Leica SL information ...

[Godfrey]

I noticed that there is no Leica SL dedicated section on RFF forums. It seems to me there should be for a camera that's this significant to Leica's future and provides such a good bridge between Leica M, R, T, and S systems as well.

Anyway, Cal and I were sharing information relevant for his new SL over in a thread that's in the NYC group and titled for PhotoExpo 2016. I figured others in the Leica forum might find the information useful so I have copy-pasted the substance of the notes below.

G

===
Leica SL - using R lenses

The Novoflex "F" to "M" adapter stacked now provides a Leica M-lens menu, while the straight "F" to "L" adapter from Novoflex did not.

The next round of testing involves downloading the latest version of firmware to have "R" lens profiles. If my guess is correct I should be able to use my Leitax "F" mount adapter to use the current stack of adapters to mount my 50 Lux "E60" and not have to buy yet another adapter. ...

The SL offers the R lens codes if the M Adapter L is in place and whatever R to M adaptation you use is coded to simulate the R Adapter M. You definitely want to update your SL to the latest firmware release if it's still on v1.1 or v1.2 ... Many enhancements were made and the R lens profiles were updated as well. (There were a few R lens profiles in v1.2 firmware that didn't work very well.)

The R Adapter M also has the benefit of including a removable tripod mounting foot, enabling you to mount the camera on a tripod using a better balance point for the heavier R lenses.

===
Leica SL - using R lenses 2

Makes sense to me Cal. Now, how will you completely "Monsterize" it?

Looks like the R to L adapter is coming soon? Saw on FB that Leica was advertising it. So, you'll be selling the D3x?

The R Adapter L was released a few weeks ago. Stocks are somewhat short as yet, but deliveries in the UK and Europe have been happening.

That said, it's not really necessary. The R Adapter M has been available since before the SL shipped, same for the M Adapter L (T). The R Adapter M stacked onto the M Adapter L provides exactly the same R lens profiles that the R Adapter L provides. The benefits to the R Adapter L are as follows:

• Recognition and auto-selection of lens profiles for ROM-equipped R lenses.
• Less constriction in the physical mount interface, so potentially less vignetting with certain lenses and use situations. *

* With very long telephotos (280mm and longer) the M's 38mm mount diameter used with R lenses in adaptation can cause some vignetting. The R lens mount is 47mm diameter, the SL lens mount is 50mm diameter, so the R Adapter L removes this constriction. But I haven't seen it with any of my R lenses (15mm to 250mm, even with the 2x Extender-R on the 250mm), and see it just a little bit with the old Sigma 600mm f/8 mirror lens.

The other situation where the vignetting will be less is when using extreme extensions for high magnification macro work such as with the Focusing Bellows-R and Summicron-R 50mm lens set to 2.7:1 magnification. This is such a small part of my photographic endeavors that I deem it to be insignificant.​

The R Adapter L also has one restriction that the two adapter stack does not: just like Leica R8 and R9 bodies, the oldest R lenses with one- or two-cam configuration cannot be used as the cams can damage the ROM contacts. So it is three-cam, R-only, and ROM-equipped R lens compatible only. ROM lenses are automatically recognized and the proper lens code selected; for three-cam and R-only lenses, you manually assign the lens profile.

I've been using the two adapter stack with my R lenses on the SL since November 2015 when I received mine. It works brilliantly. For M lenses that are six-bit coded, the code are recognized and automatically selected, otherwise you have manual assignment and the ability to turn off the lens profiles. For R lenses, all profile assignment is manual, like like with the R Adapter L and non-ROM lenses. It's very easy to assign the lens profile menu to a button on the SL and to edit down the lens profile list (with fw2.0 and later) so you can pick from exactly the lenses you have to work with.

I use some Nikon mount lenses on my SL as well. I fit a Rayqual Nikon F to Leica M mount adapter onto the M Adapter L. I haven't found a reasonable map of Leica lens profiles to Nikkor lenses that produced good results, so I don't bother with coding them at all. The results are excellent anyway, although some of my Nikkors are eclipsed entirely by the Leica R and M lenses (of course).

