ChrisN
Striving
Kodak article about x-ray damage, with examples.
http://www.kodak.com/global/en/service/tib/tib5201.shtml
http://www.kodak.com/global/en/service/tib/tib5201.shtml
Is this due to light leak?
- Thread starter fixbones
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fixbones
.......sometimes i thinks
ChrisN: Well i guess it could also be x-ray damage then..... ????
Both the 'damaged' rolls of film were taken from the middle of a brick (10 rolls) of Tri-X. No such problems with previous rolls.
Both the 'damaged' rolls of film were taken from the middle of a brick (10 rolls) of Tri-X. No such problems with previous rolls.
kzphoto
Well-known
I work at a lab in Santa Cruz and I've seen some x-ray damage. It exhibits a similar waviness but it isn't so focused.
I'm leaning towards x-Ray on this one.
I'm leaning towards x-Ray on this one.
Leigh Youdale
Well-known
X-Rays
X-Rays
I'm not very adept at attaching images but here's a scan of a proof sheet from a film that was damaged by checked baggage X-rays at Heathrow in 2006. You can see the banding that occurred diagonally across the images and the pattern that resulted from the exposed film being presented to the scanner head at an angle. It was unprocessed Delta 400.
I don't know if that helps at all - it doesn't look quite like what the OP has experienced but it's a pretty clear example of what x-rays can look like.
X-Rays
I'm not very adept at attaching images but here's a scan of a proof sheet from a film that was damaged by checked baggage X-rays at Heathrow in 2006. You can see the banding that occurred diagonally across the images and the pattern that resulted from the exposed film being presented to the scanner head at an angle. It was unprocessed Delta 400.
I don't know if that helps at all - it doesn't look quite like what the OP has experienced but it's a pretty clear example of what x-rays can look like.
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ChrisN
Striving
This is certainly an odd one for several reasons. The effect on the negs looks very much like x-ray damage, which can vary considerably depending on the angle at which the ray hits the roll of film. A wavy line often indicates an exposure across the roll but on a slight angle. As kzphoto said this is a very narrowly focused effect which is unusual. Also as you have said this is two rolls from a brick that has otherwise given good results, and from a shipment from which no other reports of damaged film have been received (mine was OK).
The M4 is a very reliable beast where light leaks are concerned, and I just can't imagine a leak that would cause the effect you have demonstrated. The only leak I've ever experienced was caused by changing lenses without shielding the camera from direct sunlight - light bouncing through the channel the shutter curtain rides in.
I'd grab a roll of C41 from the local supermarket (assuming they still have some - if not let me know and I can post you a roll 🙂 ) and run that through. With processing at the local 1-hour (again assuming this is available) you can be sure you are testing only the camera. Good luck! If it needs an overhaul don't let Adeal touch it!
The M4 is a very reliable beast where light leaks are concerned, and I just can't imagine a leak that would cause the effect you have demonstrated. The only leak I've ever experienced was caused by changing lenses without shielding the camera from direct sunlight - light bouncing through the channel the shutter curtain rides in.
I'd grab a roll of C41 from the local supermarket (assuming they still have some - if not let me know and I can post you a roll 🙂 ) and run that through. With processing at the local 1-hour (again assuming this is available) you can be sure you are testing only the camera. Good luck! If it needs an overhaul don't let Adeal touch it!
Bill58
Native Texan
If it were mine, I'd fire off an email to Jon Goodman, "the undisputed king of lightseal kits" and ask him. He's a frikkin genius at such sleuthing such problems and one super-nice guy. His email is jon_goodman at yahoo dot com
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sevo
Fokutorendaburando
Right - it positively looks like a narrow band of hard radiation that hit the film roll at a slightly offset angle. And I don't really believe it is some process gone wrong at the factory - even where these use radiation (Kodak do or did radiation sensitize some films) film manufacturers will hardly be fool enough to set up their emitter in close enough vicinity to already packed film rolls to fog anything.
