ampguy
Veteran
maybe it's evolved
maybe it's evolved
but as a Nihonjin, we use it for meaty flavoring, or glutamate, specifically.
BTW, I have a book that says dogs can and will eat all essential amino acids whether food is tasty or not, while cats will not necessarily do the same, but eat to get full or to satisfy taste only.
maybe it's evolved
but as a Nihonjin, we use it for meaty flavoring, or glutamate, specifically.
BTW, I have a book that says dogs can and will eat all essential amino acids whether food is tasty or not, while cats will not necessarily do the same, but eat to get full or to satisfy taste only.
ampguy
Veteran
It sure can be...
Gumby
Veteran
From what I've heard over the years, yes it is.
That certainly sums it up, and is a wonderful analogy.
ampguy
Veteran
it's an analogy
it's an analogy
but not a good one.
If you read the Zeiss and other articles on bokeh, you will understand it is qualitative, and quantitative. A lot of slide rules and now computers have been used at Leica, and other great lens companies specifically so they don't produce ugly bokeh...
it's an analogy
but not a good one.
If you read the Zeiss and other articles on bokeh, you will understand it is qualitative, and quantitative. A lot of slide rules and now computers have been used at Leica, and other great lens companies specifically so they don't produce ugly bokeh...
Juan Valdenebro
Truth is beauty
IMHO it's not a valid comparison in any way... Apart from being a pro photographer (work, career) I am a pro musician (work and career too, although I left both playing and composing for photography many years ago).
Music is an art that happens through a line of time, and when there's silence in music, it has an absolute effect: nothing balances with silence at the same time... In music silence is as important as music... Apart, silence is a part of the natural auditive surrounding we're used to.
Plastic arts, and especially those in two dimensions are not a journey through a timeline, and all their elements live together in a constant balance... And different and progressive levels of defocusing as seen on a photograph are not a natural part of our eyesight...
If you want to use music and sound for your comparison with bokeh, you should compare bokeh (secondary visual importance) and on focus subject (primary visual importance) with two auditive situations of different importance too... For example the noise an audience produces during a recorded concert... Of course that noise (shouts, singing, applause, etc...) must be carefully treated and softened for the mix before making a CD, and of course we all want that noise not to interfere with the music, and of course we can compare noises from different CDs or sound engineers to pick the ones we prefer... But what matters a lot more is the music, not the noise... Talking a lot about the noise would be overrating audience noise... Who is interested in bad music with a well treated audience noise?
Cheers,
Juan
DougFord
on the good foot
No, I’m speaking specifically about bokeh, per the treads topic.
The inherent DOF characteristics of any particular lens with regards to its OOF rendering is a given.
Neare
Well-known
If it's what the people want, give it to them.
Whatever. I know about computers being used to design optics. It makes it much easier to do the job than using the calculators, and before that - slide rules. My senior optical engineer told me so. Bokeh of a lens forms a large part of the image, and the bokeh of a particular lens is responsible for the frequency content of the out of focus portions of the image.
So I like the "Silence" analogy. If the visual content of the out-of-focus portion of the image is below the threshold for recognizing objects in that portion of the image, they will not detract from the main subject.
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Gumby
Veteran
(retracted) Roger is taking this one on, why should I butt in.
Roger Hicks
Veteran
crawdiddy
qu'est-ce que c'est?
I'm surprised that poll respondents are fairly evenly split on the original question. I expected many people would answer in the affirmative (overrated).
Juan Valdenebro
Truth is beauty
Just after my post I thought: "Damn! Bad music concerts with well treated audience noise it what sells a lot decades ago!" The comparison of bokeh and silence is a beautiful and poetical lie: I like it, but it's just too false to even enjoy it for long enough...
Cheers,
Juan
Juan Valdenebro
Truth is beauty
Keith
The best camera is one that still works!
It's not over rated and it has merit IMO. If the out of focus parts of an image are part of the photographer's over all concept and he/she wants them to look a particular way then how the lens being used renders these areas is important. I did some multiple exposure images recently where the primary exposure was focused and subsequent exposures were deliberately out of focus so how the out of focus was being rendered was important to me.
DougFord
on the good foot
An extreme case of anti-bokehism
http://www.americansuburbx.com/2009/05/theory-michael-fried-on-two-pictures-by.html
“To Wall's thinking, the resulting image is closer in feeling to ordinary vision, in which we are normally never conscious of objects nearer or farther away being blurred relative to those we are focusing on, as is often the case in photographs....(To achieve such evenness of focus requires the use of a computer to combine more than one image, which is why I didn't characterize the picture as a whole as an instance of straight photography.)” Michael Fried
http://www.americansuburbx.com/2009/05/theory-michael-fried-on-two-pictures-by.html
“To Wall's thinking, the resulting image is closer in feeling to ordinary vision, in which we are normally never conscious of objects nearer or farther away being blurred relative to those we are focusing on, as is often the case in photographs....(To achieve such evenness of focus requires the use of a computer to combine more than one image, which is why I didn't characterize the picture as a whole as an instance of straight photography.)” Michael Fried
Neare
Well-known
But bokeh makes people look more attractive doesn't it.
Juan Valdenebro
Truth is beauty
As another forum member said, if bokeh is an overrated concept, it doesn't mean it has no place at all... But it's secondary... Go get an image of Obama & Lewinsky and you'll see how many people comment on its bokeh...
I wouldn't care about which lens or bokeh I used if I got that image...Cheers,
Juan
Jack Conrad
Well-known
As another forum member said, if bokeh is an overrated concept, it doesn't mean it has no place at all... But it's secondary... Go get an image of Obama & Lewinsky and you'll see how many people comment on its bokeh...
Cheers,
Juan
Obama and Lewinsky? Noooooo! :bang: Cover their mugs with massive bokeh. Please...