johnastovall
Light Hunter - RIP 2010
And just what data do you have to back up this statement? I'm part of the Leica customer base and don't have unlimited assets. But I do manage my assets so I can buy quality which Leica is. Many of us do care about what gear costs and which is why we use CV and buy used gear.sitemistic said:
I'm very tired of the myth that Leica users have unlimited funds. If I did I would be using an Phase One back on a Sindar body and not CV and used Leica lenses.
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johnastovall
Light Hunter - RIP 2010
Olsen said:
This is one American who wishes, he could try his luck in Europe.... This used to be a "Hell'va good country." but not any more. I keep hearing Provence calling or Portugal or Spain or even Chile or Uraguay when I look South rather than East.
R
rpsawin
Guest
Olsen said:
Find a Norwegian government agency to do it for you or ask one of us dumb enslaved Americans.
Bob
Olsen
Well-known
rpsawin said:
All the norwegian government agencies are closed for the weekend so, I am stuck with the enslaved Americans. Could you rattle with your chains a little and try to explain to me 'what went wrong' with that post?
Leicabug
Established
sitemistic said:
Agree.
When Leica was charging $2500 for Noctilux, few people want them. Now that it's a $6k lens, Leica can't make enough of them to meet the demend. So it's smart for Leica to raise the price on its primuim lenses such as WATE and Noctilux. I don't believe completely in excuses such as euro/dollar or discontinued lens element. If euro/dollar is to be blamed, why no price increase for Summarits and $500 for Noctilux in the latest price adjustment? If the discontinued lens element is to be blamed, why is it that Noctilux is now making its way to the dealers. It means that current version of Noctilux is still alive and well, except it's a 6k lens.
I have no problem with this new Leica trend as I want Leica to be able to survive in today's tough, competitive environment.
whitecat
Lone Range(find)er
I have heard the "new" Noct's we are seeing now were made years ago. Any comments on this?
pfoto
Well-known
Well the components may have been made years ago (specifically the glass) but the lenses were probably assembled recently.
Olsen
Well-known
Leicabug said:
The currency fluctuation is the major reason. With the value of the dollar falling from € 1,10 baack in 2001 to € 0,65 today, that's pritty obvious. If the Leica managment hadn't compensated for a 40% fall in the US$ (and currencies following the US dollar as; Singapore dollar, Thai Bat, Malaysian Ringit, Chinese Yan etc. etc.) Leica would have been bankrupt long ago.
Difference in the level of increase from product to product could have other reasons.
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cmogi10
Bodhisattva
Olsen said:
I like where I am thank you
I'm glad you like where you are too
That means we can all be happy.
Roger Hicks
Veteran
Seconded.cmogi10 said:
Would there were more of us.
Cheers,
R.
ampguy
Veteran
Help is here
Help is here
Thanks to generous folks like MikeL and myself, we are keeping these rare units available at sub dealer prices (last time I checked).
But you're correct if someone wants/needs one of these, it will just be more expensive later.
Help is here
Thanks to generous folks like MikeL and myself, we are keeping these rare units available at sub dealer prices (last time I checked).
But you're correct if someone wants/needs one of these, it will just be more expensive later.
Hacker said:
retow
Well-known
cmogi10 said:
But at least it's comforting to know that some Norwegians seem to care so much about the USA and are always ready to provide their invaluable
rolleyes: ) advice for free.........
ampguy
Veteran
timing
timing
Hi Olsen,
These are fine opinions and may be relevant and useful for the current times, but things change fast.
We have some Norwegian friends who have done very well here, came with very little 20 years ago, benefited from the tech bubble, put their kids through public colleges here, own 3 mercedes, and a house that has European style heating and would cost ~5-10M USD in the bay area, if you could find one available with the acreage.
On top of that, their parents both died with diseases, that they feel would have been diagnosed sooner, and treated better if their parents were here in the US.
So the advice you're giving students now, may not be applicable if/when things hopefully get better here.
Also, doesn't the weather suck in Norway?
timing
Hi Olsen,
These are fine opinions and may be relevant and useful for the current times, but things change fast.
We have some Norwegian friends who have done very well here, came with very little 20 years ago, benefited from the tech bubble, put their kids through public colleges here, own 3 mercedes, and a house that has European style heating and would cost ~5-10M USD in the bay area, if you could find one available with the acreage.
On top of that, their parents both died with diseases, that they feel would have been diagnosed sooner, and treated better if their parents were here in the US.
So the advice you're giving students now, may not be applicable if/when things hopefully get better here.
Also, doesn't the weather suck in Norway?
Olsen said:
cmogi10
Bodhisattva
ampguy said:Hi Olsen,
These are fine opinions and may be relevant and useful for the current times, but things change fast.
We have some Norwegian friends who have done very well here, came with very little 20 years ago, benefited from the tech bubble, put their kids through public colleges here, own 3 mercedes, and a house that has European style heating and would cost ~5-10M USD in the bay area, if you could find one available with the acreage.
On top of that, their parents both died with diseases, that they feel would have been diagnosed sooner, and treated better if their parents were here in the US.
So the advice you're giving students now, may not be applicable if/when things hopefully get better here.
