Leica 75mm Summilux vs. 75mm Summicron

[Ororaro]

On an R-D1, I can't focus a 90mm f2.8 lens with any degree of dependability. I can focus the 75mm f2.5 Summarit, though.

/T

This is odd! Altough Leica didn't design the Epson Camera's rangefinder, I think it's irrelevant to talk about it and its short base. But if you insist...

If you use both lenses on a rd-1 and focus on a subject 10 feet away, the difference in DOF is only 0.12 feet (0.53 feet Versus 0.41). This is such a small difference that I doubt you would see a difference in real life.

If you don't get a dependable focus with your 90 and yet you are always in focus with your 75mm lens, the one and only reason is that your 90mm lens is miscalibrated.

 

[cmogi10]

This is odd! Altough Leica didn't design the Epson Camera's rangefinder, I think it's irrelevant to talk about it and its short base. But if you insist...

If you use both lenses on a rd-1 and focus on a subject 10 feet away, the difference in DOF is only 0.12 feet (0.53 feet Versus 0.41). This is such a small difference that I doubt you would see a difference in real life.

If you don't get a dependable focus with your 90 and yet you are always in focus with your 75mm lens, the one and only reason is that your 90mm lens is miscalibrated.

But remember it's a crop sensor so DOF changes 😉

 

[MCTuomey]

This is odd! Altough Leica didn't design the Epson Camera's rangefinder, I think it's irrelevant to talk about it and its short base. But if you insist...

If you use both lenses on a rd-1 and focus on a subject 10 feet away, the difference in DOF is only 0.12 feet (0.53 feet Versus 0.41). This is such a small difference that I doubt you would see a difference in real life.

If you don't get a dependable focus with your 90 and yet you are always in focus with your 75mm lens, the one and only reason is that your 90mm lens is miscalibrated.

Not to put too fine a point on it, but I disagree ... a lot. My experience with both the 75/1.4, 75/2, and 90/2.8 on a Bessa and an M7 is different. I think the facts are best interpreted this way (all data at 10 ft & wide open):

1. On a RD-1, the cron gives 40% more focus cushion (.42/.3) vs the lux. Same for the 90/2.8. The summarit gives 77% (.53/.3) more focus cushion than the lux.

2. In 35mm format, the cron also yields 40% more focus cushion than the lux (.63/.45). About the same for the 90/2.8 And the summarit over the lux gives you, again, about 77% (.8/.45) more cushion.

(Carl is right, I believe. The DOF increases by 50% when you move to 35mm from the 1.5x crop factor of the RD-1, making its comparatively short baseline even more of a factor in focus capability.)

At any rate, my experience is that I could not focus the 75/1.4 wide open on a Bessa reliably, but could do so with a 90/2.8, a 75.2.5, and the 75/2. I can focus all of them on my M7, but feel more confident with the latter three lenses than the Lux.

Then again, I'm 53 and my eyes aren't what they used to be ... and they weren't too brilliant then.

I know I'll probably sell the 75/2 and revert to shorter lenses as aging takes its toll. I do like the 75-90 focal length though. That Summarit is looking ever more attractive: size, weight, handling.

 

[Ororaro]

But remember it's a crop sensor so DOF changes 😉

😱 hEH!😱

I know what is DOF and how it changes. The original question (some weeks ago) was if a 50mm lens still has its DOF marks accurate if used on a M8 (from a M6). The answer to that question was an obvious YES. And from there the whole fight started with everybody chiming in. And of coursde, the original question was quickly discarded from the conversation.

In this particular case, I calculated DOF on a 1.5 crop sensor directly from dof calculator website.

 

[Ororaro]

OK now, what did I say that you disagree with? Honestly, be honest! There's nothing to disagree with. You like the numbers? I showed the numbers. So what now?

Besides, you're saying the summilux is harder to focus then the Cron... How can I disagree?

And let's not forget the 75 summilux appears to have been shipped with severe front focusing issues.

Not to put too fine a point on it, but I disagree ... a lot. My experience with both the 75/1.4, 75/2, and 90/2.8 on a Bessa and an M7 is different. I think the facts are best interpreted this way (all data at 10 ft & wide open):

1. On a RD-1, the cron gives 40% more focus cushion (.42/.3) vs the lux. Same for the 90/2.8. the summarit gives 77% (.53/.3) more focus cushion than the lux.

2. In 35mm format, the cron also yields 40% more focus cushion than the lux (.63/.45). About the same for the 90/2.8 And the summarit over the lux gives you, again, about 77% (.8/.45) more cushion.

My experience is that I could not focus the 75/1.4 wide open on a Bessa reliably, but could do so with a 90/2.8, a 75.2.5, and the 75/2. I can focus all of them on my M7, but feel more confident with the latter three lenses than the Lux.

Then again, I'm 53 and my eyes aren't what they used to be ... and they weren't too brilliant then.

I know I'll probably sell the 75/2 and revert to shorter lenses as aging takes its toll. I do like the 75-90 focal length though. That Summarit is looking ever more attractive: size, weight, handling.

 

[cmogi10]

😱 hEH!😱

I know what is DOF and how it changes. The original question (some weeks ago) was if a 50mm lens still has its DOF marks accurate if used on a M8 (from a M6). The answer to that question was an obvious YES. And from there the whole fight started with everybody chiming in. And of coursde, the original question was quickly discarded from the conversation.