The SL is a brilliant camera in every way. Of course it's not perfect, nothing ever is, but if I needed diverse capabilities and fast operation, able to use any Leica lens from M, R, S, T, and SL series, as well as adaptable to nearly any other lens system, it is the only camera I would need.

===
Leica SL Firmware Update...

Godfrey,

I'll be updating the firmware this weekend. Currently I have V. 1.2.

I'm really loving the flexibility of this body. I'm able to exploit all the glass I own in new ways, and that creativity is just that.

The Noct-Nikkor is an interesting blend and look. The VF'er is amazing.

Cal

Good. Version 2 of the SL firmware fixed several significant bugs and added a few useful features (such as editable lens profile lists, direct EC control, improved R lens profiles, etc). Version 2.1 of the SL firmware added capability to be used with Leica Image Shuttle for wired tethering control with Mac (and Windows soon) computers, and probably a few more fixes and tweaks.

===
Leica SL - Canon EF lens adapter from Novoflex

The Novoflex Canon EF to SL adapter has been available for a bit, there's a good bit of discussion regards using it on the Leica Users Forum. Its performance varies with different lenses, but most find it a good asset.

The third SL native lens is due out soon (Lux 50/1.4), all the adapters are released now. The standard and tele zooms are available.. And at their quality and build really constitute a pretty complete system already. And of course, all R and M lenses are very compatible and supported. It's not like the S rollout where everything had to be new from scratch!

 

[Calzone]

Many thanks to Godfrey for his help. I downloaded Firmware V 2.1.

I bought the Leica "R" to "M" adapter to stack onto the Leica "M: to "T" adapter following Godfrey's advice. It seems that the Novaflex "R" to "M" adapter does not come with the wonderful tripod foot, so there is value added in buying the Leica version of the adapter.

I bought the Novaflex "F" to "M" adapter to mount Nikon glass on my SL. My Noct-Nikkor is a crazy lens on this body, and nailing the focus is so easy. Know that I own a F3P that I tricked out with a DK-17 magnifier and Beattie Intensceen to optimize shooting the Noct-Nikkor, but the SL has so many focus aids to offer flexibility to nail the focus and use fast lenses wide open. I don't think I will ever use the Noct-Nikkor on the F3P ever again because the SL makes nailing the focus so easy.

I ended up returning a Novaflex straight "F" to "T" adapter because it locked me out of using any lens profiles, and all I got was "Unknown lens." Unknown lens is still an option, but I use the profile for the Noctilux F1.2 for the Noct-Nikkor. The added 8mm of focal length (58/1.2) of the Noct-Nikkor really exaggerates the shallow DOF, and while the Noctilux has two aspherical lenses, and the Noct-Nikkor only one I kinda like the rendering offered by the Noctilux F1.2 profile. Although only F1.2, I think the DOF of the Noct-Nikkor appoaches the shallow DOF of a Noctilux at F1.0 due to the slightly longer reach.

The 50 Lux-R "E60" I retrofitted to 3-cam so that it can be used on a black SL2-MOT. On the SL this lens strongly reminds me of my 75 Lux as far as rendering. The bokeh and OOF are so similar, know that this lens is not ASPH, but it is mucho sharp and detailed.

The extra heavy chrome 50 Lux-M ASPH balances very well on the SL. One of the best 50's ever made. Not much more can I say other than the best.

I feel that the SL makes it mighty easy to nail the focus repeatedly. It seems like the best body to exploit shooting wide open. Anyways it is like buying a Porshe and finding an open road where you can open up the car and find out how fast you can go. My current favorite F-stop currently is wide open for the past 6 days.

I'll be bringing the SL, the 50 Lux ASPH, the Noct-Nikkor, and the 50 "E60" to the next NYC Meet-Up on September 25th as a pre- PhotoPlusExpo event. It has only been 6 days, but I am forever changed. I love this camera.

As far as my favorite normal lens, there is no clear favorite, there are three rather distinct looks with the Noct-Nikkor being the most romantic. The 50 "E60" offers the most balanced handling, and the long focus throw when compared to a M-lens is no handicap. The 50 Lux ASPH is just an exceptional lens. The ASPH offers higher contrast, more saturated colors, and supreme resolution.

