Kugellager or ? Kinda suspicious

[radiocemetery]

Take a look at this from that auction site on a 3 day auction. Seller has feedback of 7. Not very good pictures. What do you think? Where are you Tom and Leo B.?

Steve

http://cgi.ebay.com/WWII-Leica-IIIc...ryZ30030QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

 

[xayraa33]

Well , the pics look better than the Luftwaffe Eigentum KMZ auction ones.
something like that you would like to see in person.

 

[LeicaTom]

Hmm I`m running the number now - it may fit into a production lot of Civilian cameras from 1943?

Really bad photos 🙁

Tom

 

[radiocemetery]

let us know.

 

[Rob-F]

I don't see why they included a picture of a chrome-finished Leica which has nothing to do with the Kugellager (it isn't one). The wording that accompanies it is unpolished. As for the gray finished one, isn't the K engraved too large?

 

[Matthew Allen]

Tom,

Do you see fakes of stepped rewind IIIcs? I know that practically everything Barnack related gets faked, but the stepped rewind would be hard to do convincingly. Of course, that doesn't necessarily mean the paint job is original...

Matthew

 

[colyn]

As for the gray finished one, isn't the K engraved too large?

The "K" was factory engraved larger than the numbers.

 

[colyn]

Tom,

Do you see fakes of stepped rewind IIIcs? I know that practically everything Barnack related gets faked, but the stepped rewind would be hard to do convincingly. Of course, that doesn't necessarily mean the paint job is original...

Matthew

The photos do in fact show a real Leica IIIc.

 

[Matthew Allen]

The photos do in fact show a real Leica IIIc.

I know, I meant fakes in the sense of real Leicas dressed up to give them false provenance, not fakes in the sense of decorated Zorkis and FEDs.

My question was has anyone ever turned a regular IIIc into a stepped rewind IIIc?

Matthew

 

[LeicaTom]

Tom,

Do you see fakes of stepped rewind IIIcs? I know that practically everything Barnack related gets faked, but the stepped rewind would be hard to do convincingly. Of course, that doesn't necessarily mean the paint job is original...

Matthew

Yes, fake black and fake grey one`s I`ve seen both, there`s all kinds out there who try to make a buck on a $300 camera with a paintjob - there were also some *blanko* Leica IIIC "Stepper" tops floating around about a year ago, but I`m sure all the forgers got their hands on them 🙁

The only way you can really find seriously REAL and ORIGINAL "wartime" Leica gear is to see that it came from a ex- servicemen/woman`s estate, that`s where all the TOP quality gear is coming from now, for example that ultra rare 1940`s Black Paint Summarex that sold the other night on evilbay for $4,600
- was a WW2 American GI "Bringback"

Tom

 

[Matthew Allen]

Is the lens mounted on the camera the Summaron though? From the top and bottom views it looks like a different lens.

Matthew

 

[radiocemetery]

Chippy, I agree. This auction stinks like three day old fish.

 

[landsknechte]

Interesting... The seller cancelled the auction.

 

[landsknechte]

Sellers can pull items, and they're supposed to provide a reason to eBay. Of course, there's no way to verify that he didn't tell eBay that he dropped the camera, and then sold it on the side - thus dodging fees and any protection the buyer might have. That happens quite often in certain collectible circles there.

 

[landsknechte]

tar thanks for the info..all these little things help bring me up to speed and almost as aware as the rest of you LOL. still now it only makes me curious what those 'certain collectable circles' are 🙂

Third Reich militaria / memorabilia comes to mind right off the bat, where auctions are liable to disappear at any moment due to eBay's ban on the stuff. The more unique and high end the collectible is, especially if the value might not be readily apparent to an uneducated seller, the more likely that sort of thing is to occur.

 

[LeicaTom]

The camera was`nt banned or anything, I secured this camera this past weekend and bought it through private sale- it is a real IIICK
*ohh and it`s perfectly legal to END an auction early at ebay, you just have to give them an explanation *

It`s getting a full CLA and will be completely taken down and photographed for documentation for research purposes

Tom

PS: I`m thankful to have been able to keep this camera together and intact with all of it`s history - lot`s of horny dealers were after this one, ready to break up the lens and put it up for sale for a crazy price, luckily it will serve a keen purpose and won`t end up collecting dust in someone`s cabinet, this camera`s going to be a user! 😀

 

[radiocemetery]

Glad you got this Tom. I thought the camera I referred to in the original post of this thread and the ones you posted recently in the Kugellager thread were the same. I still have the bay ad. bookmarked and couldn't help but notice the serial number match except for your XXs. Be sure to post some pics when available.
BTW I have a Summar on the way for my IIIb and Canon IIf. Hope to be able to use it at a hotrod show this weekend. Bought the Summar on your recommendation and the results of others posted here at RFF.

Steve

 

[LeicaTom]

Glad you got this Tom. I thought the camera I referred to in the original post of this thread and the ones you posted recently in the Kugellager thread were the same. I still have the bay ad. bookmarked and couldn't help but notice the serial number match except for your XXs. Be sure to post some pics when available.
BTW I have a Summar on the way for my IIIb and Canon IIf. Hope to be able to use it at a hotrod show this weekend. Bought the Summar on your recommendation and the results of others posted here at RFF.

Steve

Hello Steve,

Yes, this is the same one, I paid a very fair price for it, (the gentleman who owned it was 85 years young - and very happy about the money , but also that it went someplace where it`s history will be documented)
The vulcanite on it was almost 100% intact, but a piece shattered off it after I brought it home, this material is very unstable and will have to be glued to the body shell, once the CLA is done - it`s a near mint paint camera, but it`s had use, the shutter had film chips in it that`s why it`s gone to CLA, it`s going to be a user - completely documented for the book Leo B and I are planing, I`m pretty sure it`s the FIRST IIIC K that`s being taken down and photographed fully since 1945, it will be a great help to the collectors

The days of finding cameras this good and complete with a known history with like 3 owners since 1943 are getting fewer and fewer

You won`t go wrong with the Summar, great little lens, I`m still looking for a late 1939 issue "uncoated" and in feet to add to my IIIC K kit

Ciao!

Tom

 

[john neal]

Tom,

I have some big pieces of original 1940's vulcanite that could be cut to patch damage - including some curved pieces. let me know if you would like some via PM and I'll shoot them over to you, carefully wrapped in a strong box.

 

[LeicaTom]

Tom,

I have some big pieces of original 1940's vulcanite that could be cut to patch damage - including some curved pieces. let me know if you would like some via PM and I'll shoot them over to you, carefully wrapped in a strong box.

John,

Drop me an email and I`ll shoot you back the photos of the damage, it`s on the film advance dial corner side by the strap lug, so it`s a slightly curved part - *pain in the a***- but that`s what the real old vulcanite does and this camera`s NOT going to be a Museum paperweight, but a user 🙂 so cracked repaired vulcanite is`nt a big deal, I`m not ever selling this one I think.....

Thanks a million

Tom