Insured against mugging

[ClaremontPhoto]

If you act and look like a local you're generally OK.

Every day I see Americans (mainly) with flashy cameras saying 'Gee just look at that'. No wonder they're mugged.

I move and walk like a local and carry a local newspaper and have never had any trouble at all.

 

[shaaktiman]

It always amazes me when I see tourists waiting for the subway with huge D70s hanging around their NECK. I know that NYC has gotten much safer in the past decade, but really.

I would never carry a hammer. That has civil lawsuit written all over it. Also, for some reason my friends who carry weapons seem to attract much more violence than my friends who never carry anything. In the event that I was getting mugged I would run if possible, otherwise I would just hand over my gear. I'd rather lose my leica than get sued for hurting some schmuck later on, let alone getting hurt myself. I do enjoy the weight and heft of my MP in the event that I do need a weapon though. Say someone who didn't want to be photographed just plumb flipped out, that would be my weapon of choice, particularly since the damage to it would be covered by passport. 🙂

I've been mugged 3 times. Once I lost $40, once I actually managed to talk my way out of it (I had a lot of money in my pocket, I still can't believe I managed to get out of it.) The third time I was blindsided by a 2x4 and was woken up on the street later by a shopowner who saw it go down. My main goal is to keep that from happening again... hence, insurance is my big plan.

 

[Bryan Lee]

Bryan,

Was this in Thailand?

R.J.

Sunderland today

KILLED FOR JUST £100
THREE men were appearing in court today after a Sunderland man was killed in Thailand for the sake of just £100.
James Edward Hall was beaten during a bungled robbery by a gang who had previously worked for him as labourers, according to police.
The Foreign Office confirmed the 57-year-old tourist died after his body was discovered near a bungalow on Ko Chang Island's Sai Khao beach on Christmas Eve.
Northumbria Police said Mr Hall's relations have been informed of the tragedy and have been left "extremely distressed" by the news.
Thai police said Mr Hall, who was on holiday in Thailand, was set upon by men who planned to steal cash, believed to be 150 euros, about £102.
Three Thai men – two aged 18 and one 20 – were arrested on Christmas Eve and are believed to have confessed to beating and robbing Mr Hall.
Lieutenant Supin Naoprakson told the Press Association the three suspects had all worked for Mr Hall, helping him build a property on the island.
"They did not mean to murder him, they just tried to get money from him, but then they had fighting. They just used boots, and then just hit his head, something like that.
"They used to work to build the bar for that Englishman, that is why they knew about where this guy was staying, and how much they had money in the wallet."
Mr Hall was said to have arrived on the island in October and was a frequent visitor. Police have not said which part of Sunderland he comes from.
A friend of his on Ko Chang Island declined to comment on his death.
The island of Ko Chang, Thailand's second largest after Phuket, is a tropical marine national park, located in the country's eastern Trat province, on the border with Cambodia.
Sai Khao (White Sands) Beach is the longest and busiest on the island and is lined with bar and nightclubs.
26 December 2005

There are some very nasty people floating around if your unlucky eneugh to be confronted by them. Tourist in general dont have a clue as to how things realy work here and when confronted by it they just deny it and choose to see smileing faces. Crime is always a big topic here. This is the latest,


Times online


British student found dead in Thailand
By Times Online and PA

A British student has been found dead in the sea off Thailand during a two week new year break with a female friend.

The body of Katherine Horton, 21, a psychology student from Thornhill, Cardiff, south Wales, was discovered in the sea off the island of Koh Samui by a jet skier earlier today.

Ms Horton's mother, Elizabeth Horton, spoke of her devastation after learning of her daughter’s sudden death. "We know so little," said Mrs Horton from her home in Cardiff. "One of my sons knows what has happened but we are still trying to contact his brother to break the news."

One family friend, who did not wish to be named, said she believed Ms Horton was a second year psychology student at Reading University. She said she had flown out to Thailand with a female friend on December 27 after celebrating Christmas with her family.

"It was only a short backpacking holiday with a girlfriend. They were due back on January 10," the friend said. "While they were out there they met up with other friends and it was one of them who actually phoned to break the news today. The girl she went out there with is inconsolable and couldn’t speak.

"We have had no official information at all. We simply don’t know what happened. The family are trying to find out what exactly has happened but there is no news at the moment."

A Foreign Office spokesman said tonight that Ms Horton’s body was discovered in the sea by a jet-skier at 10am local time today. She was last seen alive on Sunday night. "Police are investigating her death," the spokesman added.