Also, doesn't the weather suck in Norway?
let me tell you, I can't wait to get back to the bay, the weather is so cold and bleak here on the east coast it's unbearably depressing sometimes.
I've been messing around with a 4x5 view camera to pass the time.
Olsen
Well-known
ampguy said:Hi Olsen,
These are fine opinions and may be relevant and useful for the current times, but things change fast.
We have some Norwegian friends who have done very well here, came with very little 20 years ago, benefited from the tech bubble, put their kids through public colleges here, own 3 mercedes, and a house that has European style heating and would cost ~5-10M USD in the bay area, if you could find one available with the acreage.
On top of that, their parents both died with diseases, that they feel would have been diagnosed sooner, and treated better if their parents were here in the US.
So the advice you're giving students now, may not be applicable if/when things hopefully get better here.
Also, doesn't the weather suck in Norway?
Sure. Quite a few Norwegians are doing well in USA. Students studying at US universities marry Americans and stay on. That's the typical. Or they have and education - or business that does not offer that much over here. I know of at least three Norwegian dollar billionairs living & working in USA, like the Stolt-Nielsen family - within shipping. But if you are rich you will be fine just everywhere. Still: According to American statistics (Forbes) Norway is the country in the world with the highest rate of dollar millionairs. So, it is easier to 'make it' over here, on a more modest scale.
For more ordinary people, and a far bit up, the situation is drastically better over here. Due to a better public service and a national economy that produces a economical surplus. Not a deficit. Ordinary Norwegians don't have to pay the huge cost of any 'federal debt'. On the contrary, the Norwegian state has a huge fortune which covers pension costs and long term public investments. Relatively speaking; taxes are lower over here when the cost of healthcare, pension funds and education is included. Far lower!
One of my neighbours is an architect from Dallas, Texas. He and his wife are very glad to be tied to the lavish Norwegian healthcare and pension system. They say it is 'impossible' to buy something equal on the market in USA. His problem is his old parents back home with insufficient health care coverage - with huge health expenditures which he has to cover. A heart operation for his father cost the price of what a Mercedes costs over here. - Here a heart operation is practically free. You even get the taxi bills going to and fro hospital covered.
The Norwegian health care system is public and all their documentation from budgets to quality control is public matters available to all. Their quality can be compared to similar establishments - as long as their matters are public too. Researchers - and not the least the press, spend a lot of time digging in this in this information. If the health care system had been run by private companies this information would have been company secrets.
It could well be that the parents of your friends could have had their cancers discovered earlier, but it is just a hypotetical claim. What is a challange for the Norwegian health care system is hefty cost increases the last few years. Still it is about half the cost of the health care system of USA - relatively compared.
When it comes to the weather; I can confirm that it is lousy. Right now we have the darkest time of the year with daylight only 6 hours per day even as far south as Oslo. A snowstorm hit us this weekend and I had to spend hours digging out our cars. And yes, there was a little patch of blue sky up there. I took a picture of it for all to see. It is documented below.
Don't misunderstand me. I love USA. America for me is the beautiful national parks of the west, - and John Steinbeck's Cannary Row. Happy one can be just anywhere. But the economical situation is going to be tough on ordinary people. That's my message.
The picture is from down-town-Oslo this afternoon. M8 with a 35 mm 2,0 Cron. An excellent lense. Far better than any Noctilux, by the way.
Attachments
MikeL
Go Fish
Olsen, I know it's dark over there and you need to talk and stuff, but isn't there a EconomicsFinderForum.com or TheSkyIsFallingAndIKnowItAndYouDon't.com forum somewhere or something like it? Uh, thanks though.......
Olsen said:
Olsen
Well-known
cmogi10 said:let me tell you, I can't wait to get back to the bay, the weather is so cold and bleak here on the east coast it's unbearably depressing sometimes.
I've been messing around with a 4x5 view camera to pass the time.
Back in 1991 I drove with a friend of mine from LA along the Big Sur to San Fransisco, and onwards to Lake Tahoe, Yosemite, Death Valley, Las Vegas, - and onwards, almost across USA. We have a lot of coast line here in Norway, but I have never seen anything so beautiful as the Big Sur. Very beautiful. And also San Fransisco. A very unique place. I can imagine that you are homesick.
Olsen
Well-known
MikeL said:Olsen, I know it's dark over there and you need to talk and stuff, but isn't there a EconomicsFinderForum.com or TheSkyIsFallingAndIKnowItAndYouDon't.com forum somewhere or something like it? Uh, thanks though.......
well, æhum, mike, what I am doing is to explain why a Noctilux hardly has increased in price over here, while it has nearly doubled in price 'over there'. And why. The sky hasn't fallen down. The dollar has.
Olsen
Well-known
sitemistic said:Well, the sky is falling. At least this time folks can watch it all on their 60" LCD HDTV.
Ha, ha, ha, ha!
retow
Well-known
Olsen said:
Noctilux price in Germany, incl VAT, in 2002: 2500 Euro, in 2008: 4795 Euro. But price "has hardly increased in ol Europe", if you really meant what you wrote. Looking at the 5 year NOK versus Euro chart, I would assume that NOK price increases over the same time period were at least as steep as the Euro ones.
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