mfunnell
Shaken, so blurred
I've just received a Konica Auto S3 that I bought on eBay, and I must say I think I'm mildly miffed. The camera isn't really as described by the seller. He said its in great cosmetic condition, which it is to a point. The leatherette (or whatever) material on the back seems to be peeling off at both ends (with sticky glue residue clearly showing under the edges). On the other hand, the material itself seems undamaged. Otherwise the camera is in good cosmetic condition.
He said the camera is fully working. That seems to be so, mechanically, as the shutter and aperture all work at least well enough. However, the meter is underexposing by at least a stop, which he must have known about. In his auction he posted photos taken with the camera, and included the negatives when he shipped the camera. They're on ISO 100 film, and the meter on the camera was set to 200.
On opening the camera up, everything looks OK - except that the light seals look very dodgy indeed.
So I ran a roll of film through it. I compensated for the meter issue by using silver oxide batteries (1.55V makes the meter read a little higher) and added 2/3rds of a stop to the indicated film speed (shot ISO 200 film as ISO 320).
The light seals really aren't as they should be - look at the left side of this frame:
The lens will flare, but its really pretty good. This shot was pretty much a torture test, shot with the sun just above the top of the frame.
Its the only shot from the roll with really obvious flare. I'd say the lens is pretty good in this regard, and adding a lens hood would only make it better.
So, while I'm slightly put out by the condition of the camera (I payed close to top dollar plus as I was expecting a camera in really good condition) I think that overall its a nice little unit with what seems a very good lens. I can fix the light seals up without too much drama (I have a light seal kit I picked up to fix an Olympus XA which I knew needed it, and still need to get to). But I am disappointed with the meter. Because it underexposes, it further limits the speed of the film I can put through it (max ISO 800 effectively becomes 400).
If I'd paid less, or knew more about the condition of the camera before buying, I wouldn't be put out at all. I guess that's the "fun" of eBay. (Although, to be fair, most stuff I've bought that way has been better than described, so perhaps I've been spoiled by good luck.)
Anyway, I still think the little Auto S3 can take a nice photo:
Thanks to anybody who's bothered "listening" to me vent! And any suggestions about the meter would be very welcome.
...Mike
He said the camera is fully working. That seems to be so, mechanically, as the shutter and aperture all work at least well enough. However, the meter is underexposing by at least a stop, which he must have known about. In his auction he posted photos taken with the camera, and included the negatives when he shipped the camera. They're on ISO 100 film, and the meter on the camera was set to 200.
On opening the camera up, everything looks OK - except that the light seals look very dodgy indeed.
So I ran a roll of film through it. I compensated for the meter issue by using silver oxide batteries (1.55V makes the meter read a little higher) and added 2/3rds of a stop to the indicated film speed (shot ISO 200 film as ISO 320).
The light seals really aren't as they should be - look at the left side of this frame:
The lens will flare, but its really pretty good. This shot was pretty much a torture test, shot with the sun just above the top of the frame.
Its the only shot from the roll with really obvious flare. I'd say the lens is pretty good in this regard, and adding a lens hood would only make it better.
So, while I'm slightly put out by the condition of the camera (I payed close to top dollar plus as I was expecting a camera in really good condition) I think that overall its a nice little unit with what seems a very good lens. I can fix the light seals up without too much drama (I have a light seal kit I picked up to fix an Olympus XA which I knew needed it, and still need to get to). But I am disappointed with the meter. Because it underexposes, it further limits the speed of the film I can put through it (max ISO 800 effectively becomes 400).
If I'd paid less, or knew more about the condition of the camera before buying, I wouldn't be put out at all. I guess that's the "fun" of eBay. (Although, to be fair, most stuff I've bought that way has been better than described, so perhaps I've been spoiled by good luck.)
Anyway, I still think the little Auto S3 can take a nice photo:
Thanks to anybody who's bothered "listening" to me vent! And any suggestions about the meter would be very welcome.
...Mike
dazedgonebye
Veteran
I would write to the seller and explain your concerns re: condition. I would try not to be confrontational about it, but just explain that, although I like the camera, it doesn' t live up to its top dollar billing.
I'd then suggest a partial refund to get the price down to where I thought it should have been.
This has worked for me a couple of times. You never know.
I'd then suggest a partial refund to get the price down to where I thought it should have been.
This has worked for me a couple of times. You never know.
BillBingham2
Registered User
Mike,
First off, Congratulations on getting what I have thought was the best fixed lens camera out there. Now that is based upon never owning one, used one several times years ago at school and have read tons on that type of camera and the S3 specifically.
Secondly, I am sorry that another sell is, well, less than forthright about the condition of the camera. I think you can pick up seal kits at a reasonable price, new leatherette I think the same (perhaps bright red?). Not sure about who could adjust the meter to read right with the different battery. Perhaps an adapter might not be a bad idea. I thought that the S3 used a battery that was still available.