I am hoping that Leica will have a AF 50 Lux at the show. I couldn't be more excited.

Twice I froze my camera where it still operated and processed shots, but I could not turn off the camera. Like my Monochrom the only thing I could do to gain control back is perform a hard reset by removing the battery to kill the power since my off/on switch would not work.

This freezing happened twice: once with firmware 1.2; and once with firmware 2.1. The guys at the Leica Store suggested that the problem might be with my memory cards. I use Sandisk 32 GB SDII in slot one and a Sandisk 32GB SD1 in slot two. It was further suggested that my write/read speeds of my premium cards might be too high and causing the problem.

Anyways I ended up doing some fashion shooting that allowed me to fill the buffer with 33 shots, where I had to stop and allow the processor to process all the data (DNG only, no JPEG). All I can say is that I was very impressed, and know that I'm comparing the SL to a Nikon D3X as far as shooting speed. This is no ordinary camera.

On a morning shoot indoors in a beauty salon I shot 450 pictures of my fashion blogger gal getting her hair being styled by an artist, before the shop opened up as part of the fashion week. I had the 50 "E60" as my lens and shot wide open on every shot. Oh what fun...

Cal

 

[sepiareverb]

Thanks for this. The SL is a likely next step for me.

 

[Calzone]

I failed to mention that another interesting lens for the SL is my 65/3.5 silver Elmar, the Visoflex macro lens. I have the focus mount and Viso "M" to "R" adapter, and I already use this lens on my SL2-MOT.

It is a single coated Tessar, that kinda has a large image circle, has a flat field, and has a large format look to me.

Kinda crazy but three adapters are stacked: "M" to "R" Viso; "R" to "M;" and "M" to "L." I figure the 90/4.0 Macro Elmar Profile should be a pretty good match because its also a Tessar, macro, and flat field.

Looking forward to getting my Nikon 45/2.8P AIS back from Joe. I own the rarer black version so it will look great on my SL. This lens is also a simple Tessar, but it has Nikon Intergrated Coating (NIC) that makes this simple lens with few elements Nikon's most contrasty lens. The 50/2.8 Elmar profile should be a close match.

On a color camera expect deep contrast and mucho saturated colors. Also know that this is a tiny pancake lens with a very fast focus. This is a great lens to shoot at dawn and dusk patrols here in NYC. Also great for street shooting.

Anyways the SL for me, because I own so many types of glass, offers so many creative possibilities of expression. Currently and already I can use every piece of small format glass I own on one camera body. How flexible is that?

I need to get another 28/2.8 AIS, Nikon's most corrected lens, because it is compact and because it is one of the greatest 28's ever made. Bonus is that they cost "no money."

Cal

 

[Godfrey]

Good to hear you are having a good experience with the SL. I've found it an extremely competent and solid camera, able to do nearly anything I'll ever want.

I have had only one freeze with it in all the time and all the exposures I have made: when I first loaded the beta firmware that became fw 2.0. (I was on the beta testing program for fw2.0 and fw2.1/LIS 3.4.)

Others have reported slow startup times with some cards, occasionally. Nearly all, with most cards, have been solved by doing a first, deep format of the card using SD Card Formatter first. After that, faster startup times and 100% reliability seem to ensue.

I have used only two kinds of cards in the SL: Sandisk Extreme Pro 64G and Lexar Professional 1000x 128G. Absolutely, utterly reliable operation. When I have two cards in the camera, I almost always have two identical cards in the slots. (I don't bother normally ... I'm only rarely shooting for pay, and one 128G card can hold about 2000 exposures.)

G

 

[Calzone]

Good to hear you are having a good experience with the SL. I've found it an extremely competent and solid camera, able to do nearly anything I'll ever want.

I have had only one freeze with it in all the time and all the exposures I have made: when I first loaded the beta firmware that became fw 2.0. (I was on the beta testing program for fw2.0 and fw2.1/LIS 3.4.)

