Leica M9 Special Warning

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tom.w.bn said:
You lose the photos in the buffer, not everything on the card. That sounds like it can be fixed in the software. I wouldn't have a problem with that because I never experienced that the buffer on my M8 might be too small. Slow shooter, you know.
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Yes.. the problem seems to be in the interface how the camera talks to the card. There are some tests that seem to verify this in this thread:

http://www.l-camera-forum.com/leica-forum/leica-m9-forum/193430-sd-card-tests-without-m9.html

The Leica forum is also arranging a test with Leica for SDCard compatibility:

http://www.l-camera-forum.com/leica-forum/leica-m9-forum/194059-sd-card-testing.html
 
250swb said:
gillavi said:
250swb said:
You are either extremely unlucky with two identically faulty cameras, it is a user error, or a firmware glitch that only affects you. You should be ashamed to call for a general avoidance of the M9 [...]
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[...]You should be a shame to write in this language. I assume you one of this other rich oldies that never really took any pictures with is camera [...]
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Well there is a link to some photo's right at the end of each of my posts. The fact that you didn't bother to see if I took any photo's [...] Good luck getting it sorted out.
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I suggest you guys keep it civil. What do you think?
 
tom.w.bn said:
The expectation that a manufacturer informs customers of problems that might happen is ridiculous. There are numerous users of M8/M9 that have zero problems including me with my M8. I'd only expect an active warning/information if an error might be dangerous for the user.
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No, it's not ridiculous at all. It's a basic function of two variables, the probability of occurrence, and the expected damage. Car manufacturers do recalls all the time because of problems that might happen, even if the problem has a low probability of occurrence and never actually happened to anyone. I am typing this an a laptop for which there was a recall because there was a very low probability that the battery might burst into flame. (Very nice, got me a free new battery after a year and a half.)

Now the difference is obviously that images lost on a photo shoot won't kill or injure you, so they're somewhat lower on the drama scale. However, I think we are in agreement that damages are bad if you're a professional and it happens to your tool. If you're a manufacturer and you want to be professional and you want to sell a tool to professionals, which Leica does, you better take your users' problems seriously, even if these problems don't happen to all of them.
 
rxmd said:
Now the difference is obviously that images lost on a photo shoot won't kill or injure you, so they're somewhat lower on the drama scale. However, I think we are in agreement that damages are bad if you're a professional and it happens to your tool. If you're a manufacturer and you want to be professional and you want to sell a tool to professionals, which Leica does, you better take your users' problems seriously, even if these problems don't happen to all of them.
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When there is a chance of "loss of life" then immediate information is necessary. When there is a chance of "loss of comfort" then you try to minimize the risk of a "misaligned reputation". I think informing everyone is a greater risk for your company than handling the real problems of a handful of users after they occurred while you work on a real solution for the problem. That's my point of view from the perspective of a producer.

Edit: and I'd love to have the M9 despite all the problems around.
 
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tom.w.bn said:
When there is a chance of "loss of life" then immediate information is necessary. When there is a chance of "loss of comfort" then you try to minimize the risk of a "misaligned reputation". I think informing everyone is a greater risk for your company than handling the real problems of a handful of users after they occurred while you work on a real solution for the problem.
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I agree completely... but you should do at least either 🙂
 
As far as I know, Leica is trying to take more software in-house.But that was just a concusion from a chance remark that I may be misremembering anyway.

Cheers,

R.
 
my experience, fwiw, 2 M8s and 1 M9: using Sandisk 8gb extreme pro, 4gb extreme cards, and some old Apacer 1 gb cards (backup/spares), zero issues. the M9 does seem to write more slowly to the card after the latest firmware update, but not significantly so (was slow originally). no problems in play mode, deleting, downloading, etc. i do reformat the card in camera after downloading via card reader.
 
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I had these issues when i first got my M9, but all my issues were user error... I was just too impatient with the writing speed of the M9. Once I realized that the M9 is just super slow and I have to give it time to write, it has been perfect.
 
Leica,Sandisk and Jenoptik are on the case. It is an intermittent problem and vast majority of cameras is not affected. However, the cause will hopefully soon be found and fixed.
 
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Hi guys,

Thank you for the sympathy. I believe in all my heart that if Leica produces professional cameras it has a responsibility for it's users. Canon for example was doing recall as soon as they found the problem with the 1DMKIII focusing system. Problem that they acknowledged since day one.

Some people here, on or two, that seems to get money or other kins of satisfaction from Leica try to blame me. I don't believe that anyone could even imagine that two different M9 camera will crash like that with different cards that was recommended by the Leica dealer after speaking to Leica rep on the phone.

The major photo shoot was after a week and a half of shooting with the camera for personal use. During this trial time one card crashed and the Leica dealer said it cannot under any circumstances be a camera issue but only card. As I found out later, it was a camera issue.