As Steve said, give it a shot. Worst they can say is to ask you to go a multiply with yourself and all. Have you given feed back yet? Perhaps more importantly, did they? Do not do anything to mess up your number on EvilBay. You might try dropping a note to EvilBay and see if you get an answer from a human or a computer. The sooner you do it, the better. Perhaps you do not do that till the seller provides you feedback.
Sadly, all of us it seems have gotten taken on EvilBay from time to time. I've had some wonderful experiences and a few bad ones. EvilBay just keeps getting bigger and bigger and never gets any better.
Good luck and if the sell lives in the Chicago area, let me know. Perhaps I can reach out to them......
B2 (;->
First off, Congratulations on getting what I have thought was the best fixed lens camera out there. Now that is based upon never owning one, used one several times years ago at school and have read tons on that type of camera and the S3 specifically.
Secondly, I am sorry that another sell is, well, less than forthright about the condition of the camera. I think you can pick up seal kits at a reasonable price, new leatherette I think the same (perhaps bright red?). Not sure about who could adjust the meter to read right with the different battery. Perhaps an adapter might not be a bad idea. I thought that the S3 used a battery that was still available.
As Steve said, give it a shot. Worst they can say is to ask you to go a multiply with yourself and all. Have you given feed back yet? Perhaps more importantly, did they? Do not do anything to mess up your number on EvilBay. You might try dropping a note to EvilBay and see if you get an answer from a human or a computer. The sooner you do it, the better. Perhaps you do not do that till the seller provides you feedback.
Sadly, all of us it seems have gotten taken on EvilBay from time to time. I've had some wonderful experiences and a few bad ones. EvilBay just keeps getting bigger and bigger and never gets any better.
Good luck and if the sell lives in the Chicago area, let me know. Perhaps I can reach out to them......
B2 (;->
ChrisPlatt
Thread Killer
With any used camera purchase, especially on eBay, I anticipate
the additional cost of CLA, new seals and battery modification.
In my experience these services are seldom not required...
Chris
the additional cost of CLA, new seals and battery modification.
In my experience these services are seldom not required...
Chris
Didier
"Deed"
Meter accuracy and light seals are a common issue with most of these 1960ies and 70ies compact cameras. It's possible it went down after 2000 so I wouldn't blame the seller too much. Buying used stuff by internet is risky by definition, so is ebay, too.
I had a Auto S3 years ago (Paid CHF 40 ($30) at the time) and found replacement light seals somewhere in the web. No original Konica seals but standard stripes to cut yourself. The meter was also off 1 stop, dont remember if +1 or -1.
Didier
I had a Auto S3 years ago (Paid CHF 40 ($30) at the time) and found replacement light seals somewhere in the web. No original Konica seals but standard stripes to cut yourself. The meter was also off 1 stop, dont remember if +1 or -1.
Didier
mfunnell
Shaken, so blurred
Thanks for the comments. I calmed down, looked at the listing from the seller and thought for a bit. Yes, the meter is off and the seller knew it. Yes, the leatherette on the back is lifting at the edges, and he knew that too. He may not have known about the light seal problem as that's iffy - it shows on some frames and not others.
To my mind, that leaves the seller not really directly being misleading, just not mentioning a couple of negative points. Certainly not something of much use in any kind of formal complaint, and probably not worth the hassle of creating bad blood with the seller.
Its still a nice little camera. I can fix the light seals easily enough (and will do that this weekend). The camera is workable with the meter as it is, so I'll live with that and perhaps do some research to find out if there's any easy way of fixing or adjusting it. I'll figure out what to do with the back cover some time, if it bugs me enough.
And I'll take some photos.
...Mike
To my mind, that leaves the seller not really directly being misleading, just not mentioning a couple of negative points. Certainly not something of much use in any kind of formal complaint, and probably not worth the hassle of creating bad blood with the seller.
Its still a nice little camera. I can fix the light seals easily enough (and will do that this weekend). The camera is workable with the meter as it is, so I'll live with that and perhaps do some research to find out if there's any easy way of fixing or adjusting it. I'll figure out what to do with the back cover some time, if it bugs me enough.
And I'll take some photos.