Miss Adams, who is said to be inconsolable, was last night still helping the authorities. She told police that they had been sitting on the beach in front of the bungalows at 9pm when Miss Horton received a call from her family on her mobile. She then strolled along the beach as she spoke to her relatives while Miss Adams returned to their bungalow and fell asleep. It was not until the next morning that she realised Miss Horton was missing.

Her body was found a short while later. One witness said there were signs of severe injuries to her head and shoulder. Local television footage showed her body slumped on the beach wearing a dark green T-shirt. She appeared to have bruising on her left shoulder.

 

[ch1]

It always amazes me when I see tourists waiting for the subway with huge D70s hanging around their NECK. I know that NYC has gotten much safer in the past decade, but really.

I would never carry a hammer. That has civil lawsuit written all over it. Also, for some reason my friends who carry weapons seem to attract much more violence than my friends who never carry anything. In the event that I was getting mugged I would run if possible, otherwise I would just hand over my gear. I'd rather lose my leica than get sued for hurting some schmuck later on, let alone getting hurt myself. I do enjoy the weight and heft of my MP in the event that I do need a weapon though. Say someone who didn't want to be photographed just plumb flipped out, that would be my weapon of choice, particularly since the damage to it would be covered by passport. 🙂

I've been mugged 3 times. Once I lost $40, once I actually managed to talk my way out of it (I had a lot of money in my pocket, I still can't believe I managed to get out of it.) The third time I was blindsided by a 2x4 and was woken up on the street later by a shopowner who saw it go down. My main goal is to keep that from happening again... hence, insurance is my big plan.

I've lived all my life in and around NYC all my life including residing in Manhattan for the last 30 years. I've never been mugged.

I've carried my cameras all over town and never even felt threatened - much less mugged! This includes walking all over town (even UPTOWN - if you catch my drift).

People carry all kinds of things of valuable items, including D-70's, on the subways every day. After all, there are three million riders on the system each day! Heck, I've carried my D-70 on the subway.

If you've managed to get mugged three times then perhaps you are just one of those unfortunates who has "VICTIM" written all of you.

Please consider re-locating. Then NYC's already low crime rate will further decline and we'll have one less negative resident bad mouthing the greatest city on the planet! 🙁

 

[Doug]

RJ,

With all due respect - I am a landlord in NYC

NO LEASE REQUIRES THAT YOU HAVE RENTER'S INSURANCE.

...
And, why would I do so?

As a landlord, I do not care what kind of insurance, if any, you have! Why would I?

Renter's insurance covers the renter and has NO nexus with the LL.

Oddly enough, an uninsured tenant suffering a loss is likely to feel it should be covered by the landlord, and may take it to Small Claims Court... and win. Yeah, it's wrong, but the judge looks at the poor pitiful girl and then at Mr Moneybags Landlord, and makes his (wrong) decision. And there you are, outraged and considering an expensive and troublesome appeal to Superior Court mostly on principle rather than principal. Yep, happened to me. Our agreement SUGGESTS renters insurance.

FWIW I've noticed that denizens of NYC often seem to think the way things work there is the way things work all across the country. Yeah, I was born in NYC... 😀

 

[shaaktiman]

I've lived all my life in and around NYC all my life including residing in Manhattan for the last 30 years. I've never been mugged.

I've carried my cameras all over town and never even felt threatened - much less mugged! This includes walking all over town (even UPTOWN - if you catch my drift).

People carry all kinds of things of valuable items, including D-70's, on the subways every day. After all, there are three million riders on the system each day! Heck, I've carried my D-70 on the subway.

If you've managed to get mugged three times then perhaps you are just one of those unfortunates who has "VICTIM" written all of you.

Please consider re-locating. Then NYC's already low crime rate will further decline and we'll have one less negative resident bad mouthing the greatest city on the planet! 🙁

I think that different areas of NYC have well deserved varying reputations as to safety. If you live on the upper west side and take an occasional stroll through Harlem then I am not surprised you've never been mugged. While living for the past 4 years in Bushwick I've had my apartment broken into twice but when I lived in fort greene it never happened even once. Guess why?

Before you get upset that someone may find NYC occasionally dangerous I recommend you take a nice long stroll, maybe a few nights in a row, through East New York and Brownsville. Hell, take your D70! Let me know if you feel about it. Don't forget, only after dark counts. It's not fair to scurry back to midtown at dusk and then proclaim the city safe, and my thread a menace.

To be fair though, none of those muggings I've had occurred in NYC. They all happened within 4 years of living as a student in Buffalo, NY. A much more dangerous city, no question. But then again, someone was stabbed just last year on my street here in Bushwick. (Maybe they had "victim" written all over them.)

