akarin
Established
Way to go Michael. I have just been told by a colleague who works in PR yesterday about the workshop. Too late for me to join, plus I've got other commitments lined up.
Where did you meet these guys if I might ask? Sounds like it could be a good place to hang out for beers and good conversation
-Akarin
Where did you meet these guys if I might ask? Sounds like it could be a good place to hang out for beers and good conversation
-Akarin
emraphoto
Veteran
I personally think Magnum has lost their way, and diluted their impact. But, that's another story.
how so may i ask. not out of anything but pure curiosity.
emraphoto
Veteran
how do you know this? do you have some inside information you would like to share?
emraphoto
Veteran
forgive me Fred but i am not seeing anything that states Magnum is not making money, the photographers are not making money or that Magnum is struggling.
now i am not in a state of denial, i know first hand what a bloody struggle it is right now. but i am genuinely curious when somebody says "the photographers aren't making money, the agency isn't making money".
or "the agency has lost its way".
is this based on first hand knowledge? is there some information that i should be privy to? this is important information for me. for the record, i know (personally) a handful of photographers that are working and doing well (by "well" i mean not delivering pizzas yet). the wife and i will certainly not be hitting the beaches of Cannes this year but i am still working.
i also see a big difference between "i don't dig what they (Magnum) are doing right now" and "they have lost their way".
now i am not in a state of denial, i know first hand what a bloody struggle it is right now. but i am genuinely curious when somebody says "the photographers aren't making money, the agency isn't making money".
or "the agency has lost its way".
is this based on first hand knowledge? is there some information that i should be privy to? this is important information for me. for the record, i know (personally) a handful of photographers that are working and doing well (by "well" i mean not delivering pizzas yet). the wife and i will certainly not be hitting the beaches of Cannes this year but i am still working.
i also see a big difference between "i don't dig what they (Magnum) are doing right now" and "they have lost their way".
Pickett Wilson
Veteran
Magnum's problems became very visible in 1999 when the bickering and backbiting and complaining that as they approached their 50th anniversary broke into the public sphere with comments from members. The big concerns then, including not making money, have only been exacerbated over the ensuing years because of the rapidly decreasing demand for editorial photography, the collapse of many galleries and the art market, and the devaluation of the stock photo market.
Many of the members back in '99 feared that the digitalization of their photo assets would devalue them. While changes in the market have devalued their assets much more than the move to digital image databases has, it is part of the current problems. The big assignments have disappeared along with the magazines and news outlets that hired Magnum members. Many of them are spending much of their time doing workshops and trying to make money off of book deals.
The photo world has changed significantly.
Many of the members back in '99 feared that the digitalization of their photo assets would devalue them. While changes in the market have devalued their assets much more than the move to digital image databases has, it is part of the current problems. The big assignments have disappeared along with the magazines and news outlets that hired Magnum members. Many of them are spending much of their time doing workshops and trying to make money off of book deals.
The photo world has changed significantly.
emraphoto
Veteran
i have heard a lot of this sort of thing for a great deal of time now and most importantly i am not denying any of it. what i am curious about is some link or anecdote or first hand information that says the photographers (or magnum) for that matter are not making any money.
are times hard? they sure bloody are. has the photo world changed? pretty clear. are photographers making/selling less than they were say, 10 years ago? obvious. now where i get confused is the whole "they aren't making money" bit. yes, they are running workshops and pursuing book deals whilst trying to navigate tough times (that is not exclusive to photography) and of course making money at it.
i am not attempting to be difficult. i would be most interested in some factual information that states one way or the other.
are times hard? they sure bloody are. has the photo world changed? pretty clear. are photographers making/selling less than they were say, 10 years ago? obvious. now where i get confused is the whole "they aren't making money" bit. yes, they are running workshops and pursuing book deals whilst trying to navigate tough times (that is not exclusive to photography) and of course making money at it.
i am not attempting to be difficult. i would be most interested in some factual information that states one way or the other.
Haigh
Gary Haigh
Fantastic. Have a great meeting.
gumanow
Snapshooter
Hey Dave,
I'm going to register today for that workshop.
Gary
I'm going to register today for that workshop.
Gary
Andy Kibber
Well-known
FWIW, in an interview with Martin Parr he said that joining Magnum was signing up for sharing a debt and that if every member requested the money owed to them, the organization would be bankrupt. Those may not be his exact words, but they're pretty close. I think the interview was from a couple of years ago.
paultreacy
PHOTOHUMOURIST
David Alan Harvey is not famous. But his work is. As it should be. In person, he's a gem.
Photohumourist.com
Photohumourist.com
paultreacy
PHOTOHUMOURIST
Magnum
Magnum
Though Magnum has had some serious difficulties and nearly come undone as a result and difficulties remain, they are an incredible bunch of innovators there. Magnum in motion is marvelous. Some of the big collective projects they have undertaken have set new standards of excellence in our industry.
In many respects, Magnum appears to go from strength to strength.
Paul Treacy
The Photohumourist - Mixed Messages
Magnum
Though Magnum has had some serious difficulties and nearly come undone as a result and difficulties remain, they are an incredible bunch of innovators there. Magnum in motion is marvelous. Some of the big collective projects they have undertaken have set new standards of excellence in our industry.
In many respects, Magnum appears to go from strength to strength.
Paul Treacy
The Photohumourist - Mixed Messages
bo_lorentzen
Established
Sounds like a very lucky moment at a pub.
About Magnum, Im seriously confused, what I read here seems like public bickering in Magnum is news.. (news defined as the last 50 years.?) or the fact that the finances are interesting can't hardly be news either.
The awesomeness is that a group of very capable photographers with a lot of different visions in some strange ways get along and mostly work together as a collective.. (?) Interestingly the entire concept is generally going to be counter-intuitive to most M camera geeks, as these are guys seeking a type of art before money, where most M guys I know succeeded in finance or other types of business before seeing art. But yes, from the perspective of running a corporation with one CEO, magnum is in serious problems. as a art cooperative, well Im not sure sure they have entirely lost their way.
EDIT: Kind of regrett dragging M users into my statement, what I meant was probably more along the line of "some successful individuals who sincerely enjoy the photographic hobby, may from a business perspective find it challenging to see the actual success of a operation like Magnum" Hmm. this don't sound any better either... just saying.
.
Bo
www.bophoto.typepad.com
About Magnum, Im seriously confused, what I read here seems like public bickering in Magnum is news.. (news defined as the last 50 years.?) or the fact that the finances are interesting can't hardly be news either.
The awesomeness is that a group of very capable photographers with a lot of different visions in some strange ways get along and mostly work together as a collective.. (?) Interestingly the entire concept is generally going to be counter-intuitive to most M camera geeks, as these are guys seeking a type of art before money, where most M guys I know succeeded in finance or other types of business before seeing art. But yes, from the perspective of running a corporation with one CEO, magnum is in serious problems. as a art cooperative, well Im not sure sure they have entirely lost their way.
EDIT: Kind of regrett dragging M users into my statement, what I meant was probably more along the line of "some successful individuals who sincerely enjoy the photographic hobby, may from a business perspective find it challenging to see the actual success of a operation like Magnum"
Hmm. this don't sound any better either... just saying..
Bo
www.bophoto.typepad.com
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