Others have reported slow startup times with some cards, occasionally. Nearly all, with most cards, have been solved by doing a first, deep format of the card using SD Card Formatter first. After that, faster startup times and 100% reliability seem to ensue.

I have used only two kinds of cards in the SL: Sandisk Extreme Pro 64G and Lexar Professional 1000x 128G. Absolutely, utterly reliable operation. When I have two cards in the camera, I almost always have two identical cards in the slots. (I don't bother normally ... I'm only rarely shooting for pay, and one 128G card can hold about 2000 exposures.)

G

Godfrey,

128 GB is a scary amount of data. Call me conservative, but 64 GB is still a lot of shots, and currently I'm using Sandisk Extreme Pro 32 GB SDHCII
in slot one and a 32 GB Sandisk Ultra SDHC1 in slot two as recommended by Leica. I'm running slot one=slot two for backup as I always download to view on a 27 Eizo.

The files do not disappoint.

A friend at the Leica Store in Soho mentioned that he had a similar lock up on his SL, but it only happened once to him and never again. I wonder since I bought two sets of cards if it happened to me twice because it happened once to each set of new cards. Is it possible that the SD cards have to get bedded in and after getting reformatted a few times the bug is gone? Anyways me thinks so after reading about your experience.

I purposely tried to overrun both the buffer and processor since those two lock ups (I suspect once for each set of cards), and because I always out of habit reformat all cards after downloading perhaps this one time event might not ever happen again.

It is Fashion Week and for a new camera my SL already is getting used heavily. Monday I had two intense shoots, tonight I have an event, Thursday night another, and this Saturday end of Fashion Week trunk sale/party hosted by a 21 year old retire supermodel. Anyways my Nikon D3X is no fun anymore. LOL.

Cal

 

[Godfrey]

I bought 128s because I plan to do some motion capture work. 4K video soaks up a lot of space. Even 16G does me fine for average shooting, but I see no reliability difference between them and 64-128s are more economical.

SD cards don't 'bed in', but formatting them properly, once, with SD Card Formatter seems to clean up operations and optimize them. I only rarely format cards anymore ... I just buy a new replacement when I fill one. Gives me an automatic backup. I don't shoot in the volumes that make it expensive.

 

[Calzone]

I bought 128s because I plan to do some motion capture work. 4K video soaks up a lot of space. Even 16G does me fine for average shooting, but I see no reliability difference between them and 64-128s are more economical.

SD cards don't 'bed in', but formatting them properly, once, with SD Card Formatter seems to clean up operations and optimize them. I only rarely format cards anymore ... I just buy a new replacement when I fill one. Gives me an automatic backup. I don't shoot in the volumes that make it expensive.

Godfrey,

Thanks for the clarity.

Cal

 

[Calzone]

Looks like the AF 50 Lux will be available in early 2017. One dealer is taking pre-orders. $5295.00 is the price.

The large square hood looks mighty big. LOL.

Anyway a lens that is way crazy.

Cal

 

[Godfrey]

Looks like the AF 50 Lux will be available in early 2017. One dealer is taking pre-orders. $5295.00 is the price.
The large square hood looks mighty big. LOL.
Anyway a lens that is way crazy.

And there there are the 'Cron 75/2, 'Cron 90/2, Elmar 16-35/4, and 'Cron 35/2 to follow. Looks like there will be plenty of native lenses to choose from within the next couple of years. 🙂

G

 

[Calzone]

And there there are the 'Cron 75/2, 'Cron 90/2, Elmer 16-35/4, and 'Cron 35/2 to follow. Looks like there will be plenty of native lenses to choose from within the next couple of years. 🙂

G

Godfrey,

Thanks for the info.

The 35 Cron is very interesting to me.

Cal

 

[Doug]

I’ve moved the most recent 14 posts in this thread (having to do with RFF subject organization) to a new thread here:

Rangefinderforum.com > Cameras / Gear / Photography > Rangefinder Forum > Help / Feedback forum > RFF Subject Organization
http://www.rangefinderforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=157839

Thank you, Jaap, for raising an interesting subject that will be happy in the new location!