Even if we can't figure out where, there is a almost unlimited number of opportunities nowadays where film might be x-ray fogged in transport - cargo scanning is not limited to passenger airplane luggage any more but is happening to mail and trucks at every border or transport hub.
wpb
Well-known
Looking at the samples of the entire film you included in your post you have a second streak in the rebate of the film near the sprocket holes; it is asily seen from the "TX" to the "28". It seems to follow the same contour of the first streak. Maybe this is a case of a film coating problem. You should carefully examine a few inches of a roll from the same brick... look in strong light at an angle and see if there are any irregularities to the emulsion (dull) side of the film. Does the streak run all the way from one end to the other? Do you still have the cassette from one of the faulty rolls? If you do, crack it open remove the film inside and examine for faults. Was this roll ever frozen/chilled? I have seen a weird effect on film keep cold then water condenses on the emulsion leaving marks.
Finder
Veteran
Well, developed my test roll today. Shot with and without lens, with and without half case.
Not looking good.
Your film could have been fogged somehow or your processor is making mistakes--the loading end of the processor is not light tight, for example. Wavy lines are not a film transport issue in the camera. There is also a slight density running along the sprocket holes.
Leigh Youdale
Well-known
You know, although we are doing a lot of "looks like" guessing here, have Kodak USA been asked about this? If it is a manufacturing fault it's likely they've seen it before and can provide an answer.
I only know a small amount about continuous coating but I can well imagine a bit of "gunk" accumulating in the emulsion feed or some other part of the mechanism and leaving a variable trail like a wick until it either fell off or was removed by an operator. Whilst at DuPont I heard about the use of "hickey pickers" to allow operators to remove such contaminants safely from continuous winders without running the risk of putting their hands in to pick out the offending item. If this is the case then the period of the wavelength would probably be determined by the length and flex of the "wick" and the speed of the sheet.
Could this be the "Hickey Effect"?
I only know a small amount about continuous coating but I can well imagine a bit of "gunk" accumulating in the emulsion feed or some other part of the mechanism and leaving a variable trail like a wick until it either fell off or was removed by an operator. Whilst at DuPont I heard about the use of "hickey pickers" to allow operators to remove such contaminants safely from continuous winders without running the risk of putting their hands in to pick out the offending item. If this is the case then the period of the wavelength would probably be determined by the length and flex of the "wick" and the speed of the sheet.
Could this be the "Hickey Effect"?
P
Pico
Guest
I put the whole strip in an overlay w/multiply and found that the pattern (the wave) repeats with very close matches across the frames. That is unusual in processing with reels and tanks, and given this is the first instance of the problem, I doubt it is a processing error.
There is a lot number on the box. See if the rolls are from the same lot. You might have a bad batch of film.
There is a lot number on the box. See if the rolls are from the same lot. You might have a bad batch of film.
fixbones
.......sometimes i thinks
Finished a roll of C41 yesterday and sent it in for developing. Hope work allows me to finish a little earlier today to go and pick it up.
The dealer replied. They are not sure what the problem is as well but are happy for me to send it it for them to diagnose and hopefully fix.
The dealer replied. They are not sure what the problem is as well but are happy for me to send it it for them to diagnose and hopefully fix.
fixbones
.......sometimes i thinks
The roll of Ilford XP2 that i shot came back ok.
Got the developer to scan as is. No signs of the wavy band.
At this point, the dealer has offered to have a look at the camera and fix the 'problem'. The offer a 6 month warranty.
What should I do? TO SEND OR NO TO SEND
I have 2 trips coming up and ut'll be really swell to bring this camera along.
Got the developer to scan as is. No signs of the wavy band.
At this point, the dealer has offered to have a look at the camera and fix the 'problem'. The offer a 6 month warranty.
What should I do? TO SEND OR NO TO SEND
I have 2 trips coming up and ut'll be really swell to bring this camera along.
wpb
Well-known
Was the film ever refrigerated/frozen?
fixbones
.......sometimes i thinks
Film always refrigerated
notraces
Bob Smith
That looks like xray damage to me. Did you mail order the film? Could have been passed through xray somewhere along the line. I've had exactly the same issue - after coming back from overseas...
notraces
Bob Smith
sevo
Fokutorendaburando
Yep, see the sample images from the Invision CTX 5500 Airport Baggage Scanner near the end for something quite similar...
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