I'm warning fellow photographers not because I want to hurt Leica but because I don't like Leica to hurt any other photographers. I reshot everything on the same day, but what will happen tomorrow to another pro photographer that will go ahead and shoot some moment that will never comeback? For a client who will never hire him again.

I don't think I should be shy about Leica inability to produce reliable professional tool. My clients knows I'm a professional, and now they also know that Leica isn't. My clients are intelligent enough to make the difference.

I believe that if Leica still has any working photographers on the client list it must issue a warning and directions to avoid this from happening.

Do you want, even as amateur to change cards tomorrow morning without knowing about all of this problem, going out to shoot your family vacation and comeback without even one picture? I bet you would like Leica to tell you ahead something like "Warning: We know about camera/ card issues and recommend only to work with memory card from certain kind".

Again, please remember that the problem comes and goes. for two weeks and hundreds of frames everything is ok and than all of a sudden it's dead. Again and again and again.

Gil
 
How does this happen with such a basic function on a 7K camera in 2011? Not really acceptable... I'm not even really sure why people are ganging up on the messenger here - he's a pro and nearly had his day ruined by something that shouldn't have happened in 2011, on an expensive professional camera...
 
Count me in

Count me in

After using my M9 for two years, I had a similar experience after upgrading to the 1.162 firmware. I had a 16 GB Transcend SDHC Class 6 card rendered inoperable. Transcend also has a lifetime warranty, and the card was replaced.

I usually first format cards using the SD/SDHC standard-based formatter, and then format again after inserting the card in the M9. I hope this problems gets fixed.
 
I am stunned by the audacity some forum members have: calling out the OP as a Leica-bashing troll, when all he has done is warn others about a very serious defect with the M9 that has not been formally announced. He lost an immense amount of work and tried everything to make his two separate M9 cameras work. When he could find no fix for this problem, and even Leica told him that there was no fix (except random chance), he abandoned the system for lack of reliability.

If that isn't a completely logical and well thought out process on dealing with the situation, I don't know what is. Clearly some members here cannot get it through their thick fanboy skulls that Leica is not some perfect holy grail camera manufacturer, but actually produces flawed equipment much like many others have.
 
Actually it took Canon ages to acknowledge the 1DIII focus issue, and even longer to issue a recall. Not very clever on their part and it took Rob Galbraith's persistent Internet campaign and testing to demonstrate and prove the issue.

I've had the same memory card problem with my new M9. I was using 4GB Sandisk Ultra cards that the Leica shop in Mayfair, Uk, gave me whe. I bought the camera. Similar circumstances but not such a high pressure shoot, and the camera locked up and previously taken images were deleted.

Ive since swapped to Sandisk 8GB Extreme 3 cards which have been fault free.

I have used the 4GB Ultra cards in my 1DIV since then without problems at all, so I think the problem is definitely with the Leica software. Why Leica cant sort this out is a mystery. Seeing as no other camera I've ever had demonstrates such sensitive behaviour I'm quite stunned that such a basic and simple function isn't reliable.
 
gillavi said:
I Googled to see what other people have to say about the M9 and SanDisk SD memory cards. I found many users with the exact same problems, all suffering from it with the newer versions of SanDisk cards.

(...)

I highly recommend avoiding the Leica M9 until this problem is acknowledged and solved by SanDisk, Lexar and Leica.
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So, one buys a car, adds some pretty poorly-refined gasoline, the car sputters, and it turns out that the gasoline is just bad for the car, yet you choose to avoid buying the car instead of getting the right gasoline.

Makes sense.
 
Gabriel M.A. said:
So, one buys a car, adds some pretty poorly-refined gasoline, the car sputters, and it turns out that the gasoline is just bad for the car, yet you choose to avoid buying the car instead of getting the right gasoline.

Makes sense.
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You can not be serious!

john-mcenroe.jpg
 
Gabriel M.A. said:
So, one buys a car, adds some pretty poorly-refined gasoline, the car sputters, and it turns out that the gasoline is just bad for the car, yet you choose to avoid buying the car instead of getting the right gasoline.

Makes sense.
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It's not a problem with the cards, it's a problem with the camera. The sandisk cards are supposed to be the best card on the market too - and the m9's that are affected by this problem do it with other brands of cards as well.
 
Gabriel M.A. said:
So, one buys a car, adds some pretty poorly-refined gasoline, the car sputters, and it turns out that the gasoline is just bad for the car, yet you choose to avoid buying the car instead of getting the right gasoline.

Makes sense.
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The OP bought the most expensive leading brand memory cards from reputable sellers. Hardly ''poorly refined''.

Think about it this way. One buys, a car, fills it up with right kind of gasoline at a BP station and the car explodes. Apparently that's the way this particular car reacts when used with gasoline from some BP stations.

Blame the car manufacturer? Yes, makes total sense.
 
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