In this particular case, I calculated DOF on a 1.5 crop sensor directly from dof calculator website.

Hah I'm just busting your chops, I saw that thread and stayed far from it,
most of that crazy **** goes over my head anyway.

 

[irq506]

Was there ever such thing as a 75 'lux ASPH?

 

[cmogi10]

Nope, but if your a fan of the rumor mill I've heard speculation of a new 75 lux....

😱

(I'm not a fan of the rumor mill but I do enjoy reading those loooooooong threads on LUF about the R10 and it's 50 MP sensor 😛)

 

[pfoto]

Indeed!
But this isn't a classic combination, maybe mostly due to the fact that Leica never really cared to add good 75mm framelines. None in the M3, laughable in the M4-P and shady in the M7.

Nonetheless, I still like my 75 Summilux.

Well I don't know what would be a "classic" combination, but I take my 75 on a 0.85x M and a 35 on a 0.72x M, or a 50 on the 0.85x and a 28 on the 0.72x and those combinations work for me. That's all I know.

 

[BigSteveG]

The 75 'lux is somewhat beastly, but a real "signature" lens if you can deal with it. Great boke and texture to the images. The addition of 1.25 magnifier (on top of my 0.85 VF) helps w/ focus. I still have issues with it, but can't let it go because I get a real sweet image once in a while. Not real sharp wide open. But that's the point.

 

[Tuolumne]

This is odd! Altough Leica didn't design the Epson Camera's rangefinder, I think it's irrelevant to talk about it and its short base. But if you insist...

If you use both lenses on a rd-1 and focus on a subject 10 feet away, the difference in DOF is only 0.12 feet (0.53 feet Versus 0.41). This is such a small difference that I doubt you would see a difference in real life.

If you don't get a dependable focus with your 90 and yet you are always in focus with your 75mm lens, the one and only reason is that your 90mm lens is miscalibrated.

Why is it irrelevant to talk about the R-D1? Lots of people here use it, and it's the only digital RF alternative to the M8. Plus, it's a great camera. Leica didn't design most of the cameras we talk about on RFF.

My 90mm f2.8 might need recalibrating. It's an M-Hexanon, so Leica won't do it. Where do you send lenses that need recalibration?

/T

 

[ferider]

The 75 lux is THE Leitz lens with most shallow DOF - 1cm at close focus.
I find it difficult to focus even on my M6 and always use a magnifier.

I wish M3s had 75mm framelines ...

But then you can always stop it down. And at infinity everything is in focus 🙂

And a great signature. And not so big really. For example significantly smaller than the 90/2 v1 or v2,
and many people use this one, too.

Roland.

 

[furcafe]

DAG, Sherry, Focal Point, the usual suspects.

My 90mm f2.8 might need recalibrating. It's an M-Hexanon, so Leica won't do it. Where do you send lenses that need recalibration?

/T

 

[MCTuomey]

OK now, what did I say that you disagree with? Honestly, be honest! There's nothing to disagree with. You like the numbers? I showed the numbers. So what now?

Besides, you're saying the summilux is harder to focus then the Cron... How can I disagree?

And let's not forget the 75 summilux appears to have been shipped with severe front focusing issues.

Right, I should be clearer. I disagree that there is no real life difference in focussing the lenses mentioned. I also don't agree that miscalibration is the only explanation for finding the 75/2.5 easier to focus than the 90/2.8.

But my points are too fine. The Lux is harder to focus; hard to disagree there. I'm just trying to suggest that the other lenses are quite a bit easier to focus, more than your absolute numbers suggest.

Anyway, after awhile extremely close, shallow DOF exercises tend to go stale. As I get older I'm more and more liking deeper DOF for portraits - the more classic look, I guess - that f2.8-4 or even f5.6 can give at typical distances.

Which a lot of less expensive lenses can provide ... 😉

 

[cmogi10]

The 75 lux is THE Leitz lens with most shallow DOF - 1cm at close focus.
I find it difficult to focus even on my M6 and always use a magnifier.

I wish M3s had 75mm framelines ...

But then you can always stop it down. And at infinity everything is in focus 🙂

And a great signature. And not so big really. For example significantly smaller than the 90/2 v1 or v2,
and many people use this one, too.

Roland.

If the MP-3 had only the 35-50-75 lines I would sell an arm and a leg and a kidney for it 😀

 

[thomasw_]

I have a very long term plan to obtain the 75 summilux spherical beastie, but for me the lux 50 asph is one lens for which there is no substitute. take that remark from its source, though, as I am a hardcore 25-35-50 focal length man, as the 50 is so versatile in my experience 🙂 A good 75 comparison thread, I recall from here.

 

[Tuolumne]

If the MP-3 had only the 35-50-75 lines I would sell an arm and a leg and a kidney for it 😀

I'm sure you can have the 90mm lines replaced with 75mm. Now, where was that kidney? 😀

/T

 

[BigSteveG]

"If the MP-3 had only the 35-50-75 lines I would sell an arm and a leg and a kidney for it "

Why not order an MP 0.85 and have the appropo framelines removed?

 

[jackal2513]

the 75 lux is for people who can and like to take a good picture

the cron is for bragging rights and if you want to bang on and on about sharpness and shoot brick walls and stuff

 

[rodneyAB]

If the MP-3 had only the 35-50-75 lines I would sell an arm and a leg and a kidney for it 😀

...iffen you sell that arm,..and that leg,...your gonna have a hard time useing the mp3 and lux😀