 

[jaapv]

I’ve moved the most recent 14 posts in this thread (having to do with RFF subject organization) to a new thread here:

Rangefinderforum.com > Cameras / Gear / Photography > Rangefinder Forum > Help / Feedback forum > RFF Subject Organization
http://www.rangefinderforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=157839

Thank you, Jaap, for raising an interesting subject that will be happy in the new location!

Thanks, Doug 🙂

 

[Huss]

Looking forward to getting my Nikon 45/2.8P AIS back from Joe. I own the rarer black version so it will look great on my SL. This lens is also a simple Tessar, but it has Nikon Integrated Coating (NIC) that makes this simple lens with few elements Nikon's most contrasty lens. The 50/2.8 Elmar profile should be a close match.

On a color camera expect deep contrast and mucho saturated colors. Also this is a tiny pancake lens with a very fast focus. This is a great lens to shoot at dawn and dusk patrols here in NYC. Also great for street shooting.

Anyways the SL for me, because I own so many types of glass, offers so many creative possibilities of expression. Currently and already I can use every piece of small format glass I own on one camera body. How flexible is that?

Cal

I have that version too, in black (because I much prefer that look) and it is tiny, and on the SL would look like you just have a body cap on!
Any pics that you care to share taken with that combo Cal?

I'm getting more and more interested in the SL, exactly for the points you have made. I can shoot all the glass I have with just one camera, and very easily. Currently doing this with my M240 but it is less than ideal thanks to the mildly crappy VF2.
Also, the prices of the SL are dropping... new is $6K now from overseas.
Here at B&H it is still $7500.

 

[Calzone]

I have that version too, in black (because I much prefer that look) and it is tiny, and on the SL would look like you just have a body cap on!
Any pics that you care to share taken with that combo Cal?

I'm getting more and more interested in the SL, exactly for the points you have made. I can shoot all the glass I have with just one camera, and very easily. Currently doing this with my M240 but it is less than ideal thanks to the mildly crappy VF2.
Also, the prices of the SL are dropping... new is $6K now from overseas.
Here at B&H it is still $7500.

Huss,

I am known here as a lazy slacker, and I do many things that annoy people. One of those things is I don't post images. LOL.

I can tell you that I like the contrast and deep saturation the 45/2.8P creates, partly because it has few elements, and secondly because of the NIC coating. I find that the enhanced contrast and quick focus throw of this lens makes it a great street lens. The 45/2.8P is kinda magic shooting on my SL during the golden hour on the Westside of Madhattan.

So here is the good, the bad, and the ugly: I stack both a Leica M-T adapter along with a Leitax Nikon F-mount to "M" adapter. The lens with the stack of adapters allows me to choose the 50 Elmar profile from my "M" lens menu which I think is an asset (the 45/2.8P is a Tessar like the Elmar).

I also use the F1.2 Noctilux profile with my Noct-Nikkor with this stack of adapters.

But the rigged stack of adapters and 45/2.8 is not so small and is about the size of a Nikon 28/2.8 AIS overall. Still small, but not so tiny. I would buy a 28/2.8 AIS to use on my SL, but I already own a 28 Cron...

For me the best kept secrete is "R" glass. My 50 Lux "E60" is a wonderfully smooth and sharp lens. At a NYC Meet-Up my friend Joe had the earlier version Lux and we compared the two lenses V1 VS V2, and I can tell you the V1 is no slouch and rivaled in sharpness.

It took a discerning eye to see/notice a tiny bit of more sharpness on the "E60" but perhaps the V1 had a bit smoother rendering. These lenses both were wonderful, but the rendering was different. Perhaps the V1 had more saturated colors. While the E60 rendered more detail in terms of resolution, it seemed the V1 rendered more detail in tone.

Owning a Noct-Nikkor is a challenge, and although this lens renders beautifully, has this amazing bokeh that looks so large format, the hit ratio is not so high when shooting wide open on other cameras. The SL is a game-changer here and it is pretty easy to nail the focus and be a sniper.