I've been in NYC for 10 years now and haven't had any real trouble. But then I've never walked around with a Leica before. Better safe than sorry.

 

[ch1]

I think that different areas of NYC have well deserved varying reputations as to safety. If you live on the upper west side and take an occasional stroll through Harlem then I am not surprised you've never been mugged. While living for the past 4 years in Bushwick I've had my apartment broken into twice but when I lived in fort greene it never happened even once. Guess why?

Before you get upset that someone may find NYC occasionally dangerous I recommend you take a nice long stroll, maybe a few nights in a row, through East New York and Brownsville. Hell, take your D70! Let me know if you feel about it. Don't forget, only after dark counts. It's not fair to scurry back to midtown at dusk and then proclaim the city safe, and my thread a menace.

To be fair though, none of those muggings I've had occurred in NYC. They all happened within 4 years of living as a student in Buffalo, NY. A much more dangerous city, no question. But then again, someone was stabbed just last year on my street here in Bushwick. (Maybe they had "victim" written all over them.)

I've been in NYC for 10 years now and haven't had any real trouble. But then I've never walked around with a Leica before. Better safe than sorry.

All of these muggings happened in Buffalo! And so you bad-mouth NYC?

Last time I checked the map - Buffalo is still 420 miles (m/l) from NYC using either the Thruway or, alternatively, taking I-81 south from Syracuse to Rte. 17 etc to save on the tolls.

You see, I went to school at UB and know Buffalo almost as well as NYC!!!

Why do you use examples of people carrying D-70's on the NYC subways to exemplify you fear of crime based on experiences in Buffalo. How on earth can you equate the two?

Has UB declined so far now that Logic is no longer even in the curriculum?

As to the dangers of Bushwick or ENY - admittedly they remain greater than most of Manhattan and near in Bklyn (much less Queens etc.). But they are far, far better now than a decade ago.

FACT: In order to "save" the community in the late 1990's ACORN (a non-profit housing group) started building houses in ENY that were sold for $50,000 to what ever "urban pioneers" were willing to come into the area. Now, private developers are building houses there that are priced in the upper $300,000's and higher.

I lived through the real downhill slide that NYC went through from the late 1960's into the 1990's! Those of us who "stuck it out" have little to no patience anymore for folks who would bad mouth the most amazing urban renasissance the US has ever seen.

Simple fact, if you don't like it here - move. But spare us the bad-mouthing - it's not factually correct and just bullshit! 😡

 

[ch1]

Oddly enough, an uninsured tenant suffering a loss is likely to feel it should be covered by the landlord, and may take it to Small Claims Court... and win. Yeah, it's wrong, but the judge looks at the poor pitiful girl and then at Mr Moneybags Landlord, and makes his (wrong) decision. And there you are, outraged and considering an expensive and troublesome appeal to Superior Court mostly on principle rather than principal. Yep, happened to me. Our agreement SUGGESTS renters insurance.

FWIW I've noticed that denizens of NYC often seem to think the way things work there is the way things work all across the country. Yeah, I was born in NYC... 😀

1) Since I presently only own rental property in NYC - I do not care what is the "practice" in other jurisdictions - although as an attorney I am skeptical of what you say.

2) As a landlord, I always carry full insurance protection for myself including liability, property and loss of income. In so doing, I do not see the risk you are speaking of.

Oh, you are correct that your agreement (lease) "suggests" renter's insurance. What RJ said was that the lease "required" renter's insurance.

That was my only point on the matter - a LL cannot "require" a tenant to get renter's insurance. By "suggesting" it in the lease it will serve as "notice" to the tenant (which is where I think you are on this).

Gosh, this is so damned OT - I'm stopping now! 🙂

 

[Frank Granovski]

Hey, I've been to Buffalo. It's just across the lake from Toronto. 😉

 

[ch1]

Hey, I've been to Buffalo. It's just across the lake from Toronto. 😉

Yes, Frank, the "other" answer would be why "poop" on Buffalo?

I had a great time there when I was at UB (although part of it was coming up to
T.O. for a "big city" experience - and that was 33 years ago!!!).

Buffalo's had it's hard times - but that put down, too, was a cheap shot.

Some folks just have to bad-mouth where they live. I don't know why when they can just move! :bang:

 

[RJBender]

1) Since I presently only own rental property in NYC - I do not care what is the "practice" in other jurisdictions - although as an attorney I am skeptical of what you say.

2) As a landlord, I always carry full insurance protection for myself including liability, property and loss of income. In so doing, I do not see the risk you are speaking of.

Oh, you are correct that your agreement (lease) "suggests" renter's insurance. What RJ said was that the lease "required" renter's insurance.

