Kiev 2a (Contax ii) weak/lazy/wimpy/consumptive shutter.

[Rudybustamante]

After spending several days reading all I can on the Kiev/Contax shutters, I'm still somewhat at a loss when it comes to diagnosing this problem.

Basically, the shutter is quiet, winding is smooth, everything sounds great. BUT, all the speeds seem slow - I've checked all speeds above 1/250 electronically using a crude tester (won't register enough to read 250/500th), and they're almost exactly a stop slow.

This I could compensate for, but the main problem is the shutter not closing fully on slower speeds. The curtains are weak, wimpy. On 1/25 or slower they take a second to engage the return latch (so if I wind too fast I leave the first curtain behind, or at least used to - the latch now engages as soon as I start turning the wind knob, with a soft 'click'). Occasionally, but increasingly regularly, the curtain doesn't even reach the bottom of the gate, it just runs out of steam a fifth of the way from the bottom. I know they're supposed to run slow, but this curtain is being ridiculous

I have another Kiev, an early model 4, that looks and sounds a lot snappier (however I'm worried about the curtain tension on that one, and will disassemble and clean it properly soon. Stuck a film in it after cleaning most of the massive amounts of mold and dried grease off of it, I was way too impatient to start using one of them!).

So my question is this: is this insufficient curtain tension, a weak spring, or just dirt in the mechanism?

The camera looks and feels lovely. Not ideal of course, the winding feels slightly harder (but not rougher) than my Fed-2 - understandable considering its complexity. I'd hate to overtension the springs, causing harder winding and putting undue stress on the ribbons.

BUT I've got a bit of an amateur setup, so a thorough Ronsonol/isopropinol cleaning and clock oil relubing might spoil the aesthetics/ feel of it/have a risk of migration. Plus I'd like to keep disassembly to a minimum. A more in-depth explanation of proper lubrication procedure for these cameras would be a lifesaver, everything I find seems to take it all as given. Bluntly, I have no idea *where* the lubricants are supposed to go, in what quantity, and what kinds to use. I've got watch oil, clock oil, lithium grease.


Any ideas guys? I'd love to get this figured out before cracking 'er open. Any help is much appreciated (also sorry for the masses of text, thought It'd pay to be thorough)

 

[Dez]

It is almost certain that your camera needs a CLA. The shutters of the Contax/Kiev cameras are extremely complex, and unfortunately there are many more gears that need to turn freely in the shutter train than in a Leica shutter, for example, where the shutter actuation is very well separated from the winding mechanism. When all is clean and freshly lubricated the Contax/Kiev shutter is a dream, but when things get gummy, the shutter slows down, until eventually the curtains won't latch together when released. Some folk will advocate the brute-force-and-ignorance method of increasing the spring tension to get around the problem, but this is really not a good idea. What it really needs is a proper CLA from someone who knows the camera well.

Disassembling the camera to get at and fully clean the gear trains is a fairly major undertaking, but there is a half-measures approach that will often do the trick, and requires only minor disassembly, and so is a DIY candidate. Let me know if you want to undertake that approach and I'll see if I can give some pointers.

Cheers,
Dez

 

[Rudybustamante]

Disassembling the camera to get at and fully clean the gear trains is a fairly major undertaking, but there is a half-measures approach that will often do the trick, and requires only minor disassembly, and so is a DIY candidate. Let me know if you want to undertake that approach and I'll see if I can give some pointers.

Cheers,
Dez

Thank you Dez

I actually already took on a similar job on my incredibly gummed up/mouldy Kiev 4. Managed to get it in working order, but I ended up using way too much oil. My plan is to finish off this roll, go back and flush it out with lighter fluid - ended up lubricating the slow speeds mechanism as well, which i've found out is a big no-no. it does seem to be functioning a lot better now though, qhich I see as an overall win considering its previous condition. My favourite part was 'flossing' the 2 elements of the rangefinder window with lens paper, to get rid of the mould.

So not too skittish about taking it apart - just something i want to avoid if the problem is tension. A professional CLA isn't ideal for me (for peace of mind/repair hobby/financial reasons. I hear horror stories about even the established names...)

i'm rather worried about shutter tensioning - want to preserve the ribbons, and just as importantly want the camera quiet and easy winding.

You quite certain it's just dried lubricant? I'd originally thought the same, but it just doesn't seem to me there's enough 'force' in the curtain. Gut feeling, I know. Don't know enough about these shutters' inner workings to tell for sure though, so deferred to RF's greater expertise.


If you could give me these tips I'd be very grateful