The M240 is a great camera, but the files are only 12-bit, and the 14-bit files of a SL from the Maestro processor are so clean. IMHO 48 MB more data adds a lot to dynamic range and shadow detail.

I saw you have seen what ChrisR did covering a Rugby match. Also these files print so well. Lately I am astounded by the high ISO performance in my printing...

I feel I am a lucky guy because I secured a 35 Lux-R 3-Cam and a 50 Lux-R "E60." It almost seems like the SL loves the SLR glass the best, but Leica M-body wides kill on the SL.

The processor borrowed from the Leica "S" is a real asset and a lot speedier than any M except for perhaps the M10. Really makes a huge difference. My old Monochrom feels so primitive (I know it is) that it is almost like shooting a film camera.

I saw a SL being offered with a Leica warranty at PopFlash for $5.9K boxed.

Cal

 

[Huss]

Cal, for a lazy slacker that's an intensive post. It would have been easier to post a pic!
😉

Thanks for the detailed info, much appreciated.

p.s. doesn't double stacking adapters prevent infinity focus? And by that, doesn't it also allow you to focus much closer than normal?

 

[Calzone]

Cal, for a lazy slacker that's an intensive post. It would have been easier to post a pic!
😉

Thanks for the detailed info, much appreciated.

p.s. doesn't double stacking adapters prevent infinity focus? And by that, doesn't it also allow you to focus much closer than normal?

Huss,

I think you understand my slacker ways. Kinda crazy, but that's me. LOL.

The stacking does allow for additional flexability. Not only am I a lazy slacker, but I am also a clever slacker.

I found out one of the benefits of stacking the Novaflex F-mount to the Leica "M" mount is that I get the "M" mount profiles. If I go with the straight Novaflex F-Mount to "T" adaper I end up being profileless. Anyways I discovered all of this because I could exploit B&H as a source of adapters and enjoy their unconditional return policy. In the end I was able to secure a used Novaflex F-T adapter at B&H used.

In one of my stackings I mount a silver 65 Elmar, a Visoflex lens via a Leica Viso to "R" mount; a Leica "R" mount to "M" Mount; and a Leica "M" mount to "T" mount. Yes a triple stack of Leica adapters, and infinity focus intact.

Anyways you might wonder why I might do this other than to annoy people: one answer is that this 65 Elmar is a macro lens; another reason is because it is single coated. Originally I bought the 65 Elmar to use on a Beoon, but I tried it out on my SL and I like it. Anyways because it is unusual it kinda is my style. LOL.

It does seem that the SL offers crazy possibilities, and I have not found a lens that is not interesting on this camera, including a black 28 Canon LTM, 38/1.8 Nikkor in LTM, but the Pentax-L 43/1.9 kinda has ugly fringing.

I went to an event at th Leica Store SoHo and John the Leica "S" and SL spcialist gave a demonstration of Leica "S" glass on the SL. I kinda wondered why anyone would do that, but when you see the tethered results I have to say the "S" glass crushes all my M and R glass. More resolution, more shadow detail, smoother highlights, and more dynamic range. Not unlike medium format digital and perhaps a half step to a Leica "S." Anyways the files that were We Transfered to me, portraits of me, were kinda crazy.

Anyways, crazy is good.

Cal

 

[Huss]

Yowza thanks for the info Cal. You're not helping...
😉

Best regards
Huss

 

[Godfrey]

It's come time to do my camera rationalization. There is way WAY too much gear in my closet—I have a tonne of gear to sell or trade. I want to end up with my favorite M, digital and film, and the SL. The right mix of lenses and accessories for both, for my uses. A couple of Polaroids. And the Hasselblad SWC.

All this past week I've been considering the first move. I think it's going to be 'trade M-P, X, CL, and long R lenses for the SL90-280 lens.' The big SL zoom with its AF and OIS features nets the biggest advantage in one jump over the traded bits that will go for it. There will be less gear to store and maintain in the closet, and fewer choices (distractions) to work through when deciding what gear to use.

I'll set the deal up tomorrow with my Leica dealer.

onwards! ever onwards!
G

 

[icebear]

G, go for it! Sounds a little bit like spring cleaning.😉