That was my only point on the matter - a LL cannot "require" a tenant to get renter's insurance. By "suggesting" it in the lease it will serve as "notice" to the tenant (which is where I think you are on this).

Gosh, this is so damned OT - I'm stopping now! 🙂

George, I shouldn't have said "most leases require that you have renter's insurance." I have no way of knowing what most leases require. I should have said, "Shaaktiman, check your lease and see if your landlord requires renters insurance." If your lease requires it, then that's another reason to buy it. 😛

George, when you said, "NO LEASE REQUIRES THAT YOU HAVE RENTER'S INSURANCE." did you mean no residential leases in NYC require it? Here's a clause from a commercial lease in NYC:

Tenant covenants and agrees to provide on or before the
Commencement Date and to keep in force during the term hereof for the benefit of
Landlord and Tenant a comprehensive general liability insurance policy
protecting Landlord and Tenant against any liability contained in the standard
extended coverage policy, occasioned by any occurrence on or about the demised
premises or any appurtenances thereto. Such policy is to be written by good and
solvent insurance companies reasonably satisfactory to Landlord, and shall be in
such limits as Landlord may reasonably require and as of the date of this Lease
Landlord reasonably requires limits of liability thereunder of not less than the
amount of Three Million ($3,000,000) Dollars single limit for bodily or personal
injury (including death) and in the amount of Three Hundred Thousand ($300,000)
Dollars in respect of property damage. Such insurance may be carried
under a blanket policy covering the demised premises and other locations of
Tenant, if any. Prior to the time such insurance is first required to be carried
by Tenant and thereafter, at least fifteen (15) days prior to the effective date
of any such policy, Tenant agrees to deliver to Landlord either a duplicate
original of the aforesaid policy or a certificate evidencing such insurance.
Said policy or certificate, as the case may be, shall contain an endorsement
that such insurance may not be cancelled except upon ten (10) days' notice to
Landlord. Tenant's failure to provide and keep in force the aforementioned
insurance shall be regarded as a material default hereunder entitling Landlord
to exercise any or all of the remedies provided in this Lease in the event of
Tenant's default.

source: http://contracts.corporate.findlaw.com/agreements/247media/broadway.lease.1998.04.30.html

Anyway, sorry for the off topic posts. 🙂 Shaaktiman, good luck !

 

[back alley]

if the law was clear and easy, cut & dried with no room for interpretation...there would be no need for courts.

time, gentlemen, please...

joe

 

[ch1]

RJ,

There is a vast difference in NYC (and NYS) b/w commercial leases and residential leases.

The former are basically negotiated contracts with a "caveat emptor" level of legal protection.

OTOH, residential leases are highly regulated by NYS and NYC law.

I respect you deeply, RJ, so on this point, please, oh please, do not equate commercial leases with residential leases in NY! It's beyond comparing apples to oranges!!

George

 

[Frank Granovski]

I had a good time in Buffalo. That was in the early 70's. 😎

 

[RJBender]

George,

I have a tremendous amount of respect for you, too. 🙂 I'd hate to see you go through some of the BS Doug went through or some of the scenarios I mentioned earlier.

It's the liablility coverage under section II of the renter's policy that benefits the landlord. Section I of the policy doesn't do anything for the landlord.

Back on topic: If you rent, get renter's insurance for your rangefinder cameras and stuff. 😉

R.J.

 

[shaaktiman]

Ah jeez. Total mess of a thread. Dude, you need to relax a little.

I love NYC. I am not dissing it, (I'm actually confused as to where you're getting that idea, I didn't badmouth NY or Buffalo.) I am not afraid of living here, I do not have "victim" written all over me and I have no intention of moving. My question was merely whether anyone knew if my renter's insurance (yet to be purchased) would cover something lost or stolen while away from my apartment. I don't think that's such an unreasonable question seeing as I carry a leica with me everywhere.

I realize that NYC is among the safer cities in the US today. Regardless, it is idiotic to broadcast your expensive possesions when traveling anywhere. Maybe you have never been mugged, you're lucky for that, however it does not mean that you should take your safety for granted. I have not had anything serious happen to me yet, but friends and aquaintances have, both here in NY, in Buffalo, and elsewhere in the world. If you are not afraid of crime then you are (an extremely lucky) idiot.

I apologize if you take offense at me describing my experiences, but they are both real and valid. Being responsible for my belongings and safety is not the equivalent of badmouthing a city. I don't see why you are urging me to leave because I expressed concern over someone being stabbed on my corner. Maybe I'm not yet such a hardboiled new yorker as you are that such a thing doesn't even warrant notice. But if stories about my life or neighborhood continue to upset you, you might be better off just blocking my username. Just spare yourself the grief of hearing about my insurance woes, Brooklyn and life outside Trump Tower in general.

