up the easy work. This lady's reputation seems to be known and you are interested in her connections.

Two consequences of signing on again: you'll get more work; but you might become the go to guy for prima donnas others avoid. Watch out for that.

 

[koven]

True, but it seems like the initial agreement koven had during the first shoot may not have covered workflow or how many shots were to be delivered?

I'm not a pro but it seems like that ought to be decided up front. I get the impression that this wasn't true during the first shot and koven ended up delivering more shots than initially intended which can be time consuming from a post processing standpoint. Would it not be fair to charge an additional fee - based on time spent in post - per photo delivered if the client asks for more than was initially specified?

Well the thing was I gave her some amazing pictures but she was more nitpicky than anything. "oh i look too intense here" "my ass looks so big" ect.


I talked to another photographer with a lot of experience (done stuff for GQ, H and M, Mastercard) and he told me how difficult she was and that he wouldnt work for her again.

 

[koven]

In my line of work the customers have infinite rights. Sometimes they're difficult and sometimes their professional problem is difficult and sometimes both are difficult. I tell my team we are not there to soak up the easy work. This lady's reputation seems to be known and you are interested in her connections.

Two consequences of signing on again: you'll get more work; buy you might become the go to guy for prima donnas others avoid. Watch out for that.

Thank you!

 

[Keith]

I remember photographing a gallery opening a couple of years ago and running foul of the 'artist's' girlfriend who seemed to be on some sort of power trip. She more or less told me to **** off out of the way because I was wrecking the mood of 'their' opening by taking photographs. When I informed her that I was actually being paid by the organisation that funded her boyfriend's exhibition to document the event ... she just gave me another gob full and stalked off!

Some days you just have to bite down hard and get on with it! 😀

 

[Chriscrawfordphoto]

I live in Toronto Canada, not Indiana. There a way bigger market for photographers.

I just took a look at your site and you really have no right to tell me I should quit. No offence. Everyone has their strengths and weakness......You're better suited to dealing with bratty kids while I'm better suited for taking pictures. Please tone it down a notch!

Drop the ego, you just look like a fool. I've been doing this a lot longer than you, and I know what I'm talking about. It doesn't matter if its Toronto, or Indiana, or Santa Fe (where I lived and did a lot of commercial work), the business is the same. If you don't want to work hard, there are those who will, and THEY, not you, will get the work. Either shut up and get to work, or get out of the way so those who want to do so can work.

My students are not brats, they are kids from very disadvantaged families. Many of them have parents in prison, on drugs, not around, etc. Many of these kids are very intelligent, but little has been expected of them because they're poor, come from 'bad' families, and in many cases are Black or Mexican.

These kids do not deserve to have the schools give up on them because they have crappy parents or because they're not white. I'm proud of what I am doing, and many of these kids are starting to do well in school. If some of my kids end up going to college and escaping poverty because they had a teacher who gave a damn, then I've done far more for the world than you ever will.

 

[back alley]

koven, you asked the question...please don't get bitter/nasty because you don't like some of the answers.
let's keep this friendly or i'll close the thread and just end it here.

joe