Leica 21mm. Grey vs. USA warranty

Hi David,

Thanks for the taking the time to do those detailed samples. The lens still seems a little soft to me. What are your thoughts?

Cheers,

Sean
 
The lens does look a little soft. OTOH I have no other 21mm in M mount or LTM to directly compare it to. So I don't know if I'm seeing less snap from the lens than I'd like or simply the effect of the sensor's anti-aliasing filter. At any rate the Kobalux/R-D1 combo can resolve detail I can just see in an 8x12" print if I stick my nose against the paper. Since I rarely print larger this will do for now. We'll see how the new Zeiss 21mm performs once it's available. Or how the old Zeiss 21mm does if the converted-Kiev-mount project works out.

Here's another comparison, this time between the center crop at f/4 and f/11, unprocessed and processed with a USM action I often use for web-sized images. The action applies low radius, medium amount USM to image edges.

http://home.twmi.rr.com/davesden/Graphics/21Kobalux_compare04.jpg

The f/11 shot crispens up quite nicely. The individual bricks in the chimney are barely visible in an 8x12" print. I'll see how it looks at 12x18".

IMO to judge the lens' performance wide open and at f/4 I'll need to shoot something at closer range.

-Dave-
 
Detail certainly comes in with USM but the softness isn't the AA filter. I was looking at so many lens samples doing that CV & Leica lens article that it became a little dizzying but some lenses were very distinctly sharper than others (suggesting that the AA filter is unlikely to be the culprit). The Leica 21 ASPH is extremely sharp, for example. Thanks again for the tests.

Cheers,

Sean
 
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Sean, I'm certainly not questioning that some lenses are sharper than others. :) I just don't know, other than my experience with this one lens, how the 21mm focal length performs on the R-D1. I've used the Kobalux on Leica & Bessa bodies with very good results, better results than I've seen so far with the R-D1, so I'm not yet ready to fault it. We shall see...

-Dave-
 
Hi David,

I didn't write my last reply very carefully - my apologies for stating the obvious (busy weekend - need more sleep). What I should have said more clearly is that the issue probably can't be the AA filter because some lenses on the R-D1 give very sharp files. I'm quite interested in the Kobalux but was hoping for it to be sharper. Of course, another example might be and I'd love to try one. I have a real soft spot for sleeper lenses. I put up some of those 100% Kobalux files in PS next to files made with the Leica 21 (at similar apertures) and the differences were pronounced. It's nice that the Kobalux doesn't vignette much though. The cost is very attractive as well.

Cheers,

Sean
 
David Kieltyka said:
The lens does look a little soft. OTOH I have no other 21mm in M mount or LTM to directly compare it to. .....I can just see in an 8x12" print if I stick my nose against the paper. Since I rarely print larger this will do for now. We'll see how the new Zeiss 21mm performs once it's available.

Here's another comparison, this time between the center crop at f/4 and f/11, unprocessed and processed with a USM action I often use for web-sized images. The action applies low radius, medium amount USM to image edges.

IMO to judge the lens' performance wide open and at f/4 I'll need to shoot something at closer range.

-Dave-
Click to expand...

Dave,
Thanks for your further samples. Yes without another 21mm (which is my case as well) its difficult to judge properly.

I had brought your original 100% samples into Photoshop and applied what looks like a similar amount of USM. f/11 certainly looks good enough as I tend to make prints of a similar size to you and its the printed results at the sizes I make that count for me. The f/4 result you just posted does look a little soft though, but then I wouldn't be photographing buildings across the street as a subject at this sort of aperture. As its difficult to post meaningful samples of things shot at a closer range whats your overall impression of results at f/2.8 & f/4 in the print sizes you make for closer subjects, mainly people.

I can see why Sean thinks the quality of the Leica 21mm asp is hard to beat, especially if you need/want to use the lens wide open, but I think it's hard for me to meet the price ticket even at 'Grey Import' prices in the U.K. so I need to find something cheaper. The Kobalux in its various versions may of course be hard to find here now.

The large 'Focus on Imaging' show takes place in the U.K. at the end of this month and hopefully there may be a sample of the new Zeiss 21mm that I can try.
 
Jim, I confess I haven't taken any people pics with the Kobalux. In the 35mm format I've always liked the 35 or 40mm focal length for out & about people shots. With the Canon APS-C format D-SLRs (10D, 20D) I've been using a 24mm, which gives coverage in the same range. On the R-D1 I've used a 28mm (the CV Ultron), which gives a slightly narrower view but one that still works well. And I've used the 40mm Summicron-C a lot too. It's my favorite lens on the R-D1. 21mm is a "tweener" focal length for me on the R-D1. I find the 15mm Heliar to be a more suitable wide companion for both the 28 & 40mm. I have my eye on the upcoming CV 18mm.

-Dave-
 
Dave,
I would regard the 21mm too wide for this sort of subject matter myself in the 35mm format and thats why I have never really felt the need to get one. Most of my photographs on my M4 (probably about 80%) are taken with the 35mm Summicron. Over the years I have "got my eye in" for this frame and know exactly where the frame lines are going to fall before I raise the camera to my eye, so this is my ideal. On the R-D1 with the 1.53 factor this of course = 53mm and so I am having to think about framing a bit more. I have the CV 25mm (=38mm) but this is f/4 and zone focusing only, not a problem in good light where I prefer to use hyper/zone focusing, but not eaisily useable at lower light levels even with the 1600iso of the R-D1. I think I am going to get the CV Ultron that you have and Sean highly reccommends as this seems very good value. I am waiting for my dealer to get one in for me to try at the moment. This has the advantage that the R-D1 has the frame lines built in (although a little tight for me as an eyeglass wearer) but it still maybe a little long for me at 42mm equivalent. A 21mm (=32mm) is a little wider than my ideal but has the advantage of a little more depth of field.

I have a 20D although it has not seen much use since I brought the R-D1 and with the 17 - 85mm EFS I seem always to be between about 22 & 26mm. I suppose I should sell the CV 25mm and buy a 24mm Leica Asp? Descisions, Descisions.
 
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