As for Buffalo, I loved my time at UB too but Buffalo can be really rough. I've been all over, including some pretty dangerous places, and I think Buffalo has the most random crime of anywhere I've been.

Anyway, thanks for the advice some of you.

adam

 

[ch1]

Ah jeez. Total mess of a thread. Dude, you need to relax a little.

I love NYC. I am not dissing it, (I'm actually confused as to where you're getting that idea, I didn't badmouth NY or Buffalo.) I am not afraid of living here, I do not have "victim" written all over me and I have no intention of moving. My question was merely whether anyone knew if my renter's insurance (yet to be purchased) would cover something lost or stolen while away from my apartment. I don't think that's such an unreasonable question seeing as I carry a leica with me everywhere.

I realize that NYC is among the safer cities in the US today. Regardless, it is idiotic to broadcast your expensive possesions when traveling anywhere. Maybe you have never been mugged, you're lucky for that, however it does not mean that you should take your safety for granted. I have not had anything serious happen to me yet, but friends and aquaintances have, both here in NY, in Buffalo, and elsewhere in the world. If you are not afraid of crime then you are (an extremely lucky) idiot.



I apologize if you take offense at me describing my experiences, but they are both real and valid. Being responsible for my belongings and safety is not the equivalent of badmouthing a city. I don't see why you are urging me to leave because I expressed concern over someone being stabbed on my corner. Maybe I'm not yet such a hardboiled new yorker as you are that such a thing doesn't even warrant notice. But if stories about my life or neighborhood continue to upset you, you might be better off just blocking my username. Just spare yourself the grief of hearing about my insurance woes, Brooklyn and life outside Trump Tower in general.

As for Buffalo, I loved my time at UB too but Buffalo can be really rough. I've been all over, including some pretty dangerous places, and I think Buffalo has the most random crime of anywhere I've been.

Anyway, thanks for the advice some of you.

adam

Adam,

I'll let it go with this:

When I was at UB there was only the Main St. campus plus the Ridge Lea (which you likely never heard of) Annex.

There was no Amherst campus where they've now "re-created" a one-time urban university into a "sweet ass" suburban one. Okay?

So where are you coming from with the 2x4 muggings?

Did you go to UB in the late '60's and early '70's before they ensconsed everyone in a suburban enclave? If so, maybe you saw some "street". But elsewise, how in the hell did you run into a 2x4 on a suburban "woosely" campusZ?

I lived off-campus in those bad old days, down at Main and Ferry - (old timers would know it as across the triangle from Freddy's Donuts).

Yeah, I had my car stolen once - hot wired by an asshole who left it five blocks away with the heavy duty screwdriver he used still sitting on the front seat!

So what?

Oh, BTW, that precious Leica you want to buy - to a "steet person" it looks like an everyday digial P&S! Nothing more.

Beauty (and value) is in the eye of the beholder - that Leica is a "plain Jane" compared to much cheaper digital P&S's!

Enjoy it and relax!!!

 

[Frank Granovski]

Fargo, ND is pretty safe. Love that little place. 😎

 

[ch1]

Fargo, ND is pretty safe. Love that little place. 😎

Kind of cold though, in a frigid kind of waY.

 

[shaaktiman]

Sounds good, here's my story then let's drop it.

I lived on the corner of La Salle and Main st., no one I know lived in Amherst unless they were in dorm rooms. South Campus is still active today and the Bethune art building down on Main street was still in use when I was there. It's true, people on the Amherst campus saw very little crime, but very few people chose to live within the confines of a dorm in the middle of a suburb past freshman year.

It's possible that Buffalo became somewhat worse after you left. I know that the crack epidemic in the 80's was particularly hard on some areas of the city, and I doubt whether Buffalo has experienced the same renaissance that NY has in the past 15 years. Nearly everyone I know from Buffalo has at least one hair raising story to tell, I have many friends who were held up at gunpoint right on main street within sight of South Campus. It isn't Camden or anything, but it really was pretty bad compared to NY.

I'm not really afraid of getting mugged in NY. I'm just not used to carrying such an expensive thing around with me all the time. I'd be able to enjoy my time with it more if I don't have to worry about losing it somewhere. I lost my first camera on a train in India, stolen right out of a bag I was curled up sleeping on top of. This one is getting insured.

Anyway, sorry for getting annoyed. Always nice to meet an alumni. 🙂