...Mike
NickTrop
Veteran
Whisper said:
Ditto that.
mfunnell
Shaken, so blurred
Actually, with the zinc air batteries it was out by about a stop-and-a-third. Putting alkalines in left it about a little over one stop out, and a silver oxide (which is what I'm using now) has it about two-thirds of a stop out which suits me best (silver oxides maintain their voltage better than alkalines and outlast zinc air).Whisper said:
...Mike
Bill58
Native Texan
If you buy a 30 to 40 yr. old camera, I hardly think you can find it in pristine condition unless it was locked in a vault somewhere. The flaws you describe are not major ones and repairable w/ some work on your part. BTW--the going rate for a perfect one after a CLA is over $200.
mfunnell
Shaken, so blurred
Didn't I say that somewhereBill58 said:
The point being that, based on the representations of the seller, I didn't pay too far off that. Caveat Emptor, I know, but surely I'm allowed a minor amount of venting?Bill58 said:
...Mike
NickTrop
Veteran
Bill58 said:
I have never gotten an old camera from eBay that didn't need work. I know some have but it's a real rarity IMO. I resign myself to getting them repaired or CLA'd and build it in to the budget, or purchase only ones that have been pre-CLA'd by a reputable eBayer. I don't even get angry about it.
I don't have a zillion cameras like many here. But every one of my cameras is a true user - repaired/CLA to nearly new condition.
Incidentally, I've mentioned this before... I bought a "perfect" Konica Auto S3, new light seals, battery adjusted, CLA'd for $90 on eBay. It was from a camera repair company. The $90 reserve put off bidders so I got me a steal. I watched a lot of S3 auctions, and see them go for well over $100 in "as is" condition from sellers who claim they "don't know anything about cameras" because of low or no reserves resulting in bidding wars. That one I'll never get.
Anyway, have fun with the S3. Wonderful camera imo. Perfect street shooter, great glass.
BillBingham2
Registered User
Nick's approach is not bad, but $90 for a good working S3 is a GREAT DEAL! I've been burned by EvilBay several times on things that were described as mint and were, well, crappy. When I do start up growing my collection of users again (say about two years), I am going to look to places that fix cameras for good users or here in the Advertisements. I've had GREAT luck from folks here. While I know I will pay more than EvilBay up front, I know in the end I will get what I am paying for and perhaps a bit more.
B2 (;->
B2 (;->
Benfidar
Newbie
Top dollar?
Top dollar?
I have never seen a Auto s3 sell for top dollar on ebay for just the same reasons as cited above. Greg Weber the Konica guru told me that he sells them between $300 and $400. Big bucks maybe for ebay, but not for one in good shape sold privately. I don't think that the ones that actually work ever show up on ebay, just the crap. You could pay $100 or so, have crappy pictures because the rf is out of adjustment (nearly always the case with a 30 YO camera) and then spend $200 getting it CLA'd so that it works like it did when it was new, or just buy one that works from the start. It will last more than a year, the RF is adjusted, you can actually see out of the VF and a thousand other things that go wrong with these little gems. On your seals, hey, they all need to be replaced save for the ones from the '50s that are made of jute, they will outlast you! Just get a $6 kit and some Q-tips and have at it.
I love mine, but like all things that sit in my china cabinet for long unused I may sell. I have one of the extremely rare original chrome examples sold less than one year and only on the Japanese home market. The elusive c35 fd. Completely CLA'd by Greg Weber who told me that this is the only one he had ever seen in person. Email me if you are interested and I will take some digipix, I think that a correct price for this one would be between $450-$600.
Ric
Top dollar?
I have never seen a Auto s3 sell for top dollar on ebay for just the same reasons as cited above. Greg Weber the Konica guru told me that he sells them between $300 and $400. Big bucks maybe for ebay, but not for one in good shape sold privately. I don't think that the ones that actually work ever show up on ebay, just the crap. You could pay $100 or so, have crappy pictures because the rf is out of adjustment (nearly always the case with a 30 YO camera) and then spend $200 getting it CLA'd so that it works like it did when it was new, or just buy one that works from the start. It will last more than a year, the RF is adjusted, you can actually see out of the VF and a thousand other things that go wrong with these little gems. On your seals, hey, they all need to be replaced save for the ones from the '50s that are made of jute, they will outlast you! Just get a $6 kit and some Q-tips and have at it.
I love mine, but like all things that sit in my china cabinet for long unused I may sell. I have one of the extremely rare original chrome examples sold less than one year and only on the Japanese home market. The elusive c35 fd. Completely CLA'd by Greg Weber who told me that this is the only one he had ever seen in person. Email me if you are interested and I will take some digipix, I think that a correct price for this one would be between $450-$600.
Ric
Bill58
Native Texan
A CLA'd S3 for $300-400? Somebody would have to be crazy to pay that kind of money if you ask me. I don't have that much GAS....or money.
smileyguy
Established
Benfidar, there's some more incentive for me! I have been thinking of selling my Auto S3 for a while now not being sure if I would get some decent coin. Not that I would expect $300-400 but with the extras that I have (filter set, case, Metz flash, original manuals) it might be worth posting here or on eaby. If anyone is interested after following this thread feel free to contact me before I post it to eaby.